04:00   freeflying      hi all
04:00   elkbuntu        how many people are here for this LoCo meeting so far?
04:01   jono    ok
04:01   david`bgk       I'm, but from office, so not really active
04:01   jono    yeah, could everyone who is in the meeting say so :)
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04:01   MehdiHassanpour me too ;)
04:01   elkbuntu        me, ubuntu-au
04:02   newz2000        me, ubuntu webmaster
04:02   jsgotangco      yay
04:02   jono    ok, could someone else also save the log, my IRC client is a bit screwy
04:02   Gekitsuu        I'm here for the meeting
04:02   freeflying      jono: fabbione has log
04:02   elkbuntu        surely there's a logbot in here
04:02   jono    cool
04:02   jono    right, lets begin then
04:03   jono    I know a bunch of you already,but let me introduce myself
04:03   freeflying      jsgotangco: hi, long time haven;t seen you :)
04:03   jono    I am Jono Bacon and I the Ubuntu Community Manager working at Canonical
04:03   jono    when I started, one of the key things I wanted to work on is LoCo teams
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04:03   jono    I think that LoCo teams are really centrally important to a strong Ubuntu with plenty of vitality and growth
04:04   jono    we have a number of teams who have formed, and some teams are very strong and some need some help and assistance
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04:04   jono    when I started, one thing was clear though
04:04   jono    there was *very little* communication between teams
04:05   jono    we had a bunch of teams, many in regionally close areas, but with little or no communication
04:05   jono    so, the first plan of action on my "list of things to do to make LoCo teams kiss ass" was to help teams collaborate together
04:05   elkbuntu        o.O
04:05   jono    erm
04:05   jono    kick ass :P
04:06   jono    hehe
04:06   Gnomonic        Right.
04:06   Gnomonic        Got a bit scared, there.
04:06   jono    ass kissing is tolerated though if needed :P
04:06   jono    so, to help with this I have tried to get loco-contacts on its feet again
04:06   elkbuntu        indeed, try avoid the hairy ones though
04:06   jono    and that list is intended for groups to talk together and share experiences
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04:07   elkbuntu        i think many would agree you've made a good start on that, jono :)
04:07   jsgotangco      well
04:07   jsgotangco      some teams do communicate
04:07   MehdiHassanpour this sharing is very important
04:07   jsgotangco      in a server POV
04:07   jsgotangco      ;)
04:07   jono    thanks elkbuntu
04:07   jsgotangco      especially those sharing in one server
04:07   MehdiHassanpour but how
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04:07   jsgotangco      but that's it
04:07   jono    so, communication is clearly important
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04:08   jono    now, there are a few other plans too:
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04:08   jono    * tidy up the New Teams on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoTeamList
04:08   jono    there are lots of teams on that list who have not been accepted as official teams yet
04:08   jono    I plan on getting to that when I return from my holiday around oct 7th
04:09   jono    also
04:09   jono    there is a combination of many different types of team, some confident and experienced, and some not so
04:09   jono    I was thinking of methods in which we can level the playing field out a little, and one of the plans is for LoCo teams to mentor each other
04:10   jono    some teams are very strong and active, and they could help get teams on their feet
04:10   jono    you can think of this as an outsourcing of myself - I just don't have time to attend to *every* team, so mentoring helps spread the load
04:10   jono    I have been working with elkbuntu on this, and there is going to be a trial of one team mentoring another and then we will open it up to the full LoCo community
04:11   elkbuntu        you also cant speak every language either ;)
04:11   jono    hehe
04:11   jono    I can barely speak english :P
04:11   elkbuntu        ;)
04:11   jono    so, the aim of this meeting is to share this progress
04:11   elkbuntu        but anyway yeah, should we go into more details?
04:11   jono    but to also get ideas for ways we can work together
04:12   jono    elkbuntu, sure, do you want to fill people in :)
04:12   elkbuntu        sure
04:12   Gnomonic        Interruption: Does this meeting have an agenda, or is it just free-talking?
04:12   jono    :)
04:12   MehdiHassanpour jono, how and where we can get other teams experiences ?
04:12   jono    Gnomonic, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoTeamMeeting
04:12   jono    fairly short agenda
04:12   jono    MehdiHassanpour, we will discuss that soon
04:12   jono    elkbuntu, shoot :)
04:13   elkbuntu        when jono first joined the community, he spoke to me and mentioned this idea about mentoring
04:13   elkbuntu        i thought about it for a week or so and said 'yeah, lets give it a go'
04:14   Yann2   don't know for you, but I barely have the time to handle -fr, so for other locoteams... :p
04:14   elkbuntu        i nominated helping the new zealand loco team, since they're close and through one of their members that lurks in our channel, i had found out they were not going so well
04:14   elkbuntu        Yann2, this is my second meeting today, 2 of 4 over 2 days. im going insane ;)
04:14   jono    :P
04:14   Yann2   I don't think that this kind of mentoring would be really helpful
04:15   elkbuntu        Yann2, i also have the benefit of a self-maintaining loco that just needs the occasional prod
04:15   elkbuntu        Yann2, what we're doing is a feasability case study
04:15   Yann2   ok :p
04:15   elkbuntu        to see how it goes, whether it works and so forth
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04:16   elkbuntu        4 hours ago, was the -au fortnightly meeting, and in that meeting i invited the nz members i could find and jono to join in
04:16   Gnomonic        It doesn't have to be the Team leader or even the LoCo-contact to help. Yann2, couldn't you find a normal team-member to be a sort of Team-mentor-liason?
04:16   jono    lets discuss it in a sec folks, and let elkbuntu finish :)
04:16   elkbuntu        it was fairly lively, got the nz guys thinking and we have a meeting organised for tomorrow to fling ideas around
04:16   david`bgk       jono, I've added a fourth item on the agenda, ok with that?
04:16   jono    david`bgk, sure
04:17   elkbuntu        so really, things are just starting in this study, and we hope to be able to figure out ways that work and so forth
04:18   jono    yes, this is jus a test at first
04:18   elkbuntu        did you want to add anything, jono?
04:18   Gekitsuu        is it going to be just the one trial or will there be a few?
04:18   jono    Gekitsuu, just one at first
04:18   elkbuntu        one at a time
04:18   elkbuntu        baby steps ;)
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04:18   jono    let me make clear what I mean by mentoring:
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04:19   jono    mentoring is not the same process in all scenarios, but it is helping a LoCo group to develop their own culture and way of working
04:19   phanatic        hey loco people, sorry for being late...
04:19   Ju      (Hi all) for a start, helping other loco, each already running team could describe their platform (tool for wiki, planet, forum and how to combine them) and/or provide the css theme to adapt for each loco, for example some other locoteams were interested by the ubuntu-fr theme
04:19   jono    this does not mean "doing stuff" for that group, but will largely involve IRC meetings, and exchanging emails
04:19   elkbuntu        guys, hush, jono is speaking
04:19   jono    the idea is in keeping the communication channels open between teams and helping those new at setting up teams to get on their feet
04:20   jsgotangco      that's supposed to be the purpose of the locoteams channel right?
04:20   jono    part of the reason why we are trialling it is so we can identify good mentors - mentors *need* to be good and open at running teams, with random mentoring that is more difficult
04:20   elkbuntu        jsgotangco, yep, which is fine if the teams have managed to get some form of order and nominate an actual contact etc
04:21   jono    so much of this is about documentation best practice when it comes to mentoring
04:21   Yann2   btw, the -locoteams channel has nothing official :)
04:21   jono    the grand plan is to develop a community of real community building experts
04:21   jono    instead of just building ad-hoc teams, much of this is about developing an education in community building
04:21   jono    this will make the community more inclusive, closer and more efficient
04:22   jono    ok, thats me done
04:22   jono    so any questions
04:22   jono    or thoughts :)
04:22   Yann2   I love the "sharing locoteams experience" part :)
04:22   MehdiHassanpour I think before mentoring, teams can describe what they do and have done to shape a team
04:22   MehdiHassanpour agree
04:22   jono    yes
04:22   Yann2   some way to resume what locoteams achieved, and how they did... why not even "recipes"
04:22   jono    good point MehdiHassanpour
04:23   jono    much of this is about documentation on the wiki :)
04:23   jono    lt me answer this:
04:23   jono    <Ju> (Hi all) for a start, helping other loco, each already running team could describe their platform (tool for wiki, planet, forum and how to combine them) and/or provide the css theme to adapt for each loco, for example some other locoteams were interested by the ubuntu-fr theme
04:23   Gnomonic        In my mind, there are several phases of starting a team.
04:23   jono    Ju, that is the kind of thing that is important too
04:23   newz2000        jono: I can chime in on your comment when you're ready for feedback
04:23   jono    I am also interested in exploring how to centralise resources
04:23   philwyett       Are you looking at a set of common team goals for locoteams as a whole for a common base to build upon?
04:24   jono    ok one sec guys
04:24   jono    newz2000, shoot
04:24   Gnomonic        I believe that the initial start-up have to come from the team itself, where mentoring is a good solution for getting over the bar for being a full team.
04:24   jono    then we can do philwyett
04:24   newz2000        Some of you have met me, I'm the Ubuntu webmaster, and have been helping the newer teams get websites.
04:24   jono    Gnomonic, definitly
04:25   newz2000        If you don't have a website yet for your loco, please talk to me and I can help you get free hosting
04:25   jono    newz2000, just as a side note, I am developing some ideas about centralising LoCo resources so it is easier for teams to get going - I will arrange a meeting with you and the Launchpad dudes :)
04:25   freeflying      newz2000: where is the server hosted?
04:25   newz2000        We have several servers, most in the US, some in EU.
04:26   freeflying      jono: centralise locoteam resource? it will be a nightmare for many guys from china
04:26   elkbuntu        when newz2000 is finished, i'd like to add something to the comment MehdiHassanpour made
04:26   jono    freeflying, good point
04:26   newz2000        jono: OK, then I'll guess I'll leave at that for now.
04:27   jono    newz2000, cool, thanks!
04:27   newz2000        elkbuntu: go ahead
04:27   jono    elkbuntu, shoot
04:27   elkbuntu        just going back to MehdiHassanpour's comment about before mentoring... the truely successful teams stand out themselves anyway, such as the indonesia team which has managed to get some media lately. jono initially approached me after my appearance in mainstream media here
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04:28   MehdiHassanpour that DVD is really usefull for our team too
04:28   elkbuntu        i think it's important to keep an eye out for the work of teams that may not necissarily be vocal in the central locoteam channel or who may not know what's goign on outside their area
04:29   jono    I think it is important that teams start out themselves and then get mentoring where they need it
04:29   jono    mentoring may be a patchy experience, only applied where needed
04:29   Gnomonic        :-)
04:29   elkbuntu        thats not to say we dont plant the seed and let them decide to come ask for help
04:30   jono    yes
04:30   jono    ok
04:30   jono    <philwyett> Are you looking at a set of common team goals for locoteams as a whole for a common base to build upon?
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=== nixternal is fashionably late like always ;)
04:31   jono    philwyett, this is part of the plan
04:31   Gnomonic        The sharing of team experiences and projects, I think, is a very good way to plant seeds. Wasn't there a 'ideas for a locoteam'-page at some point?
04:31   jono    I am interested in developing some guidence for running a team
04:31   jono    Gnomonic, yep
04:31   jono    I think we need the following core docs on the wiki:
04:32   jono    * how to run a loco team - a guide about how to run a loco effectively, encourage new members etc
04:32   jono    * things you can do as a loco team - details and ideas of activities a loco can do
04:32   jono    I am also developing a document that outlines what a loco team needs to do to get accepted as an official team
04:32   MehdiHassanpour this will be great help, jono
04:33   jono    any other questions?
04:33   Yann2   (may we have a dedicated website, or will we have to work on the official english wiki?)
04:33   MehdiHassanpour and ask teams to announce what they do
04:33   MehdiHassanpour or have started
04:34   jono    Yann2, dedicated site for loco teams?
04:34   philwyett       For sharing whats happening in different teams - A live bookmarks feed like the fridge to allow people to see whats happening and maybe move out of their loco-team more?
04:34   Gnomonic        I agree with MehdiHassanpour. It helps on the efficiency of a project, when you are in some way 'accountable' for your projects.
04:34   jono    Yann2, I would like to see us get out wiki pages up to scratch and then a move to a dedicated site may be an option
04:34   Yann2   with wiki, blog, documents for getting approved as official locoteam, hosting, [...]
04:34   jono    philwyett, I have been talking to the fridge people about getting far more loco news on there
04:35   philwyett       jono: Ah, OK
04:35   jono    I think we need loco teams to be able to see what other teams are doing and it will inspsire them to do their own things
04:35   philwyett       True
04:35   jono    I posted to loco-contacts for case studies and stories, do send them over :)
04:35   MehdiHassanpour many of these projects can be localized and customized by other teams for their local use too
=== freeflying hope we can access to launchpad more easy from china :p
04:36   jono    any final questions?
=== Yann2 don't like launchpad :D :p
04:37   jono    ok
04:37   jono    lets cover this item:
04:37   jono    Improving communication between LoCo teams and Canonical/Ubuntu orientations
04:37   jono    David - want to outline what you mean?
04:37   Yann2   david`bgk, ping
04:37   jono    thanks Yann2 :)
04:38   david`bgk       yes, we don't know what ubuntu/canonical want about locos
04:38   jono    right
04:38   elkbuntu        afaik thats why we now have jono ;)
04:38   MehdiHassanpour ;)
04:38   jono    david`bgk, this is what I am interested in helping with
04:39   jono    I want to realise the full potential of the LoCo community
04:39   Gnomonic        Every home needs a Jono.
04:39   jono    heh
04:39   elkbuntu        lol
04:39   jono    david`bgk, in answer to your question:
04:39   david`bgk       elkbuntu, yes but what about locos and canonical projects? we can do it together (for example spreading ubuntu at the office, etc)
04:40   Yann2   david`bgk 's afraid about competition between canonical and community, i think :)
04:40   elkbuntu        i think the fact that canonical has hired jono should make it clear that they take the community seriously. jono -is- part of canonical
04:40   jono    Canonical have ideas about how LoCo teams can help, and I have stacks of ideas, but part of what I want to do is to help the LoCo community develop cool ideas, schemes and more
04:40   david`bgk       Yann2, not at all but what can we do together to promote ubuntu
04:40   jono    canonical take community *extremely* seriously
04:41   elkbuntu        rightly so since it is the one thing that makes ubuntu awesome
04:41   jono    david`bgk, so you mean methods in which we can advocate ubuntu?
04:41   david`bgk       jono, yes for example when did they want to promote officially ubuntu in france?
04:41   jono    david`bgk, what do you mean 'officially' ?
04:41   elkbuntu        david`bgk, you're free to drop into the marketing team channel at any time, btw
04:42   david`bgk       yes in terms of marketing
04:42   jono    david`bgk, you mean canonical marketing or the ubuntu community marketing?
04:43   Yann2   mmmh. in other words, we heard canonical wants to hire someone in france, essentially to do some advocacy
04:43   david`bgk       jono, is there a difference between those? (and what about foundation?)
04:43   jono    david`bgk, I don't think an effective LoCo structure is for Canonical to say "we want you to do this" and LoCo teams just do it
04:43   Yann2   we were surprised they didn'nt ping us, and wondered where our work start, and where it stops :)
04:43   jono    Canonical want LoCo teams to be their own entity in many ways
04:43   david`bgk       jono, not "want" but maybe "suggest" ;)
04:43   elkbuntu        i think there's a distinct line between the responsibilities of canonical and the responsibilities of the community
04:43   jono    david`bgk, sure, and we can certainly suggest ideas :)
04:44   jono    as for canonical and ubuntu marketing - remember, ubuntu is its own project, but canonical sponsor it
04:44   jono    canonical does not rule ubuntu and controll it
04:44   Yann2   don't want to troll but... that's not that clear, sorry :/
04:44   jono    Yann2, what isnt?
04:44   Yann2   well that's another debate
04:44   Yann2   that canonical/ubuntu foundation thing
04:45   jono    right
04:45   elkbuntu        im going to suggest that since this isnt a loco based thing as such it be brought up with the CC
04:45   jono    yes
04:45   Yann2   let's stick to the topic
04:45   Gnomonic        Maybe it would be great with an informational-meeting about that topic?
04:45   jono    Gnomonic, I agree
04:45   elkbuntu        feel free to suggest it to the CC
04:45   Yann2   already have my answer,  from mark himself, just not that satisfied with it :p
04:46   jono    I think we need to remember that LoCo teams are not there to just do work for Canonical, but they are there to help and promote Ubuntu
04:46   elkbuntu        there is a CC meeting tomorrow
04:46   Gnomonic        It you just pop into that an make a suggestion?
04:46   jono    david`bgk, if you are interested in Canonical establishing how LoCo teams fit in with the Canonical marketinbg strategy, I think we should think about it
04:47   jono    Gnomonic, add it to the agenda
04:47   david`bgk       jono, ok now or on the mailing-list?
04:48   Gnomonic        Just before we get back on topic. Could anyone check up on it, because I probably won't be able to attend.
04:48   MehdiHassanpour I think loco teams can have some kind of professional support and charge customers too, to cover their costs
04:49   jono    david`bgk, I don;t think we have time now, plus I would like to get our Marketing manager along to a meeting about that
04:49   jono    david`bgk, maybe at the next LoCo meeting
04:49   jono    this brings me onto the subject of LoCo meetings
04:49   jono    I would like us to have regular meetings where possib
04:49   jono    possible
04:49   david`bgk       jono, ok good idea
04:49   elkbuntu        yep
04:49   jono    but we need to hit the different time zones fairly
04:49   jono    so everyone can participate
04:49   Gnomonic        I was thinking about suggesting that.
04:49   elkbuntu        jono, you know about the timeanddate.com meeting planner?
04:49   jono    nope
04:49   jono    let me see
04:50   elkbuntu        http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
04:51   jsgotangco      we alway use that to sched events on diff tzs
04:51   jsgotangco      or juse something like tzwatch
04:51   jono    elkbuntu, wow thats cool
04:51   elkbuntu        timeanddate.com == teh awesome
04:53   Yann2   (is the meeting over?)
04:53   elkbuntu        not sure
04:53   elkbuntu        i think jono's playing with the site
04:53   jono    sorry, phone call
04:53   jsgotangco      lol
04:53   elkbuntu        or that
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04:53   jono    ok, any final questions or comments?
04:53   Yann2   (I noted a lots of good intentions, but nothing really concrete)
04:54   jono    the aim of these meeting is not to create actions, but to just discuss some ideas
04:54   grimace damn I've missed it ;)
04:54   jono    one concrete decision should be to have regular meetings
04:54   elkbuntu        grimace, yeah sorry. the logs will be up soon or so
04:54   Gnomonic        I have an idea: What about a LoCo idea pool?
04:54   jono    I am thinking every two weeks on a Monday
04:54   Gargoyle        I am very new to ubuntu, and the UK team. But I like what <MehdiHassanpour> said.
04:54   jono    Gnomonic, good idea, a wiki page where people can add ideas
04:55   philwyett       Slight OT question. The wiki is getting slower of late. Is this issue being addressed?
04:55   jono    Gargoyle, which point
04:55   grimace elkbuntu: no worries and thanks
04:55   Gnomonic        excactly
=== Yann2 for 1/month
04:55   elkbuntu        philwyett, i believe it is being looked in to
04:55   jono    philwyett, it has been, I have been onto the sysadmins about it, I will poke them again
04:55   Yann2   1 every two weeks is a lot :(
04:55   Gargoyle        <MehdiHassanpour> I think loco teams can have some kind of professional support and charge customers too, to cover their costs
04:55   philwyett       elkbuntu and jono: Good - thanks.
04:56   Hobbsee jono: ping (at the end of your meeting)
04:56   elkbuntu        Yann2 the meetings dont have to be long or in depth, they can be simply a catchup and a chance to ask jono a question in a group environment
04:56   jono    I think we need to do meetings fortnightly - so one meeting a month is one timezone, and the other is another
04:56   jono    Hobbsee, ok :)
04:56   jono    elkbuntu, exactly
04:57   Yann2   elkbuntu, it's just my own opinion ;)
04:57   freeflying      jono: I still need your help :)
04:57   elkbuntu        Yann2, also note what jono said. they'll end up monthly for most people anyway
04:57   jono    lets try every two weeks and see how we get on, nothing is cast in stone :)
04:57   Gnomonic        What time-zone was this meeting?
04:57   jono    gnomefreak, UTC
04:58   jono    europe mainly
04:58   MehdiHassanpour I agree with every 2 weeks
04:58   jono    although east coast US could fit in and elkbuntu is in .au
04:58   elkbuntu        its now 1am here
04:58   Gnomonic        I would like to propose that the next 'europe'-meeting be set at least an hour later.
04:59   Hobbsee elkbuntu: will be used to having dodgy timezones.  it's a curse of living her.e
04:59   jono    heh
04:59   jono    right, lets finish up them
04:59   elkbuntu        fitting times to people is part of getting into the meeting mode
04:59   elkbuntu        Hobbsee, aye
04:59   jono    I will schedule another meeting, but the next one I won't be there as I am on holiday
05:00   Yann2   jono, may I have two words with you after the meeting? :)
05:00   jono    Yann2, sure :)
05:00   jono    ok, thanks people :)
05:00   elkbuntu        jono, how long are you on holiday?
05:00   jono    elkbuntu, two weeks
05:00   jono    I return Oct 6th
05:00   Gnomonic        So the next meeting will be on monday the 2. of october at some-or-the-other time.
05:00   Gnomonic        Then no.
05:00   elkbuntu        jono, make it after you return, and start the schedule from then
05:00   jono    Gnomonic, yep
05:00   jono    ok
05:00   jono    can do
05:00   Gnomonic        I agree with the elk.
05:00   jono    maybe start on Oct 10th
05:00   MehdiHassanpour I agree
05:01   jono    cool :)
05:01   jono    obviously you can't get enough jono, which is understandable :P
05:01   Gnomonic        It's a deal then.
05:01   jono    cool
05:01   MehdiHassanpour set it whenever you are and have time
05:01   elkbuntu        you're effectively the point of these meetings jono, so your attendance is priority
05:01   jono    ok cool :)
05:01   MehdiHassanpour ;)
05:02   Gnomonic        :-)
05:02   jono    thanks for attending people, and keep using loco-contacts :)

MeetingLogs/LoCo-2006-9-18 (last edited 2008-08-06 16:15:07 by localhost)