[18:03] <heno> #startmeeting
[18:04] <ogasawara_> just in time then
[18:04] <heno> hm, I though the bot was fixed :(
[18:04] <heno> [TOPIC] Automated bug replies
[18:04] <heno> Has anyone worked on a meta-can-text?
[18:05] <heno> I think a note saying the reply is scripted would be good
[18:05] <bdmurray> Do you mean a message to include in automated replies?
[18:06] <ogasawara_> that hasn't been written yet - I'd like to get ideas about what we should try to include when we do send these automated replies
[18:06] <ogasawara_> like heno mentioned - clearly stating this is an automated reply
[18:06] <heno> if the bug is closed in the process it should probably be suggested it be reopened for a human to read any replies
[18:07] <heno> beyond that, I don't know if we can predict the likelihood of a response
[18:07] <ogasawara_> the one issue I wonder about is if the automated reply will be ignored if the reporter knows it wasn't coming from a "real" person
[18:07] <heno> (I should mention that the agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings)
[18:07] <ogasawara_> so I think it would also be good to explain how replies to automated posts will be handled
[18:08] <heno> agreed
[18:08] <bdmurray> It might help to have it as a footnote to the message too
[18:08] <heno> some people may even filter on a fragment of the canned text :)
[18:09] <ogasawara_> I'll try to write something up in a wiki and send it to the ml
[18:10] <heno> ok, thanks
[18:10] <heno> we can take it from there
[18:10] <heno> Topic: Getting QATeam/ReleaseReports in shape for the next release meeting
[18:11] <heno> see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ReleaseReports
[18:11] <heno> sbeattie made a landing page for this
[18:12] <heno> I've separated out individual report pages
[18:12] <pedro_> when is the next release meeting? 26 or 29?
[18:12] <ara> 26 is Friday
[18:12] <heno> we have some regression candidate bugs we should look at and also the list sent to the ml by nullack
[18:12] <ara> so I guess is 26th
[18:12] <pedro_> ok so maybe there's a typo there at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ReleaseReports/20080926 ?
[18:13] <sbeattie> looks like it.
[18:13] <heno> wery possibly :)
[18:13] <pedro_> alright
[18:13] <ara> fridge agrees on the 26th: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/node/1621
[18:14] <sbeattie> heno: do you mind if I <<include>> the upcoming report in that landing page?
[18:14] <sbeattie> akin to having the current agenda show up on the qa meeting page?
[18:15] <heno> sbeattie: will that be confusing in that you can't edit it there? perhaps add a comment in the wiki source as well to clarify
[18:15] <heno> but, yeah sure
[18:16] <heno> bdmurray, pedro_, ogasawara: could you look at the bugs nullack suggested for this list?
[18:17] <ogasawara_> heno:  sure
[18:17] <pedro_> yep no problem
[18:17] <bdmurray> heno: sure
[18:18] <heno> slangasek: I know there was a discussion about this in #u-bugs earlier - would you prefer we milestone/nominate these in-our-view-hot-bugs before the meeting or just bring a wiki page with candidates to the meeting
[18:20] <bdmurray> heno: last week slangasek and I talked a bit about the problems with nominations - specifically that a denied nomination can't be renominated
[18:20] <heno> right
[18:21] <stgraber> sorry, I'm late.
[18:21] <heno> bdmurray: what was the conclusion?
[18:21]  * heno waves to stgraber
[18:22] <bdmurray> heno: not nominating due to the amount of noise there
[18:22] <heno> ok
[18:23] <heno> and only a few of us have the power to milestone, right?
[18:23] <bdmurray> heno: actually it's all of bug control
[18:23] <bdmurray> fewer people have the ability to deal with nominations
[18:23] <heno> so an internal discussion in the QA team before the meeting seems appropriate
[18:24] <heno> yes, I remember you've pointed out that to be a bit backwards
[18:24] <bdmurray> right
[18:25] <heno> slangasek may be afk - let's talk about regressions:
[18:25] <heno> they should also be considered for that list
[18:26] <heno> sbeattie has made a lovely overview page: http://people.ubuntu.com/~sbeattie/regression_tracker.html
[18:27] <heno> many of them have unknown importance etc though - how should we triage these?
[18:28] <heno> should we do a weekly pass over them? make it a topic of this meeting?
[18:28] <heno> bdmurray: thoughts?
[18:28] <cr3> "regression potential"? what's that?
[18:28] <ara> could it be a candidate for a hug day? regression bugs
[18:28] <bdmurray> there sure are a lot of new ones on there
=== chuck__ is now known as zul
[18:29] <cr3> I mean, how are potential regressions evaluated as such?
[18:29] <heno> cr3: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/RegressionTracking
[18:29] <pedro_> sbeattie: you're not listing the ones without a package at your page right?
[18:29] <sbeattie> pedro_: hrm, I suspect not.
[18:29] <heno> sbeattie: perhaps your page should link to the explanation
[18:29] <pedro_> ara: i'd say no, there's not a lot for hug day IMHO
[18:30] <sbeattie> heno: yeah, agreed
[18:30] <heno> pedro_, ara: I also think we need to look more often than that
[18:30] <bdmurray> sbeattie: where does release come from?
[18:30] <pedro_> heno: yup
[18:31] <heno> turaround time is important as we near release
[18:31] <sbeattie> bdmurray: whether it's been nominated for that release.
[18:31] <bdmurray> sbeattie: nominated and not approved? or an approved nomination?
[18:32] <heno> sbeattie: can we get this on qa.u.c and ogasawara, can we in turn parse it and add the regression count on each package page?
[18:32] <sbeattie> bdmurray: I *think* approved nominations; that is, it would show up on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/[release]/+bugs
[18:32] <ogasawara_> heno:  I'll need to take a closer look at the parsing but it should be easy enough to add to the pkg stat pages
[18:33] <sbeattie> heno: yes, and I can have it emit something more parseable than html.
[18:34] <bdmurray> Could we split it up btwn milestoned and not milestoned and also by importance?
[18:34] <heno> ah, that would be good
[18:35] <sbeattie> bdmurray: sure.
[18:35] <heno> is Wouter Stomp here? (what is his nick)
[18:35] <heno> I think I tagged many of these
[18:36] <heno> he, not I !
[18:36] <heno> sorry, stealing credit there :)
[18:37] <bdmurray> its too bad there is no record of who or when something was tagged
[18:37] <davmor2> he did my ndiswrapper one
[18:37] <sbeattie> bdmurray: agreed!
[18:38] <heno> Does anyone want to take ownership of the regression list, coordinating with others to get it triaged and added to the support list?
[18:39] <heno> sbeattie? can you check with Wouter and nullack if they want to help you with that?
[18:39] <sbeattie> sure
[18:39] <heno> great, thanks!
[18:39] <bdmurray> sbeattie: we might be able to check the mailing list for taggers and tag dates
[18:39] <bdmurray> s/might/should/
[18:40] <heno> we should probably look at the list briefly at each weekly meeting between now and release
[18:40] <sbeattie> bdmurray: yeah, was thinking the same thing.
[18:40] <heno> that covers both the regression and reporting topics
[18:41] <heno> Topic: Testing day preparations
[18:41] <heno> ara: has just announced Monday's big testing day
[18:42] <heno> ara: you're not on planet yet - do you have access to the QA blog?
[18:42] <ara> guys, those with a blog, please, post about it :-)
[18:42] <heno> this would be appropriate for that
[18:42] <ara> heno: never tried
[18:42] <heno> that too :)
[18:42] <heno> stgraber: can you get ara set up?
[18:43] <stgraber> sure
[18:43] <jcastro> which list was it posted to? I must have missed it, I can blog it though
[18:43] <heno> thanks
[18:43] <bdmurray> jcastro: ubuntu-qa
[18:43] <pedro_> jcastro: ubuntu-qa i think
[18:44] <heno> I'll be around to give advice on testing day - anyone else?
[18:44] <ara> me too
[18:44] <pedro_> count me in
[18:44] <jcastro> I'm always around
[18:45] <bdmurray> it'll be in #ubuntu-testing correct?
[18:45] <heno> cr3, schwuk: how about we run a session on how the auto install work is progressing?
[18:45] <ara> bdmurray: yep
[18:45] <heno> it's still very opaque to people
[18:46] <heno> we are in the process of opening it up, it takes time
[18:46] <bdmurray> the kvm testing documentation is quite sparse too
[18:46] <stgraber> ara: what's your Ubuntu QA username ? (ISO tracker or Brainstorm)
[18:46] <ara> stgraber: areta
[18:46] <cr3> first, we have been working on adding installer testing which consists of checkbox-log packaged as a udeb which monitors the syslog for particular phases of the installation
[18:46] <heno> we could run a session or two in a different chan (classroom or u-qa)
[18:47] <heno> cr3: right, can you prepare a little session about it for Monday?
[18:47] <schwuk> heno: here or as part of the testing day?
[18:47] <cr3> the checkbox-log is called from a daemon forked at early-command time which first reports that the machine has booted and then reports various phases
[18:47] <heno> like the devel week or open week sessions
[18:48] <cr3> heno: sure, what's on Monday?
[18:48] <heno> as part of testing day (sorry if that was unclear)
[18:48] <heno> cr3: read scrollback :)
[18:49] <cr3> heno: installer testing will not be available for community though
[18:49] <jcastro> getting people set up with the rsync script ahead of time might be a good idea.
[18:50] <heno> ara: can you coordinate the timing of those? perhaps we can do one on SRU testing and one on desktop testing too
[18:50] <ara> heno: sure
[18:50] <bdmurray> jcastro: it'll be alpha 6 testing though so I'm not certain rsync is necessary
[18:50] <stgraber> ara: done, you should have access to the blog
[18:50] <heno> cr3: right, I'm just asking for an overview presentation given on Monday
[18:50] <jcastro> bdmurray: ok
[18:50] <schwuk> jcastro: so running posts about how to get setup for testing day as well as publiscising it?
[18:50] <cr3> heno: will do
[18:50] <ara> stgraber: thanks
[18:51] <heno> cr3: It's quite informal - look at some examples logs from open week
[18:51] <stgraber> ara: http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/add/story
[18:51] <davmor2> heno: is the idea to get people to sign up to the tracker if so it might be good if we could get a fresh batch of iso's listed for the monday
[18:51] <heno> a short intro followed by Q&A
[18:51] <jcastro> schwuk: well, the mirrors get slower as we get closer to release, if people want to start on monday and chip in when they can we can get them syncing the ISOs and registered on the tracker ahead of time
[18:52] <heno> davmor2: we should list the Alpha 6 (released) images
[18:52] <heno> we don't do that often, but the tracker can do that
[18:52] <davmor2> I think it will be best then we get a fresh set of readings :)
[18:53] <bdmurray> would we get more duplicate bug reports though?
[18:53] <heno> jcastro: I agree that it's important to show people how to be prepared
[18:54] <bdmurray> could we link to the alpha 6 caveats to avoid that?
[18:54] <heno> not such a big deal for this testing day but for later milestones it's crucial
[18:55] <heno> right, let's link to that on the testing day page
[18:55] <heno> can we also make it easy for people to search for recently filed bugs somehow?
[18:56] <heno> 'ubuquity bugs filed since sept 19th', say
[18:56] <bdmurray> maybe iso-testing tagged sorted by newest first in LP
[18:56] <heno> I know bughelper can do that, should that be what we recommend?
[18:57] <heno> bdmurray: many alpha 6 bugs may be reported by the general non-iso-testing public though
[18:57] <heno> during the weekend, say
[18:58] <bdmurray> right, the bugnumbers query can be a bit slow but we could pregenerate a list for some packages I imagine
[18:58] <heno> one more point relating to testing day: Tidying up the test documentation - what should we prioritise before the even and what is suitable for editing during it?
[18:59] <heno> bdmurray: can you do that for top 10 packages, say?
[18:59] <heno> ara: what's your view on the current state of the testing docs now?
[19:00] <ara> heno: I think that the most important page, ISO/Procedures is quite clean. About what is suitable, I had proposed to clean and improve the test cases
[19:00] <ara> heno: as explained in https://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu/Applications
[19:00] <heno> not all have had the pedro_/jcastro makeover :)
[19:00] <bdmurray> heno: yes
[19:00] <heno> thanks!
[19:01] <davmor2> I've started adding the screenshots which I can finish off once testing is out of the way
[19:01] <heno> ara: ok, so the how-tos are in good shape IYO and well ask for help with the cases on the day?
[19:01] <heno> thanks davmor2
[19:02] <bdmurray> maybe we should focus on 1 type of testing like Live CD?
[19:02] <davmor2> ara: temporarily I've not added the screenshot to it's holding page I'll wizz through those at the same time
[19:03] <ara> davmor2: ok
[19:03] <heno> bdmurray: good plan, we can always expand on the day if we need to
[19:04] <heno> that gives us a better chance of getting a full test result matrix :)
[19:04] <heno> let's wrap up
[19:04] <heno> any other business?
[19:05] <heno> Alpha 6 candidates need some testing love of course!
[19:05] <heno> #endmeeting

MeetingLogs/QATeam/20080917 (last edited 2008-09-18 06:40:09 by static-101-137-235-87)