Ubuntu Wiki

   1 IRC meeting on 02/09/2009
   2 (21:00:00) #ubuntu-be: Le sujet de #ubuntu-be est : http://ubuntu-be.org | get support at #ubuntu-nl, #ubuntu-fr, #ubuntu-de, #ubuntu | IRC meeting on Wednesday 2009-09-02 at 21h (UTC+2), see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BelgianTeam/IrcMeetings for agenda and more information
   3 (21:03:44) jean7491: Hello everybody, who is here for the meeting?
   4 (21:03:51) JanC: o/
   5 (21:03:51) willem7 [n=willem@d54C5A9F0.access.telenet.be] a rejoint le
   6 salon.
   7 (21:04:09) mimor: I am
   8 (21:04:15) mimor: (almost forgot about it)
   9 (21:04:17) kws: I'm just here for the details regarding the dipro event
  10 (21:04:25) kws: still working  :( 
  11 (21:04:33) JanC: kws = ?
  12 (21:04:44) kws: kenneth westelinck aja  :) 
  13 (21:05:03) jean7491: ;-)kws
  14 (21:05:20) Wamukota: oke
  15 (21:05:54) JanC: voor de duidelijkheid, je hebt je echte naam ook niet
  16 in whois en zo   ;) 
  17 (21:06:33) kws: ik ben maar nen simpele java developer hé  ;) 
  18 (21:06:38) kws: neen dus
  19 (21:07:46) willem7: hallo, IRC is totaal nieuw voor mij, maar ik hoop
  20 evt. vragen i.v.m. de Software Freedom Day te kunnen beantwoorden
  21 (21:08:23) jean7491: hfsdo, Gh0sty, nero1? welcome willem7
  22 (21:09:27) jean7491: Lets'start with the topic #1 Future events (September)
  23 (21:10:28) jean7491: 06/09 Dipro Ghent, Matthew has the lead, and i
  24 think everything is going well
  25 (21:11:04) Gh0sty: *ack*
  26 (21:11:33) kws: juist, ik moet nog om dat scherm
  27 (21:11:53) kws: zal voor zaterdag zijn
  28 (21:12:16) jean7491: did you had contact with guy?
  29 (21:12:34) kws: not yet, is a very busy workweek here  :( 
  30 (21:12:44) kws: I'll call him tomorrow
  31 (21:12:55) jean7491: or perhaps just a mail
  32 (21:13:04) jean7491: up to you
  33 (21:13:12) kws: now that's an idea  :) 
  34 (21:13:54) jean7491: Matthew is ready for an irc coordination tomorrow
  35 at 21 h. (if needed)
  36 (21:14:41) kws: yes, I know, but hopefully I will be very drunk then
  37 attending a BBQ  :) 
  38 (21:15:03) jean7491:  ;-) 
  39 (21:15:18) jean7491: if no other point, going to 13/09 dipro in antwerp
  40 (21:17:05) jean7491: the team and the organization are ok, i don't
  41 expect problem (cross your fingers), question for a'pen?
  42 (21:17:40) koentje [i=5bb6bd9c@gateway/web/freenode/x-mckkfimsyjqtarau]
  43 a rejoint le salon.
  44 (21:19:00) JanC: jean7491: any of my equipment needed for Antwerp?
  45 (21:20:36) mimor: apparently not  :) 
  46 (21:20:54) jean7491: no, perhaps a few cd's and pen's, hardware is ok,
  47 there still the problem of hanging/support for posters, but no solution ...
  48 (21:21:17) jean7491: but i will find a way ...
  49 (21:21:58) jean7491: next events: for the we 19-20/09, we have more to
  50 do with 2 activities (accenta2009 in ghent) and hcc vlaanderen open door
  51 + sfd in wezembeek oppem
  52 (21:22:01) JanC: if we're along a wall that's no issue  ツ
  53 (21:22:12) jean7491:  ;-) 
  54 (21:22:34) jean7491: let's start with wezembeek oppem
  55 (21:23:04) willem7: any questions regarding accomodation?
  56 (21:23:14) JanC: willem7 = Willem Huysmans of HCC Vlaanderen
  57 (21:23:53) mimor: JanC, I could get a ride from you right?
  58 (21:24:16) jean7491: yes willem! ± the same as dipro booth: 4 people,
  59 2 tables, hardware, decoratie, promo material. mimor wait!
  60 (21:24:19) JanC: mimor: if you don't want to be at Accenta instead?
  61 (21:24:28) mimor: oh righ ><
  62 (21:24:35) mimor: Overlooked the dates  :( 
  63 (21:24:53) jean7491: don't forget martine!
  64 (21:25:03) JanC: I expect 2-4 volunteers for SFD
  65 (21:25:17) mimor: jean7491, I don't  :) 
  66 (21:25:18) JanC: # tables depends on their size and available space  ツ
  67 (21:25:56) JanC: willem7: are tables decorated or do we need to bring
  68 something ourselves?
  69 (21:28:00) willem7: we have ? 7 dark blue clothes 2 x 2.8 m
  70 (21:28:15) willem7: we also received some promotional stuff (mainly
  71 ubuntu cd's) from the SFD organisation
  72 (21:28:55) jean7491: and how many tables for your open door : more than 7?
  73 (21:30:10) willem7: I'll arrange two decorated tables for ubuntu-be
  74 (21:30:22) JanC: willem7: any other organisations that will have a stand?
  75 (21:30:30) jean7491: :)thanks
  76 (21:31:21) willem7: anyone suggestions for organisations and/or
  77 communities we can ask?
  78 (21:32:49) JanC: willem7: did you contact gnome-nl, kde-nl, ooo-nl,
  79 mozilla-nl, wikipedia-nl, python-nl, debian-nl, mandriva-nl, fedora-nl,
  80 etc.?  ツ
  81 (21:34:10) willem7: tomorrow i will raise a press release (and contact
  82 these organisations)
  83 (21:34:10) JanC: and maybe flemish lugs + bxlug (is bilingual I think?)
  84 (21:34:50) willem7: i think there is another SFD event in BXL
  85 (21:35:13) JanC: ah, right, by bxlug, I forgot  :P
  86 (21:35:21) jean7491: posters: willem7, do you have special posters
  87 sfd?     i suggest we prepare an ubuntu-be - sfd poster (to be printed
  88 in a few ex. (Wamukota!)
  89 (21:35:58) Wamukota: no props for printing posters
  90 (21:36:30) willem7: If someone has some pdf or odf, I can print A3
  91 (21:36:52) jean7491: Wamukota : props=problems?
  92 (21:37:15) Wamukota: yup no problem for printing posters up to size A0
  93 (21:37:55) jean7491: thanks willem7, we have the ressource for printing
  94 (21:39:18) jean7491: willem7 are you expecting french-speaking visitors?
  95 we could put some promotion material in french? posters and flyers
  96 (21:39:53) JanC: it's "HCC Vlaanderen", so probably not many?
  97 (21:40:04) kws a quitté le salon
  98 (21:40:34) JanC: OTOH, Wezembeek-Oppem has a lot of people from the EU
  99 who speak French, German, English, etc. ツ
 100 (21:41:14) willem7: some of our visitors in Wezembeek are French
 101 speaking, but presentations are always Dutch
 102 (21:41:39) JanC: willem7: I think it's a bit late to contact the
 103 organisations I listed, but _maybe_ some of them can send someone
 104 (21:43:15) jean7491: of course most will be in dutch,        ... but we
 105 could put some material in french (and eventually english) (german is
 106 more difficult but possible)
 107 (21:45:01) jean7491: JanC, willem7, other questions for Wez. opp. ?
 108 (21:45:20) JanC: there is a German school in Wezembeek, but I have no
 109 idea how open that community is  ツ
 110 (21:45:52) JanC: I will ask questions to willem7 via mail if needed (and
 111 he can mail me too)
 112 (21:45:59) willem7: evnet starts at 14.00u - at what time does everybody
 113 arrive?
 114 (21:46:23) JanC: you mean our people?
 115 (21:46:52) willem7: do you need time for setup
 116 (21:47:23) jean7491: for dipro fair, we need 1 hour set-up, i suppose it
 117 wil be the same? JanC?
 118 (21:47:54) JanC: well, 30min at least, but if it's difficult, we can
 119 start that at 14h too...
 120 (21:47:54) willem7: for me OK, thx
 121 (21:48:37) JanC: willem7: will you be there before 14h?
 122 (21:49:04) willem7: people from the organisation will be there before 13.00u
 123 (21:49:29) Carroarmato0_
 124 [n=Carroarm@211.205-246-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] a rejoint le salon.
 125 (21:49:55) JanC: okay, if we're a bit early, we can always help you a
 126 bit  ツ
 127 (21:50:16) willem7: thanks
 128 (21:50:47) jean7491: ok, next event :   19-20/09 Accenta 2009 fair Ghent  
 129 (21:52:20) jean7491: after contact with the organisator (digipolis), we
 130 will use approx. the same set-up as for dipro fairs ...
 131 (21:53:35) jean7491: about volunteers, we need (minimum) 2 x 4
 132 volunteers, as we can not expect volunteers working 2 days in the we!
 133 (21:54:44) jean7491: via mimor, i am asking more details about the
 134 location and set-up of the booth
 135 (21:55:14) Gh0sty: too bad, just the wrong weekend for me ...
 136 (21:55:25) Gh0sty: i was willing to do 2 days etc but not that weekend :x
 137 (21:55:29) mimor: How many people are already volunteering?
 138 (21:55:52) Carroarmato0 a quitté le salon (quit: Read error: 60
 139 (Operation timed out))
 140 (21:56:10) jean7491: we certainly need to do more for a correct
 141 presentation of the booth --- Gh0sty: indeed the wrong we!
 142 (21:57:14) jean7491: about volunteers, i will come 1 day, pieter 1 or 2
 143 days, we will see for others (mimor, kws?) ...
 144 (21:57:42) mimor: I'll be there
 145 (21:57:44) Carroarmato0_ est désormais connu sous le nom de Carroarmato0
 146 (21:57:44) Gh0sty: man
 147 (21:57:48) Gh0sty: could come that sunday
 148 (21:57:58) Gh0sty: but that would mean i cant go out till 6am :p
 149 (21:58:04) Gh0sty: difficulties :p
 150 (21:58:27) mimor: If people want free-tickets to have their
 151 family/friends pay us a visit: I have 2  ;) 
 152 (21:59:07) Gh0sty: I actually wanted to come to keep the booth open and
 153 go visit also at a point in time when the booth isnt so busy ... :p
 154 (21:59:25) jean7491: Gh0sty why not? it is better for your health !
 155 ;-)you are welcome
 156 (21:59:32) Gh0sty: but on saturday is a nono and on sunday is a
 157 *hangover possible* nono :p
 158 (22:00:15) jean7491: if we have enough personal, it is of course
 159 possible to visit the fair
 160 (22:00:57) Gh0sty: hmmm finish partying at 6 am, do an afterparty, be
 161 there at 10am :p
 162 (22:01:02) Gh0sty: make it a 24h :p
 163 (22:01:26) Gh0sty: :o)
 164 (22:01:42) jean7491: Gh0sty, you will see!!!  for mimor, an additional
 165 problem is the security of the material during the night
 166 (22:02:06) JanC: laptop locks might help
 167 (22:02:22) mimor: Or you could store them at my place?
 168 (22:02:24) JanC: jean7491: no security from the event?
 169 (22:02:45) JanC: mimor: maybe you know that better (my last question)
 170 (22:03:45) jean7491: i suppose there is a security, ask to martine ( i
 171 am not speaking about laptops, but the rest) ?
 172 (22:03:56) mimor: I'll ask her
 173 (22:03:57) mimor:  :) 
 174 (22:04:15) jean7491: pc, screen? deco, ...
 175 (22:04:47) JanC: screens can maybe be secured with kensington lock too?
 176 (22:04:57) mimor: I'll ask martine
 177 (22:06:04) JanC: I'm pretty sure there will be a security company at night
 178 (22:06:31) mimor: I guess so
 179 (22:06:47) mimor: but it would be nice to be sure for sure to be sure  ;) 
 180 (22:06:54) jean7491: with our experience of dipro fair, i think it is
 181 possible to participate to accenta, just the security and hand-over of
 182 the booth between 2 partially different teams  - i am optimistic, ...
 183 yes, we can!
 184 (22:07:45) jean7491: other question for accenta? i will prepare the
 185 wiki-page
 186 (22:09:20) jean7491: 19/09 is also the sfd: in accenta, we can add
 187 something for the sfd
 188 (22:09:37) jean7491: for example an ad-hoc poster
 189 (22:10:51) jean7491: ok let's go to the last event (in September) 27/09
 190 Hasselt (bbartek?)
 191 (22:12:42) jean7491: I proposed to fabian (BitMappers) Ubuntu-be helping
 192 with 2-3 people in their booth at dipro hasselt.
 193 (22:12:57) jean7491: i am waiting for the answer
 194 (22:13:24) mimor:  :) 
 195 (22:13:34) jean7491: i already sent posters they asked for this we in
 196 hasselt
 197 (22:14:07) jean7491: is bbartek online?
 198 (22:14:47) jean7491: apparently not hearing
 199 (22:15:20) mimor: bbartek = idle 00:35:53
 200 (22:15:45) jean7491: ok, let"s go to the next topic #3 Promotion
 201 material New posters and flyers
 202 (22:16:51) jean7491: New posters and flyers are ordered and delivery
 203 forseen for friday, just on time for dipro ghent
 204 (22:17:33) mimor: I have to say, jean, you can be rpoud of it ....
 205 http://www.google.be/search?q=ubuntu+promotion+material&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=com.ubuntu:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
 206 (22:18:58) jean7491: ;-)8-)
 207 (22:19:32) Wamukota: gents, i'm off. I have to walk the dogs ... in the
 208 rain  :-( 
 209 (22:19:39) Wamukota: cu later
 210 (22:19:56) jean7491: i will post something in the mailing list about
 211 selling posters, bye Wamukota
 212 (22:20:05) Wamukota: bye
 213 (22:20:08) Wamukota a quitté le salon (quit: "Ik ga weg")
 214 (22:20:36) jean7491: other question on this topic?
 215 (22:20:54) mimor: jean7491, next time we can just use
 216 http://spreadubuntu.neomenlo.org/
 217 (22:21:06) mimor: if you don't feel like making new ones at least
 218 (22:21:07) mimor:  :) 
 219 (22:22:08) JanC: mimor: it's based on one from there
 220 (22:22:17) mimor: :D
 221 (22:22:20) mimor: I just saw ><
 222 (22:22:22) JanC: needs translation etc. anyway
 223 (22:22:34) jean7491: i already posted things in spreadubuntu, have a
 224 look in the dutch material
 225 (22:23:10) jean7491: posters, flyers, presentation (dutch and french)! ...
 226 (22:23:46) dieter_ [n=dieter@ip-83-134-183-233.dsl.scarlet.be] a rejoint
 227 le salon.
 228 (22:24:08) jean7491: hey dieter
 229 (22:24:16) dieter_: hellow
 230 (22:24:24) dieter_: was die IRC meeting nu vandaag of morgen?
 231 (22:24:34) dieter_: als die vandaag was, heb ik die gemist veronderstel
 232 ik :o
 233 (22:24:36) dieter_:  :) 
 234 (22:24:47) mimor: of een deel dieter_
 235 (22:24:49) mimor:  :) 
 236 (22:24:52) mimor: still ongoing
 237 (22:25:00) mimor: almos the end
 238 (22:25:01) mimor: :p
 239 (22:25:03) jean7491: vandaag de normaal meeting, morgen voor dipro gent
 240 (22:25:13) mimor: maar de log komt op de wiki page
 241 (22:25:15) dieter_: ah, ok, morgen is dus het belangrijkst voor me  :) 
 242 (22:25:36) jean7491: :)but you are welcome !
 243 (22:25:37) dieter_: dan ga ik nu weer slapen, want morgen moet ik al om
 244 5 u opstaan  ;) 
 245 (22:25:50) jean7491:  ;-) 
 246 (22:25:55) dieter_: tot morgen!
 247 (22:26:24) jean7491: ok next topic #3 Things living in the mailing list
 248 (mimor wrote it!)
 249 (22:26:26) mimor: jupjup cu morgen dieter_
 250 (22:26:35) mimor: ow right  :) 
 251 (22:26:38) dieter_ a quitté le salon (quit: Client Quit)
 252 (22:26:59) mimor: I did a slight copy from the mailing list to the wiki page
 253 (22:27:08) mimor: let me grab the wiki page first
 254 (22:27:22) jean7491: 1st point -- Participation to IRC meetings
 255 (22:27:22) jean7491:  
 256 (22:27:51) jean7491: how can we have more people participating?
 257 (22:28:09) jean7491: any suggestion?
 258 (22:28:46) mimor: I cant find the wiki page?
 259 (22:29:22) mimor: k I found it ><
 260 (22:29:38) jean7491: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BelgianTeam/IrcMeetings
 261 (22:29:51) mimor: I suggest writing a simple how-to to reach the meeting
 262 (22:30:43) mimor: Another problem is, there are a lot of people ignoring
 263 the mails from the mailing list I guess
 264 (22:31:19) jean7491: 1 additional paragraph in the wiki page about irc
 265 meetings?
 266 (22:31:59) jean7491: paragraph explaining how-to to reach the irc meeting
 267 (22:32:01) mimor: I was planning to write a howto for my blog after I
 268 read someone in the mailing list that he didn't know how to get here
 269 (22:32:13) mimor: we can then just coppy it to the wiki page  ;) 
 270 (22:32:28) mimor: I'll try to write it tonight
 271 (22:32:52) jean7491: ok, short and readable for non-experts!
 272 (22:33:08) mimor: I'll cover Xchat and IRSSI
 273 (22:33:18) mimor: Xchat should be enough for the wiki I gues
 274 (22:33:36) jean7491: and pidgin (i use it)
 275 (22:33:54) mimor: U use pidgin for IRC?
 276 (22:34:07) mimor: ok, will do  ;) 
 277 (22:34:09) JanC: there is a web chat on webchat.freenode.net too
 278 (22:34:59) willem7: community chat on ubuntu.be did not work for me?
 279 (22:35:00) jean7491: i use pidgin for irc!
 280 (22:35:18) mimor: I'll write the short how-to  ;) 
 281 (22:35:25) mimor: pidgin and xchat it is!
 282 (22:35:54) JanC: willem7: we need to replace it, the old webchat doesn't
 283 work anymore
 284 (22:36:35) jean7491: there is a bug report on this
 285 (22:36:41) mimor: This'll give me the chance to use
 286 http://www.mozilla.org/projects/rt-messaging/chatzilla/irc-urls.html
 287 (22:37:29) willem7: I'll never install/use a chat program, and I think
 288 I'm not the only one - tonight using: http://java.freenode.net/
 289 (22:38:50) jean7491: other suggestions on the point how can we have more
 290 people participating to irc meetings?
 291 (22:39:59) jean7491: Next point : do we need a forum for ubuntu-be? why?
 292 (22:40:56) mimor: Connections via mibbit are no longer supported on
 293 freenode. You may wish to consider using http://webchat.freenode.net
 294 instead. Further information over at http://bit.ly/19JILF
 295 (22:41:10) JanC: willem7: everybody who installs Ubuntu already has a
 296 chat-program installed  ツ
 297 (22:42:16) jean7491: waiting for the next point!
 298 (22:42:39) JanC: jean7491: IMO we don't need a forum, and I'd like to
 299 see some strong reasons to add an additional communication channel...
 300 (22:43:04) JanC: s/to/before we/
 301 (22:43:18) willem7: JanC: for one time use at ubuntu-be?
 302 (22:43:23) JanC: I mean, by people who do more than only complain   ;) 
 303 (22:43:39) bbartek a quitté le salon (quit: "Ik ga weg")
 304 (22:44:16) JanC: willem7: obviously I don't know what operating system
 305 you run   ;) 
 306 (22:46:35) mimor: I think a forum would be nice
 307 (22:46:54) JanC: mimor: but why ?
 308 (22:46:56) mimor: but don't we already have ubuntu-nl forum and the
 309 section on the ubuntuforums.org?
 310 (22:46:57) willem7: JanC: typing on XP and on my desk a netbook with UNR
 311 and a notebook with Ubuntu (dualboot W7 RTM)
 312 (22:48:17) mimor: ²bn       
 313 ²))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))<
 314 (22:48:25) mimor: sorry... that was my cat
 315 (22:48:54) mimor: I think a forum would be nice for those who're not
 316 familiar with irc
 317 (22:49:07) JanC: mimor: they can use the mailing list...
 318 (22:49:18) mimor: and the people that are not familiar with the
 319 mailinglist  ;) 
 320 (22:49:29) mimor: as I said, most people don't watch the mailing
 321 (22:49:35) mimor: there are too many different things
 322 (22:49:47) mimor: they're just not interested as it takes too much time
 323 (22:50:00) JanC: adding a forum to the mailing list only means there are
 324 even more things
 325 (22:50:08) JanC: that's not a solution
 326 (22:50:33) JanC: and reading mail takes less time than reading a forum
 327 (22:50:45) mimor: But I guess a forum could be more attractive than both
 328 the mailinglist and IRC together for quite a lot of people
 329 (22:50:55) willem7: agree
 330 (22:51:01) jean7491: a forum would be nice? it is nice, but why an
 331 ubuntu-be forum? are people more familar with a lot of topics like
 332 ubuntu-nl forum? it is more complicated to follow what is ongoing?
 333 (22:51:38) mimor: the nice thing about a forum is that you can
 334 categorise stuff as sticky
 335 (22:52:01) jean7491: who "you" ?
 336 (22:52:02) willem7: and a forum at ubuntuforums.org (LoCo team)?
 337 (22:52:06) mimor: or put them in categories such as meetings, news,
 338 council  ;) , etc ...
 339 (22:52:18) JanC: mimor: we need IRC to do "immediate response meetings"
 340 (at least those of us who are active in organising things need it)
 341 (22:52:36) mimor: Indeed, but those active are not my problem
 342 (22:52:46) mimor: it are the other 390 members ><
 343 (22:53:31) JanC: mimor: you can categorize stuff with mail too, with the
 344 advantage that you can choose your own categories  ;) 
 345 (22:54:01) mimor: ok, but that's for people like us
 346 (22:54:04) mimor: that know the system
 347 (22:54:04) JanC: actually, we can add "topics" to the ML software and
 348 people can then subscribe to only some topics
 349 (22:54:15) mimor: that's one idea
 350 (22:54:24) mimor: Suse has the same system
 351 (22:54:43) JanC: it only works if people use the topics though  ツ
 352 (22:54:50) mimor: but the problem is, as it was for me years ago, there
 353 is too much information on it, rendering people uninterested in all subjects
 354 (22:55:48) JanC: "too much" = 20 mails on a very active day, maybe 1 on
 355 an average day?
 356 (22:56:16) JanC: let's subscribe them to LKML and see what is really
 357 "too much"   ;) 
 358 (22:56:38) JanC: like, > 1000 mails/day on a busy day  :P
 359 (22:56:58) JanC: anyway, people don't need to read all mails
 360 (22:57:45) mimor: sorry
 361 (22:57:46) mimor:  :) 
 362 (22:58:03) jean7491: problem in the mailing list is perhaps the use of a
 363 correct subject 'thread) for the mails?
 364 (22:58:16) JanC: jean7491: of course that helps a lot
 365 (22:58:18) mimor: I know, but they see the number next to the forlder...
 366 and they just hit "mark them all as read"'
 367 (22:58:45) JanC: mimor: that's their problem then, and those people
 368 won't read the forum either
 369 (22:58:58) mimor: having a subject start with [subject] blablabla will
 370 probably raise more awareness
 371 (22:59:04) JanC: or they can read the mailing list through a web
 372 interface...
 373 (22:59:20) JanC: (if they are masochists)
 374 (22:59:21) mimor: its just not the same
 375 (22:59:29) mimor: for me, IRC on its own is fine
 376 (22:59:38) mimor: I don't need a mailingllist neither
 377 (22:59:41) mimor:  :) 
 378 (22:59:55) JanC: mailing lists are easily searchable
 379 (23:00:04) JanC: IRC isn't
 380 (23:00:05) mimor: but if you guys are against, we'll let it is
 381 (23:00:07) mimor: (for now)
 382 (23:00:55) mimor: I just don't get it, people on the ML were whining
 383 about the forum stuff... and now I'm like the only one asking for one :P
 384 (23:01:05) JanC: well, most people who complain about having a forum
 385 have never done anything for ubuntu-be except complaining about having a
 386 forum   ;) 
 387 (23:01:14) mimor: If there was a forum, there would be more people
 388 responsive  ;)  :D
 389 (23:01:21) mimor: *responses
 390 (23:01:46) JanC: mimor: if they can complain about forums on the list,
 391 they can be helpful too
 392 (23:02:02) JanC: most of them certainly aren't
 393 (23:02:50) mimor: vace the real world... it's all about complaining :D
 394 only a few good-hearted people like you guys (and me, somethimes) see
 395 the beauty  :) 
 396 (23:03:02) JanC: look at it like this: adding a forum means more work
 397 for those who are active, so we need to be sure that that cost has
 398 enough benefits IMO
 399 (23:03:34) mimor: you have a point
 400 (23:03:35) mimor:  :) 
 401 (23:04:04) jean7491: i conclude : this is not enough argumentation about
 402 the need of a forum, we see later at another meeting
 403 (23:04:10) mimor: but somethimes it's hard to search for new members...
 404 if our own group doesn't support us  :( 
 405 (23:04:34) mimor: I've already send an email to the mailing, asking
 406 where they all are  :) 
 407 (23:04:54) mimor: so that's a nice conclusion jean7491
 408 (23:05:02) JanC: I don't care most people on the list are lurkers
 409 (23:05:29) JanC: I'm a lurker on LKML too   ;) 
 410 (23:05:36) mimor: what's lkml?
 411 (23:05:44) JanC: Linux Kernel Mailing List
 412 (23:05:44) mimor: kernel management?
 413 (23:05:53) JanC: kernel devs  ツ
 414 (23:06:01) mimor: heavy  :) 
 415 (23:06:14) jean7491:  :)  so we go to the next point about Organization of
 416 the Belgian LoCo Team   :) 
 417 (23:06:32) mimor: jes
 418 (23:06:36) mimor: *yes
 419 (23:06:43) mimor: council?
 420 (23:06:44) mimor:  :) 
 421 (23:07:03) mimor est désormais connu sous le nom de sir_mimor
 422 (23:07:04) jean7491: there is still the proposal
 423 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BelgianTeam/TeamOrganization
 424 (23:07:05) sir_mimor: :D
 425 (23:07:14) sir_mimor: now I can be in the council :D
 426 (23:07:22) sir_mimor est désormais connu sous le nom de mimor
 427 (23:07:49) mimor: what are the pro's and what are the con's?
 428 (23:08:07) mimor: I guess the way jean7491 wrote the base down is
 429 actually nice
 430 (23:08:29) mimor: we can have a branched organigram
 431 (23:09:36) jean7491: as it is difficult to be active everywhere all the
 432 time, and as there is a "limited" interest for the topic, i give
 433 priority to the organization of events and will come back later on this!
 434 (23:09:40) nero2 [n=nero@62.235.128.51] a rejoint le salon.
 435 (23:10:01) mimor: ok
 436 (23:10:20) mimor: I've got the picture of JanC 's idea on the topic from
 437 the mailing list
 438 (23:11:24) koentje a quitté le salon (quit: Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
 439 (23:11:33) mimor: hello?
 440 (23:11:36) JanC: I'll add some comments to the wiki after the meeting
 441 (23:11:49) mimor: JanC, jean7491 can you guys still read me?
 442 (23:11:55) JanC: yes
 443 (23:11:57) mimor: I'm not sure, as I changed my nick
 444 (23:11:59) JanC: mimor: yes
 445 (23:12:01) mimor: owkey  :) 
 446 (23:12:02) mimor: thx
 447 (23:12:14) jean7491: mimor, now ok,    of course the wiki is open for
 448 comments
 449 (23:13:03) Indra6oc [n=indra@213.219.149.138.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] a
 450 rejoint le salon.
 451 (23:13:12) mimor: there are 2 differend, but close, toppics... the
 452 forming of some kind of VZW (or searching for something already
 453 existing) and the organisation of Ubuntu-be
 454 (23:13:42) Indra6oc: aloha, hi all  :) 
 455 (23:13:52) mimor: hi Indra6oc
 456 (23:13:54) koentje [i=5bb6a6b5@gateway/web/freenode/x-epgvmtcbntogenwe]
 457 a rejoint le salon.
 458 (23:14:02) jean7491: i will not launch the subject "organuzation" in the
 459 mailing list as there are too many non coherent reactions
 460 (23:14:04) JanC: currently I'm opposed to setting up a vzw, but not
 461 opposed to more structure
 462 (23:14:14) jean7491: hey Indra6oc
 463 (23:14:29) JanC: Indra6oc: kom jij naar dipro Gent?
 464 (23:14:40) Indra6oc: hi jean7491, mimor and JanC
 465 (23:14:41) mimor: In my opinion, a VZW doesn't solve the structure problems
 466 (23:14:59) willem7 a quitté le salon (quit: Read error: 104 (Connection
 467 reset by peer))
 468 (23:15:03) JanC: mimor: exactly (been there, done that, got the T-shirt  ;)  )
 469 (23:15:18) nightrid3r: in my opinion a VZW will create even more
 470 problems at the moment
 471 (23:15:18) mimor: the T-schirt?
 472 (23:15:28) mimor: jup
 473 (23:15:33) Indra6oc: hehe ja den dipro, waneer is da weer?
 474 (23:15:42) willem7 [n=willem@d54C5A9F0.access.telenet.be] a rejoint le
 475 salon.
 476 (23:15:48) JanC: Indra6oc: nu zondag
 477 (23:15:51) mimor: and for a VZW there need some people to be put in
 478 places where they can be held 'responsible'
 479 (23:16:01) Indra6oc: oops, goeie vraag dan  :) 
 480 (23:16:02) mimor: guess that'll be hard to find volunteers for  :) 
 481 (23:16:21) JanC: Indra6oc: als je komt, breng dan die doek mee  ツ
 482 (23:16:27) jean7491: imho, there are 2 steps for ubuntu-be better work :
 483 1. a better organization, and 2. a formalization via a vzw (eventually)
 484 (23:17:12) jean7491: there is no sense to start with the step 2 if the
 485 step 1 is not fullfilled
 486 (23:17:37) mimor: agreed
 487 (23:17:39) Indra6oc: ziet er naar uit da de zondag ni echt veel opening
 488 meer heeft  O:-) 
 489 (23:17:46) mimor: JanC, what tshirt?
 490 (23:18:07) JanC: mimor: it's an expression in English   ;) 
 491 (23:18:19) mimor: llink to image?
 492 (23:18:54) jean7491: and to start with the step 1., we need to gather
 493 people who are willing to work on this, and not in the mailing list
 494 (23:19:24) mimor: As I see it... like it is in the current draf...
 495 compared with the active community
 496 (23:19:46) mimor: there will be the active people in the council ...
 497 who'm will also be in the sub-groups...
 498 (23:19:48) mimor:  :) 
 499 (23:19:52) JanC: jean7491: you mean IRL meeting?
 500 (23:20:02) mimor: it'll be like give ourselves a title  :) 
 501 (23:20:19) JanC: IRL = in real life
 502 (23:20:38) mimor: DLVV
 503 (23:20:47) jean7491: we certainly need irl meeting, but fist think about
 504 the problem
 505 (23:20:52) mimor: Dans La Vrai Vie ><
 506 (23:22:12) mimor: we can think together during a drinking-event
 507 (23:22:22) mimor: (we might give the event another name)
 508 (23:22:39) mimor: a be-social-event or something
 509 (23:22:39) nightrid3r: think + drink = mother of bad idea's
 510 (23:22:40) jean7491: perhaps via contacts between us during the events
 511 we could progress with ideas
 512 (23:22:45) Indra6oc: thea party :d
 513 (23:22:51) jean7491: in ghent, a'pen, ...
 514 (23:22:58) mimor: jup
 515 (23:23:07) nightrid3r: Casablanca ?
 516 (23:23:10) mimor: let's do that
 517 (23:23:20) mimor: (and stop thinking about everything first)
 518 (23:23:36) Indra6oc: i was wondering
 519 (23:23:40) mimor: let's discuss the organisation of ubuntu-be during the
 520 dipro's
 521 (23:24:00) mimor: wondering = thinking
 522 (23:24:06) mimor: so stop it Indra6oc :D
 523 (23:24:17) nero1 a quitté le salon (quit: Read error: 110 (Connection
 524 timed out))
 525 (23:24:35) Indra6oc: since its been the topic for a while now, maybe we
 526 should stop defining it as a problem and just skip to the solution part
 527 (23:24:40) nightrid3r: discussing during dipro events will fragment to much
 528 (23:24:57) jean7491: during the dipro's and other events,  and we come
 529 back with the topic at end september
 530 (23:25:04) mimor: we can't ask every-one to meet up in Ghent can we?
 531 (23:25:30) mimor: ok jean7491
 532 (23:26:55) Indra6oc: i still like the tea party idea  :) 
 533 (23:27:00) jean7491: through personal contacts everyone can try to
 534 sensibilize people to this problem of organization, and add new ideas in
 535 the wiki
 536 (23:27:03) JanC: okay, let's postpone for now so that I can fix myself
 537 some food  ツ
 538 (23:27:34) Indra6oc: didnt you order pizza :p :p
 539 (23:27:46) Indra6oc: O:-):)
 540 (23:27:47) mimor: I bite my nails... JanC, should try it...
 541 (23:27:47) mimor:  :) 
 542 (23:27:51) jean7491: ok, next topic: 4. Next meeting ? Proposed IRC
 543 meeting on 09/09/2009 at 21 h.
 544 (23:28:20) mimor: Sounds delicious jean7491
 545 (23:28:37) JanC: okay
 546 (23:28:44) mimor: da zit smurf denk ik
 547 (23:28:45) Indra6oc: i migth pass by  O:-) 
 548 (23:28:53) jean7491: ok, end of the meeting!