== raw logs==
<Seeker`> Does jono have to be here for the meeting to happen? <markvandenborre> dsas, you feel like guiding this meeting? * Seeker` thinks it was very kind of dsas to volunteer :P <dsas> bah <markvandenborre> :) <markvandenborre> dsas, is that a yes or a no? <effie_jayx> Seeker`, he said he was not attending <dsas> that's a "please someone else step up" <markvandenborre> ok, I'll see what we can make out of this * _nairoV applauds markvandenborre <dsas> I don't know anything about the issues in the agenda... <markvandenborre> 1. https://launchpad.net/products/ubuntu-website/+bug/51382 <Ubugtu> Malone bug 51382 in ubuntu-website "Suggestion: LoCo Teams to Free Support Page" [Undecided,Fix released] <markvandenborre> joey doesn't seem to be around <markvandenborre> anyone else was involved? <markvandenborre> any thoughts about it that might be interesting to add to the discussion? * Zelut (n=Zelut@kuyaedz.fttp.xmission.com) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> let's take 2 minutes to read through it <markvandenborre> for those who haven't yet, then comment <dsas> I've pinged mdke. <markvandenborre> Zelut, https://launchpad.net/products/ubuntu-website/+bug/51382 <Ubugtu> Malone bug 51382 in ubuntu-website "Suggestion: LoCo Teams to Free Support Page" [Undecided,Fix released] <dsas> Right, so what we need to do is ask each team if they provide that kind of support and make a list on the wiki, then get mdke to change the link. <_nairoV> do we have said wiki page? <dsas> _nairoV: Not yet. dsas dAndy datten dholbach doko dous <markvandenborre> I thought I had seen it in some mailing list post <_nairoV> dsas: thanks <markvandenborre> any more suggestions on this? <dsas> markvandenborre: I didn't see anything likely in CategoryLoCoTeams <markvandenborre> maybe we should post on the locoteams list about this <_nairoV> markvandenborre: we are setting up framewrok for face to face support in Ohio <markvandenborre> _nairoV, same thing for us <_nairoV> I think it would be helpful for there to be one page to rule them all.... <dsas> markvandenborre: Yeah, we should post on the list, with a link to a wiki page and let people update it. <markvandenborre> Belgian team has this highly succesful user map <dsas> a FaceToFaceSupport page name sound ok? <markvandenborre> ok, so one wiki page with the kinds of local face-to-face support teams give, right? <_nairoV> dsas: yes <markvandenborre> dsas, sounds fine to me... * dand (n=dand@gw.datagroup.ro) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> dsas, you do it, and post to the mailing list? <dsas> markvandenborre: sure. <markvandenborre> ok, any other comments on this? * ubuntugeek (n=rtroy@64.141.138.3) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> 3.... * cjr` has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) <markvandenborre> 2.... <markvandenborre> 1.... <markvandenborre> next point <markvandenborre> interloco communications <markvandenborre> I believe (not sure) this has something to do with language problems, mostly * vorian_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) * _nairoV sets mode -e _nairoV * You are now known as Vorian_ * services. sets mode +e Vorian_ <markvandenborre> of certain countries not having many people who are fluent enough in English to follow the locoteams mailing list <markvandenborre> getting information to flow between the international locoteams list and the local one is sometimes really difficult <markvandenborre> ideas for improving that? markvandenborre mbamford mdz meatballhat Mithrandir mjg59 moroco mvo_ <Vorian_> markvandenborre: what about a loco planet? <markvandenborre> please explain yourself? <Vorian_> similar to http://planet.ubuntulinux.org/ <ubuntugeek> hello all <markvandenborre> hi ubuntugeek <Vorian_> ubuntugeek: hey <ubuntugeek> who is here for the FC meeting? anyone * mgalvin (n=mgalvin@ubuntu/member/mgalvin) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> having locoteam meeting right now... <ubuntugeek> ah yes i am early :) <ubuntugeek> got my times messes up <markvandenborre> Vorian_, how would that help solve the language problem? <markvandenborre> it's basicly about having a quite active Chinese community for example, but few people who speak English enough in this community <Vorian_> not so sure, just an idea lol <markvandenborre> :) <Zelut> markvandenborre: perhaps assign ambassadors to teams that need translators, etc. <dsas> Hm, there must be a few english speakers that can act as go betweens <effie_jayx> ambassadors help a great deal :D <markvandenborre> ok, so how can we make their jobs easier? * ogra_ is now known as ogra <markvandenborre> this is probably why something like ubuntu weekly news is so important <markvandenborre> because it condenses a lot of information from the international community into something easily translatable <dsas> how can we encourage people to translate it? * matthew5 (n=matthew_@adsl196-127-27-217-196.adsl196-9.iam.net.ma) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <dsas> maybe we can add a note to the UWN itself asking for translators <markvandenborre> by giving it a maximum length, for example? * romey (n=steve@wsip-68-15-125-140.ok.ok.cox.net) has left #ubuntu-meeting <Vorian_> markvandenborre: that should help... <markvandenborre> the last one (before christmas I believe) was _really_ long <dsas> Yeah, they are growing a lot, I don't imagine the marketing team being eager to shrink it though <dsas> we could possibly flag up certain sections to be a higher priority to be translated <markvandenborre> dsas, they probably should, to make it easier for translations to get through... <markvandenborre> it's also about being read in the english capable community <markvandenborre> too long, won't get read entirely <markvandenborre> maybe we could also include a call for translators into it, if that doesn't happen already? <dsas> markvandenborre: To shorten it will require some contact with the marketing team, we should see what their response is. <markvandenborre> (well, "we", I mean, we could suggest the uwn people to do so) * raphink has quit ("Ichthux - Linux for Christians - http://www.ichthux.com") <markvandenborre> ok, <markvandenborre> so getting information out of the mostly native language locoteams to the international community <markvandenborre> any hints on stimulating that? <dsas> ah, it does contain "If you'd like to read the UWN in your native language, please check http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter for a list of translations." already. <markvandenborre> perfect dsas dand dAndy datten dholbach doko dous <Zelut> i wonder if we could find translators from rosetta. if they're already working on a language perhaps they wouldn't mind a tad more. <markvandenborre> good point... * pradeep (n=pradeep@59.92.47.72) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <Zelut> and if its just the weekly newsletter it shouldn't be *too* much extra work.. I wouldn't think <markvandenborre> so how about getting this really interesting news fact out of the Kurdistan or Bhutan team to the international community? <markvandenborre> (locoteams community) <markvandenborre> maybe stimulate them to send in robot translations + the original if they can't find a translation immediately? <Zelut> thats where I think the ambassadors come in. making sure information flows both ways <markvandenborre> k <markvandenborre> next point, or we'll be running over time <Vorian_> :) <Zelut> recruit someone whos main responsibility is simply translating communications between teams.. I think we could find some interest inthat. <markvandenborre> Zelut, absolutely <markvandenborre> next: locoteams documentation, how to make it more practical * matthew5 is now known as forumsmatthew <markvandenborre> any thoughts about this? * dand has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep") <Zelut> you referring to the locoteamshowto, locoteamslist, etc? <markvandenborre> loco docs, loco faq, locoteam howto,... <markvandenborre> this stuff, yes * sebastean (n=johan@nl106-130-194.student.uu.se) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> it might be really interesting to compile all the information that has gathered into something more comprehensive <markvandenborre> think a small, easily printable booklet * Rinchen (n=Rinchen@ubuntu/member/rinchen) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> right now, there's lots of information, but not always easy to find your way around... * Rinchen is now known as JoeyStanford <markvandenborre> hey JoeyStanford ! <Zelut> i know it was a lot of guesswork when I created our team <JoeyStanford> Hiya Mark! <Vorian_> Zelut: Same with us... <Zelut> a .pdf printable booklet would be nice I think <Zelut> a step 1, step 2, etc layout would be nice. <markvandenborre> maybe this is something to see on the mailing list if we can get a few people to work on it <markvandenborre> ? <markvandenborre> I would gladly join such an effort... <Vorian_> I'll help * Lure has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) <markvandenborre> other ways to improve this locoteams howto document? <markvandenborre> documentation, I mean... <markvandenborre> something that is really missing from it? <Vorian_> I don't think there is <Vorian_> It is just not organized as well as it could be <markvandenborre> maybe it's also a good idea to have docs about new subjects grow on the wiki first, then include them... <markvandenborre> ok, next point, women's group <markvandenborre> any women around, or people who know what this is about? <markvandenborre> let's all have a brief look at http://ubuntu-women.org/ then... <JoeyStanford> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWomen <JoeyStanford> both are the same <JoeyStanford> I believe the question was: * j_ack (n=rudi@p508DB421.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <JoeyStanford> Ubuntu Women is a specialized community team (not necessarily Local) * YoManWazap has quit ("Ex-Chat") <JoeyStanford> Is there a place for them inside the LoCo structure. <dsas> I don't see why not, it's the same sort of thing... <markvandenborre> it seems like a perfect fit, considering we also have pure language oriented teams <markvandenborre> they aren't strictly locally linked either * JoeyStanford appologizes for being late. His calendaring software said this started in 10 mins, not 50 mins ago. bummer. <markvandenborre> where else would they fit in? <Zelut> after scanning through the wiki I think it seems more of a team like the marketing team, docs team, etc.. <JoeyStanford> Mark, I think that's the crux. <Zelut> I think loco focuses more on regional support <markvandenborre> Zelut, locoteams is really broad <markvandenborre> for some things, it's as much about translations as about face to face support <markvandenborre> no locoteam is the same in the tasks it defines for itself <Seeker`> but the LoCo teams that is based on locations, be it countries or langugaes <Seeker`> Women aren't in countries of their own, and they speak the same languages <markvandenborre> there's Kurdish people in Belgium too <markvandenborre> who are part of the Kurdish team... <markvandenborre> and in the us, and everywhere around the globe <JoeyStanford> Seeker, in this case, the UW group is a world-wide group. You are correct, they do not have a single local area. The question to me is "do they do the things that a LoCo does but without a set geographical area". If the answer is yes, then they are simply a specialized LoCo. <markvandenborre> Seeker`, do you think it would be bad if they joined the locoteams list? <Zelut> i think they could work with loco teams in efforts of translation but I don't know about considering them a specialized loco, just a new team <JoeyStanford> "the LoCo project is here to help groups of Ubuntu fans and enthusiasts work together in regional teams to help advocate, promote, translate, develop and otherwise improve Ubuntu." <Seeker`> markvandenborre: I dont think it would be bad as such, I am just trying to work out wether they are actually a LoCo team or not <JoeyStanford> If I read their wiki and web page correctly, they have nailed each point except "regional" <markvandenborre> Seeker`, are angels male or female :p <JoeyStanford> their region would be the Internet. * matthew5 (n=matthew_@adsl196-194-35-217-196.adsl196-10.iam.net.ma) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <markvandenborre> I think we don't have to define them as a locoteam or not <markvandenborre> but we and they sure could benefit from communicating * heno (n=henrik@ubuntu/member/heno) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <Seeker`> markvandenborre: I haven't given any thought to the question, and it is irrelevant <markvandenborre> and the locoteams list looks like an obvious pleace for that... <Zelut> again, I think coordinating the loco efforts with them would be beneficial (in the same way we'll help coordinate & translate with the marketing team) but considering them a loco seems to open to the door to consider every team a specialized loco <Seeker`> if you have a womans LoCo team, why not have a LoCo for people called "Chris", or people with brown hair? <JoeyStanford> Zelut has a good point. One of the concerns at UDS MTV was having multiple LoCos in a region. * moroco has quit ("Abandonando") <markvandenborre> ah, that way you mean... <markvandenborre> Seeker`, would that be a bad thing? * matthew5 has quit (Client Quit) <JoeyStanford> Normally specialized groups fall under the Community Council and not the LoCo team. In this case we have a specialized group which looks like a LoCo team but doesn't have a region. <markvandenborre> you could easily say "even if we're not sure if you're a loco or not, you're welcome" <Vorian_> I, for one, feel they should be welcome in the loco organization...for what its worth <markvandenborre> okay for everyone if we tackle the next subject? <Vorian_> should we table it? <Seeker`> I think we have just run out of time <Vorian_> there is another meeting now <markvandenborre> who is responsible for the next meeting? <Vorian_> ubuntugeek: <PriceChild> markvandenborre, ubuntugeek * ubuntugeek raises hand * Ubugtu has changed the topic to: Current meeting: Forum Council | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 09 Jan 21:00 UTC: Community Council | 10 Jan 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 11 Jan 21:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 16 Jan 20:00 UTC: Technical Board <markvandenborre> ubuntugeek, have a few minutes left? <markvandenborre> or maybe we could move to #ubuntu-locoteams just as well... <ubuntugeek> we got a 2 hour slot, and i am sure we wont use it <ubuntugeek> so if you need a few more minutes go for it <markvandenborre> ok, so we just stay for another 5 to 10 minutes? <markvandenborre> thx! <ubuntugeek> thats fine <markvandenborre> how to setup a LoCoteam newsletter (and avoid fragmentation) <Zelut> what would be included in a locoteam newsletter? <dsas> markvandenborre: What is supposed to be in the news letter? <markvandenborre> the issue at stake here is that if you create a passive medium like a newsletter <markvandenborre> translated pr for new ubuntu releases <markvandenborre> announcements of events the locoteam participates in <markvandenborre> announcements of other news relevant to the locoteam <Vorian_> success stories! <markvandenborre> things like that <markvandenborre> the issue jono has with this is <Zelut> sounds like similar things included in the UWN.. * JoeyStanford agrees with Zelut. <markvandenborre> yes, but local level only <markvandenborre> something that we need to be very careful about <markvandenborre> is stimulating people who receive the newsletter <markvandenborre> to also join the more active locoteam list <markvandenborre> (so the local team list, not the international one) * forumsmatthew has quit (Nick collision from services.) <markvandenborre> that's something particularly important to jono <markvandenborre> and he has something of a point there * forumsmatthew (n=matthew_@adsl196-34-31-217-196.adsl196-9.iam.net.ma) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <JoeyStanford> Based on the above, at this time I would favour enhancing the UWN LoCo area over creation of a LoCo only newsletter. <JoeyStanford> UWN is in the beginnings of having it's issues translated. * Yann2 (n=Yann4@88.134.59.222) has joined #ubuntu-meeting <Yann2> hi <Zelut> I think each of the LoCos probably send out newsletter type updates on their own lists, and we have the UWN which shares larger successes.. sounds like duplication. <JoeyStanford> Zelut, that's what my team does as well. <markvandenborre> we have the following situation: <Vorian_> Zelut: ditto <JoeyStanford> Zelut, but I think Jono's concern is to have one master LoCo newsletter <markvandenborre> lots of people on the locoteam list <markvandenborre> this list is for active participants <dsas> isn't the news worth folding into UWN though? <Vorian_> why don't we just start one, and work out any issues that come of it? <markvandenborre> (organising fairs, ...) <markvandenborre> Vorian_, what do you mean? <Vorian_> plan a newsletter for feb <Vorian_> see what reactions are <markvandenborre> what kind of a newsletter? <Vorian_> Loco specific <Vorian_> with the topics you listed earlier <markvandenborre> what would be the added value of that? <markvandenborre> locoteams list summary you mean? <Vorian_> yep <markvandenborre> isn't uwn enough? <markvandenborre> they have enough problems already keeping to a schedule <Vorian_> they could link to the loco news * Zelut has to run off to work. be back at the CC meeting. <markvandenborre> JoeyStanford, trying to explain why we are planning to run a local newsletter * Zelut has quit ("Leaving.") <markvandenborre> we have a lot of nl (or fr, for that matter) only people around <markvandenborre> who are only interested in more basic news like: <markvandenborre> new releases <markvandenborre> and events where ubuntu-be.org will be present <markvandenborre> this is quite a broad group <dsas> markvandenborre: Can't you just make a summary for UWN and then include any .be specifics? <markvandenborre> so we're talking really low frequency here <Vorian_> I say monthly <dsas> I don't have a problem with local newsletters, I must have misunderstood the idea. <markvandenborre> yes, very well possible <markvandenborre> the potential problem jono sees with this is fragmentation <markvandenborre> people not making the jump from the passive low frequency newsletter to the locoteam itself <markvandenborre> so we were looking for ideas on how to remedy that <dsas> there's no reason why you can't do your own newsletter and just link in to the few big news when it happens, or link to UWN saying "more news available at" <markvandenborre> good idea... <Vorian_> dsas: right on <markvandenborre> but also: link from the local newsletter to the local active volunteers mailing list <JoeyStanford> and more importantly to me, ensure the UWN has the details so we can spread the word to everyone else. <dsas> yeah, this shouldn't result in less info being passed to UWN * JoeyStanford agrees. <markvandenborre> if I understood jono correctly, this was not his objection <markvandenborre> he was more concerned about fragmenting the local community <markvandenborre> any hints on more ways to avoid that? <dsas> Currently if people don't want to be very active then what choices do they have: don't be part at all? Increasing ways of participation is not a bad thing. <markvandenborre> dsas, my thought exactly * JoeyStanford looks at ubuntugeek and says "we'll be done in just a minute. last topic." :-) <markvandenborre> 3.... <ubuntugeek> about 5 more mins good for you guys? <Larynx> :D <markvandenborre> 2.... <markvandenborre> 1... <markvandenborre> 1/2.... <markvandenborre> done markvandenborre mbamford mdz meatballhat mgalvin Mithrandir mjg59 mvo_ <markvandenborre> thx all, thx ubuntugeek <JoeyStanford> fade to black <Vorian_> thanks markvandenborre ! <ubuntugeek> great <markvandenborre> anyone <ubuntugeek> thanks guys <dsas> thanks ubuntugeek <markvandenborre> who's still interested, -> #ubuntu-locoteams <dsas> thanks markvandenborre for chairing