Ubuntu Wiki

04:59   mdz     Kamion, seb128, mvo, doko, Mithrandir, Riddell, ogra: ping
04:59   fabbione        mdz: i just managed to get one laptop up and running
04:59   Mithrandir      pong
04:59   ogra    pong
04:59   seb128  mdz: pong
04:59   Riddell hi mdz
05:00   mvo     hello
05:00   zul     hi mdz
05:00   kwwii   hi
05:00   pitti   hi kwwii
05:01   Riddell Linuturk_code: yes
05:01   mdz     Kamion, doko_: reping
05:01   doko_   pong
05:03   mdz     ok, good afternoon everyone, let's begin
05:03   mdz     pitti: will you start us off?
=== fabbione is ready too
05:03   pitti   sure
05:03   pitti   Done:
05:03   pitti   * security updates: Thunderbird/dapper, Thunderbird + all reverse dependencies for breezy, Firefox/dapper (needs final approval from mdz), gzip, kernel
05:03   pitti   * apt-get-debug-symbols: buildd side done by infinity, people.u.c. side done by me, announced to u-d-a, enjoy!
05:03   pitti   * bug fixing in various packages (mainly apport, hal, gnome-volume-manager, some FTBFS, some dapper updates)
05:03   pitti   * intro meeting with keescook
05:03   pitti   * heavy Knot-3 CD testing
05:03   pitti   * finished last bits of gnutls12->13 transition, gnutls12 in universe now
05:03   pitti   * managed to stay on top of the bug wave
05:03   pitti   Todo:
05:03   pitti   * fix langpack-o-matic infrastructure to work with new SRU policy (upload staging in *-proposed), urgently need to update dapper langpacks (also to fix some serious bugs)
05:03   pitti   * Beta testing
05:03   pitti   * care for mysql merge if infinity's workload is too high
05:04   pitti   * improve apport-retrace script to make use of new ddeb archive
05:04   pitti   * bug fixing, to the extent possible by freezes
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05:04   pitti   mdz: btw, ffox 1.5.0.7 is prepared for dapper release; do you want to discuss that or shall I just go ahead?
05:04   mdz     pitti: I thought we already discussed it, if I'm confused then we should review it again
05:05   pitti   mdz: well, I never got a formal 'ok', that's why I'm asking
05:05   pitti   (just the ok for thunderbird)
05:05   mdz     pitti: ok, let's follow up by email
05:05   pitti   alright
05:05   mdz     pitti: is there anything on your list which should be on the beta todo list?
=== pitti notes that he set his last spec to 'implemented' today :)
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05:06   sbalneav        Hello
05:06   mdz     for reference, since it will come up many times during the meeting, it is at https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.10-beta
05:06   pitti   mdz: nothing is terribly urgent, no
05:06   mdz     you can nominate any bug for that list by setting the milestone, but make sure the importance is set appropriately
05:06   pitti   in general, I do think we should fix the ubuntu-meta behaviour
05:06   mdz     pitti: which behaviour?
05:07   pitti   ok, I'll check my bugs for good candidates, but I squashed most of the appropriate ones already
05:07   pitti   mdz: removing any u-desktop dependency marks all other u-desktop packages for auto-removal
05:07   pitti   unlike in previous releases
05:08   imbrandon       ( *-desktop )
05:08   mdz     hmm, is that because the metapackage is used to install the livefs?
05:08   pitti   e. g. I can't even uninstall bug-buddy without apt wanting to kill my  entire system
05:08   mdz     rather than the task?
05:08   pitti   I didn't look into it so far, but I think so
05:08   mdz     pitti: open a bug, set the milestone to beta and let's talk with mvo about it
05:09   mvo     mdz: the current apt has native tasks support
05:09   pitti   mdz: alright
05:09   mdz     should be a trivial change to the livefs build script
05:09   mdz     pitti: thanks
05:09   mvo     mdz: its a matter of modifing the livefs build script
05:09   mdz     mvo: :-)
05:09   mdz     mvo: next
05:09   mvo     Did:
05:09   mvo     - bug triage
05:09   mvo     - added native tasks support into apt-get to make livefs build easier (apt-get install taskname^)
05:09   mvo     - improved the synaptic/apt support for automatic dependency display/manipulation
05:09   mvo     - knot3 cd testing
05:09   mvo     - bugfixing (apt, pango, gtk-im-libthai, g-a-i, vmware-player-kernel/dapper-security, update-manager, python-apt, python-central, python-defaults, anacron, bash, gnome-system-tools GST_NO_NTP)
05:09   mvo     - ddtp updates
05:09   mvo     - added a wikipage about automatic dependency removal and added it to ubuntu weekly news
05:09   mvo     - some work on the non-interactive dist-upgrader, some upgrade testing
05:09   mvo     Will do:
05:09   mvo     - more testing/bugfixing in the beta release
05:09   mvo     - update the gnome-app-install desktop files/icons
05:09   mvo     - investigate what to do with the dist-upgrader and early upgrading of apt (fot the breaks field). this was  blocked last week by not working dapper-backports
05:09   mvo     - user notification for non-free video drivers (these are bad m'kay)
05:09   mvo     - look into scim/xim mess (scim-chewing in edgy/dapper) and (maybe) create a ubuntu-l10n mailinglist for developer discussion about l10n/input-methods/font issues
05:09   mvo     - get apache logs to find duplicated HOSTIDs and forcefully reconfigure those *or* remove all old HOSTIDs data from popcon.ubuntu.com and upload new popcon that force reconfigure for all older versions to get a new HOSTID. this means we won't have valid data for a couple of days though
05:10   mdz     mvo: are we able to do ddtp translation using rosetta yet, and if not, is there a spec registered for it?
05:11   Kamion  here, sorry I'm late, just got back from the school run
05:11   mvo     mdz: rosetta has them, but its still manual in a lot of steps
05:11   mvo     partial because rosetta does not provide the needed api
05:11   mvo     partial because I haven't written more scripts to automate import/export yet
05:12   mvo     and there is some bugfixing to be done in the current scripts that deal with this
05:12   mvo     (my scripts)
05:12   mdz     mvo: ok
05:12   mdz     mvo: do you have anything for the beta todo list?
05:13   mvo     mdz: I don't think so, there may be stuff coming up though :) I would like to update the g-a-i desktop database
05:13   mdz     mvo: that seems like something which should go on the milestone checklist
05:13   mvo     mdz: does that mean I should add a bug for it and add it to the beta-milestone?
05:14   mvo     mdz: the dist-upgrader is very high priority now
05:14   mdz     mvo: no, talk with Mithrandir about adding it to the process checklist
=== Broken_Arrow [n=Julien@AToulon-152-1-80-228.w83-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
05:14   mvo     because the current breaks in the archive break the upgrader :(
05:14   mdz     mvo: hmm, is dist-upgrader not ready for upgrades to beta?
05:14   mdz     mvo: ok, that's important.  please open a bug and set the milestone so it appears on the list
05:14   mvo     mdz: not for packages with breaks, no
05:15   mvo     ok
05:15   mvo     will do
05:15   iwj     mvo: Is there anything I can do to help with the upgrader ?
05:15   iwj     I'm worried that this is starting to get rather late ...
05:15   mvo     iwj: possible, lets talk off-meeting
05:16   mdz     ok, thanks mvo
05:16   mdz     Kamion: next
05:16   iwj     mvo: OK
05:16   Kamion  Done:
05:16   Kamion    recommends-support: germinate backport for dapper-updates, needed on drescher.
05:16   Kamion    ubiquity: Trimmed about 150-200 off the bug list by means of rejections and duplications, fixed some common issues (including back/forward flow between gparted and the mountpoints page, yay), and started categorising the most common remaining bugs.
05:16   Kamion    milestone-rhythm: Made the daily CD health checks not mail the release team quite so many times.
05:16   Kamion  To do:
05:16   Kamion    usplash: Still need to handle tasksel enhancements to make resolution detection on fresh (d-i) install work properly. This will bite people who install the beta and then upgrade to Edgy, so is it beta-critical?
05:16   Kamion    misc: Other beta-critical bugs (mostly loose ends of console-setup integration; estimate a good day's work for these). Rename server to minimal (?) on the alternate CDs, and hoover up any other relevant ubunt
05:16   Kamion  u-cdimage bugs.
05:16   Kamion    ubiquity: I have two large classes of crashes still to deal with, tagged gtk-mainloop-crash and invalid-literal-for-int in Malone; need to figure out whether these are in fact duplicates, or whether there are multiple causes. Also want to deal with reserved usernames. All this is probably post-beta now.
05:17   mdz     Kamion: people who install the beta [from the alternate cd]  and then upgrade?
05:18   Riddell Kamion: did abattoir contact you about oem-config-kde not not having to use metacity?
05:18   mdz     how does tasksel relate to resolution detection?
05:18   Kamion  mdz: usplash is installed before xserver-xorg, so can't fetch the mode from xorg.conf
05:18   mdz     Kamion: is the ubiquity keyboard layout issue from knot 3 now fixed?
05:18   Kamion  mdz: we need to fudge tasksel around a bit to make that not happen
05:19   mdz     Kamion: how will that bite those who upgrade; won't usplash fix that up on upgrade?
05:19   Kamion  Riddell: yes, and I rearranged the code so he could slot in use of kwin or whatever, although I don't think I've seen a patch from him yet that does that
05:19   Kamion  mdz: usplash doesn't / IMHO shouldn't change an existing usplash.conf on upgrade
05:19   Kamion  mdz: sorry, which ubiquity keyboard layout issue?
05:20   mdz     Kamion: I lit the batsignal for gtk help and jdahlin came by; he might be able to help with the other issues as well
05:20   mdz     Kamion:   * The desktop CD installer does not guess non-US keyboard layouts
05:20   mdz         correctly.  This merely requires one to select the correct
05:20   mdz         keyboard layout when using the desktop CD installer.
05:21   Kamion  I don't think so, but I'll check; thanks for the reminder
05:21   mdz     ok, thanks
05:21   mdz     dholbach: next
05:21   dholbach        Done
05:21   dholbach            * finished functional version of the art-builder
05:21   dholbach            * pilot updates into Ubuntu
05:21   dholbach            * small fixes
05:21   dholbach            * telepathy packaging, reviewing, mentoring - we might quite some progress: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Telepathy/Modules
05:21   dholbach        To do
05:21   dholbach            * catch up with bug triage, or suffer from Sb of Doom
05:21   dholbach            * human-icon-theme update (added icons)
05:21   dholbach            * CD testing
05:21   dholbach            * investigate in gnome-bluetooth/gnome-phone-manager/libbtctl updates
05:21   dholbach            * revu-ing for Universe Freeze
05:21   dholbach            * apt-get.org
05:22   mdz     dholbach: art-builder is deployed?  or not quite yet?
05:22   mvo     dholbach: I'm happy to help with the apt-get.org auto-test-build script
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05:22   dholbach        not deployed yet, will do so asap and talk with Frank about it
05:22   dholbach        mvo: thanks a lot - I just didn't get around yet to debug it
=== dholbach hugs mvo
05:23   fschoep dholbach: looking forward to it
05:23   mdz     dholbach: is there anything in desktop-land which should be on the beta list?
05:23   mdz     besides the g-s-d bug I added already
05:23   dholbach        In my bug catchup frenzy, I'll be sure to mark bugs as beta milestones
05:24   mdz     dholbach: ok, review existing higher-severity bugs as well and see if anything should be added there
=== mvo hugs dholbach
05:24   mdz     dholbach: thanks
05:24   dholbach        mdz: alright
05:24   mdz     seb128: next
05:24   seb128  Done:
05:24   seb128  - load and load of bug triage, replied to most of new desktop bugs and took my backlog from around 370 to 240
05:24   seb128  - some desktopish updates
05:24   seb128  - some updates and fixes for gnome-java packages
05:24   seb128  - started fixing desktop bugs for edgy beta
05:24   seb128  Todo:
05:24   seb128  - keep fighting bugs flood
05:24   seb128  - fixing desktop bugs
05:24   seb128  - beta CD testing
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05:24   mdz     seb128: did the upstream forwarding push help with the bug flood at all?
05:25   seb128  what upstream forwarding push?
05:25   seb128  we do forward them all the time ;)
05:25   mvo     lol
05:25   seb128  there was no push though
05:25   mdz     seb128: we had a bug day where the theme was to get folks to help with upstream forwarding
05:25   seb128  yeah, and I didn't notice a real difference compared to any other day to be honest
05:25   dholbach        that was 2 weeks ago or something
05:26   mdz     yes, and the idea was that more people would then know how to forward bugs and would keep doing it :-)
05:26   seb128  dholbach and I and some usual triager did put some extra efforts
05:26   seb128  but not of new people or other guys did participate
05:26   seb128  yeah
05:26   mdz     sfllaw: is there info on the appropriate wiki pages with links to the needs-to-be-forwarded list?
05:26   seb128  we would need somebody pushing for that
05:26   dholbach        it's on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bugs and I mailed that link to some mailing lists including ubuntu-bugsquad@
05:27   sfllaw  mdz: I'm writing documentation now on the new Bugs/HowToTriage page.
05:27   seb128  nobody is spending time on the mater atm
05:27   mdz     sfllaw: after the meeting please, but thanks ;-)
05:27   mdz     seb128: it is a priority for sfllaw
05:27   seb128  I'm happy to read that
05:27   seb128  :)
05:27   mdz     ok
=== sfllaw hugs seb128.
05:27   mdz     thanks seb128
05:27   mdz     tkamppeter: next
05:28   mdz     tkamppeter: did you talk with pitti about the meeting format?
=== seb128 hugs sfllaw
05:28   pitti   no
05:28   tkamppeter      This is the first meeting in which I participate, as I have started at Ubuntu in the beginning of this month.
05:28   tkamppeter      Done:
05:29   tkamppeter      - Installed Edgy as dual-boot with on my laptop and reported first bug
05:29   ogra    tkamppeter, which we all appreciate ;)
05:29   fabbione        only one?
05:29   fabbione        that sounds cool ;)
05:29   imbrandon       ;)
05:30   Kamion  (we normally write up our done/todo items in advance so that we can just paste them; it saves time)
05:30   tkamppeter      - Looked throught the printing-related bugs (subscribed to ubuntu-printing-team)
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05:30   tkamppeter      - Answered to many bugs to get info from the posters
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05:30   pitti   we did some packaging tutoring ping-pong, worked pretty well for the merges
05:31   tkamppeter      fabbione, I have found another one today
05:31   pitti   tkamppeter: bug traige -> #ubuntu-devel, please
05:31   tkamppeter      - Done my first Debian/Ubuntu package: Gutenprint 5.0.0 final, thanks to pitti to introduce me into the methods of Ubuntu packaging!!
05:32   pitti   you're welcome, glad to see a printing guru stirring up edgy ;)
05:32   Riddell tkamppeter: apparantly there's some issues with KDE printing, which will be a post-beta priority, any help appreciated
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05:32   tkamppeter      pitti, what do you mean with "bug traige -> #ubuntu-devel, please"?
05:33   pitti   tkamppeter: I thought you wanted to talk about bugs, that's #u-devel stuff; sorry, that wasn't the case apparently
05:33   tkamppeter      Riddell, subscribe bugs to the printing team,
05:33   Riddell tkamppeter: will do
05:33   tkamppeter      and one KDE/CUPS 1.2 issue is well-known.
05:34   tkamppeter      Riddell, I will tell you about this issue later.
05:34   ogra    tkamppeter, i plan some improvements for ltsp printing in edgy+1 and would like to talk with you about it in mountain view ... (just as notification)
05:34   mdz     tkamppeter: the text is prepared in advance to save time because the meeting is large.  if you could email me after the meeting and prepare next time, that is fine
05:34   mdz     instead we will just welcome you this time :-)
05:34   mdz     tkamppeter, for those who have not noticed, is helping us with printing support in Ubuntu
05:34   mdz     tkamppeter: so welcome :-)
05:34   mdz     sfllaw: next
05:35   mdz     sfllaw: ping?
05:35   sfllaw  Done:
05:35   sfllaw  * Writing Wiki documentation
05:35   sfllaw  * Bug triage
05:35   sfllaw  To do:
05:35   sfllaw  * Bug triage
=== pitti hugs tkamppeter
05:35   sfllaw  * Writing Wiki documentation
05:35   sfllaw  * Hug day
05:35   sfllaw  * Buy a new laptop (the old one died)
05:35   mdz     tkamppeter: please collect your text and send it to me via email, we have moved on
05:35   mdz     sfllaw must be having connectivity issues
05:35   mdz     Riddell: next
05:35   sfllaw  Hullo?
05:35   sfllaw  Can you hear me?
05:35   ogra    heh
05:35   nixternal       haha
05:35   mdz     Riddell: your update please
05:35   ogra    sfllaw, no
05:35   Riddell I can see sfllaw
05:35   Kamion  mdz: I can see sfllaw speaking
05:35   sfllaw  It must be a NetSplit.
05:35   mdz     sfllaw: * Ping reply from sfllaw: 162.49 second(s) :-)
05:35   fabbione        mdz: so can i
05:35   tkamppeter      - Checked through the actual versions of Ubuntu packages and the bugs, a lot is too old, therefore asked for UVF ERs on: foomatic-filters, foomatic-db, foomatic-hpijs, HPLIP, Gutenprint, foo2zjs
05:35   kwwii   as can I
05:35   Mithrandir      I guess it's mdz having problems with his net. :-P
05:36   mdz     what a mess
05:36   tkamppeter      - (All but foo2zjs already approved)
05:36   BenC    lol, for once I'm not the one with the major lag :)
=== fabbione ^5 BenC
05:36   mdz     it seems like lag between the server I'm connected to (and some others) and everyone else
05:37   mdz     am I caught up now?
05:37   fabbione        * Ping reply from mdz: ? second(s)
05:37   Keybuk  * Ping reply from mdz: 0.35 second(s)
05:37   seb128  --- Ping reply from mdz : 0.98 second(s)
05:37   Kamion  16:37 [Freenode]  CTCP PING reply from mdz: 0.480 seconds
05:37   shenki  mdz: yes, you're caught up now
05:37   mdz     ok
05:37   mdz     sfllaw: anything on the broader bug radar which should be raised for the beta?
05:38   mdz     sfllaw: which wiki documentation did you write in the past week?
05:38   sfllaw  Mmm.  Not really.  There are really only minor issues.
05:38   sfllaw  I'm refactoring the BugSquad pages, so that it's easier to find info on getting involved.
05:38   sfllaw  Documenting our processes and such.
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=== pitti took the freedom to augment the worse bugs from Testing/Current with a beta milestone flag
05:39   sfllaw  This should make it faster for new BugSquad volunteers to get up to speed, and also make it easier for people to join Ubuntu QA.
05:40   mdz     sfllaw: ok, especially in the time leading up to beta, we need your eyes to pick out any serious issues we need to be aware of for the beta
05:40   mdz     sfllaw: so make sure you are keeping up with bug triage during this critical time
05:40   sfllaw  Right.
05:40   sfllaw  When are we getting those version fields in Malone?
05:40   sfllaw  ;)
=== mvo will investigate two "does not book up at all" regressions tomorrow from friends
05:40   Keybuk  sfllaw: edgy+7
05:40   mdz     sfllaw: LP1.0 + N
05:40   sfllaw  :(
05:41   mdz     sfllaw: we must work with what we have today
05:41   sfllaw  Fair enough.
05:41   seb128  mvo: what book? ;)
05:41   mdz     sfllaw: thanks
05:41   mdz     Riddell: next
=== mvo slaps seb128
05:41   Riddell done: lots of bugfixing
05:41   Riddell       kde ubiquity scrollview
05:41   Riddell       fix various issues with .pot generation for rosetta
05:41   Riddell       discussion with jono
05:41   Riddell blocked: ruby on ppc, can recreate failure on davis but probably needs someone more familiar with it to fix
05:41   Riddell todo: investigate Usplash art missing in Kubuntu and test dapper->edgy upgrade generally
05:41   Riddell       package kubuntu-docs
05:41   Riddell       KDE conference from friday evening to tuesday.
05:41   Riddell       Beta release
05:41   Riddell note: kde 3.5.5 and koffice 1.6 both scheduled for early october
05:41   Kamion  missing usplash> isn't that just misconfigured resolution, as above?
05:41   mdz     Riddell: how did kubuntu knot 3 turn out?  any bugs which should go on the beta list?
05:41   Kamion  or is it something more complex?
05:42   mdz     Riddell: someone more familiar with ruby, or with ppc?
05:42   Riddell mdz: pretty well, main problems all fixed
05:42   pitti   shall we consider amd64/nvidia usplash failure as a high-importancy bug which deserves rollback to vga on amd64?
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05:42   Riddell mdz: usplash seems to work on new installs, but there's that bug for dapper upgrades I need to look at
05:43   mdz     pitti: I thought mjg59 said that was fixed
05:43   Riddell mdz: both?
05:43   mdz     Riddell: martin pool admitted to knowing ruby; you know who the ppc fetishists are in the house
05:43   pitti   mdz: not fully as it seems, today I heard several more confirmations in IRC, and it's still happening for a friend of mine and me (i. e. all amd64/nvidia guys I know)
05:43   mdz     Riddell: have you asked one of them for help?
05:44   Riddell mdz: not recently, I can poke them again
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05:44   Kamion  rolling back to VGA will be pretty hard, requires complicated theme changes too
05:44   Kamion  I think we're quite deeply committed
05:44   mdz     who will help Riddell with this issue?  it's been blocking for weeks now
05:44   pitti   humm
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05:44   mdz     Kamion: mjg59 gave the impression it could fall back gracefully
05:45   Kamion  mdz: not until somebody teaches usplash to build in both bogl and svga backends into a single binary
05:45   BenC    if there's any ppc usplash help needed, I volunteer
05:45   mvo     pitti: I have a amd64/nvidia test-machine, happy to give it a go
05:45   mdz     Kamion: gah...I thought bogl talked to svgalib
05:45   Kamion  unless svgalib can do vga too
05:45   Kamion  mdz: no, separate backend
05:45   Kamion  s
05:45   Mithrandir      Kamion: that should be doable, shouldn't it?
05:45   Kamion  at the moment they share function names - There Can Be Only One
05:45   Kamion  Mithrandir: doable, sure, but not done
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05:45   mdz     Kamion: garrrr
05:46   Mithrandir      if it's a blocker for beta, I can do it.
05:46   Kamion  we really really need the existing themes to provide 640x400 and/or 640x480 images
=== BenC has done framebuffer+svga work
05:46   BenC    feel free to bug me
05:46   Kamion  fschoep,kwwii: ^--
05:46   mdz     BenC: would you help Riddell get ruby/ppc building?
05:46   kwwii   Kamion: will do
05:46   fschoep Sure
05:46   BenC    ruby?
05:46   Kamion  thanks
05:46   BenC    hrmm, I can try
05:46   kwwii   Kamion:  have one, but I did not include it :p
05:46   mdz     BenC: afaik usplash/ppc is happy now, but more testing is always good
05:47   mdz     BenC: yes, ruby...it's failing to build on ppc only
05:47   BenC    ok, I can do that
05:47   mdz     thank you
05:47   Kamion  kwwii: it's particularly obvious since 640x480 is the current default on all alternate CD installs
05:47   Riddell BenC: on 64 bit kernel ppc only to be specific
05:47   mdz     Riddell: you leave for the conf after the beta release, yes?
05:47   Kamion  and we may have to fall back to 640x400 on amd64/nvidia, see above
05:47   Kamion  that would be 640x400x8 in fact
05:47   Riddell mdz: before, I leave tomorrow evening
05:47   mdz     Riddell: sorry, you leave tomorrow and come back early next week?
05:47   BenC    Riddell: it fails to build only on 64-bit kernel, 32-bit userspace?
05:47   Riddell mdz: yes
05:47   Kamion  or whatever the old usplash resolution was
05:47   Keybuk  Kamion: x8 or x4 ?
05:47   Riddell BenC: yes
05:48   Kamion  x4 I guess
05:48   BenC    Riddell: should be easy, I have a G5 I can test out
05:48   mdz     Riddell: ok, make sure you review your bug list tomorrow and add any beta blockers to the list
05:48   Riddell mdz: ok
05:48   mdz     Riddell: if there isn't a bug filed for this ruby issue, file one and mark it for the beta
05:48   Mithrandir      Riddell,BenC: can you take the ruby/ppc discussion later/in #u-d?
05:48   BenC    sure
05:48   jbailey BenC: Poke me for other testing on G5, too.
05:49   mdz     pitti: let's discuss about usplash/nvidia/amd64 after the meeting, I'm not up to date on the issues there
05:49   mdz     Riddell: thanks
05:49   BenC    jbailey: thanks
05:49   mdz     Mithrandir: next
05:49   Mithrandir      * misc: released knot 3, fixed a bunch of casper bugs.  Working on some X bugs.
05:49   Mithrandir      * next week: preparations for beta, mainly X and casper stuff, help Henrik get online from his new home.
=== mdz watches the beta milestone page grow during the meeting...;-)
05:50   Mithrandir      (Henrik called me a few hours ago and needed a bit of help to get his DSL running so I'll bike out there tomorrow)
05:50   mdz     Mithrandir: how close do you think knot 3 was to beta quality?
05:50   mdz     Mithrandir: is the other known issue (mono and launchpad-integration?) fixed?
05:51   Mithrandir      mdz: not fixed, but I think I have a fix.
05:51   Mithrandir      mdz: beta quality> getting there, but not there.
05:51   ogra    for edubuntu it was far from beta quality ... tomorrows iso should be though
05:51   mdz     is openoffice installable yet?
05:51   Mithrandir      too many small things all over the place which need small adjustments.
05:51   Mithrandir      I don't think so.
05:51   Keybuk  has it even built yet?
05:51   ogra    there was an upload ...
05:51   mdz     Keybuk: it built, but was rejected
05:52   Keybuk  mdz: several built
05:52   mdz     there's an email in my inbox about it which I have only skimmed
05:52   Keybuk  and in fact, are still building
05:52   Kamion  there's another upload which should get past the binary reject it hit
05:52   Keybuk  doko nicely DoS'd the buildds by queuing multiple openoffices
05:52   Kamion  but obviously it will take some time
05:52   doko_   they are building again, yes Keybuk, I know, but I don't have private buildd's
05:52   mdz     oo.o+oo.o-l10n is unavoidable
05:53   ogra    more buildd power !
05:53   Keybuk  doko_: <g>
05:53   mdz     and those builds are needed to unblock CD production
05:53   Keybuk  throw more kittens onto the fire!
05:53   ogra    or dedicated ooo buildds :)
05:53   Kamion  cprov volunteered another i386 buildd from the dogfood farm
=== mdz shovels more coal into the buildds
05:53   dholbach        give doko bigger machines - he has enough space at home ;)
05:53   mdz     Mithrandir: do you have a list of those small things all over the place?
05:53   Kamion  if that's desirable, somebody who can say yes please should talk to him :)
05:53   doko_   just a multi cpu machine or two would help for the i386 buildd's
05:54   Mithrandir      mdz: no, sorry, it was more of a general feeling.
05:54   mdz     Mithrandir: it's probably about time to create a wiki page for the beta with a link to the ubuntu-6.10-milestone page + all the bits and bobs which don't deserve full bug reports
05:54   Mithrandir      mdz: I'll look into that.
05:54   mdz     Mithrandir: ok, thanks
05:54   mdz     Mithrandir: oh, are the stacked livefs builds all happy now?
05:54   seb128  mdz: what sort of bugs should be listed for beta
05:55   mdz     seb128: bugs which would make the beta suck ;-)
05:55   Mithrandir      mdz: I don't think so, I haven't seen any stacks at least.  Need to poke infinity about that.
05:55   mdz     Mithrandir: aarrgghh
05:55   seb128  mdz: bugs like "gnome-vfs2 lists fstab devices twice because it doesn't understand the UUID= change" a beta candidate by example?
05:55   seb128  I listed them for edgy atm
05:56   mdz     Mithrandir: thanks
05:56   mdz     ogra: next
05:56   ogra    * last-week:
05:56   ogra    - knot3 testing (as good as i could before takeoff)
05:56   ogra    - detriot ltsp hackfest:
05:56   ogra       things fixed there:
05:56   ogra         - xdmcp handling
05:56   ogra         - printer handling
05:56   ogra         - etherboot support out of the box (thanks jammcq)
05:56   ogra         - network swap support
05:56   ogra         - rdesktop handling (not in edgy, but we have a fix for edgy+1 to fully support that (thanks Gadi))
05:56   mdz     seb128: if it's very noticeable, yes
05:56   ogra         - floppy handling and localdev improvenemts (thanks sbalneav)
05:56   ogra         - X bugs with via driver
05:56   seb128  mdz: ok
05:56   ogra         - upstream packaging training ... ltspfs upstream is maintained completely in LP now,
05:56   ogra           ubuntu packaging is done in a separate branch by upstream as well
05:56   ogra           (https://launchpad.net/people/sbalneav/+branch/ltspfs/ltspfs-upstream)
05:57   ogra         - ltsp minimal ram requirements are 32MB now for thin clients, that gives many users that were
05:57   ogra           holding back the opportunity to switch to our implementation ! :)
05:57   mdz     seb128: just set importance appropriately; we'll focus on the most important bugs
05:57   ogra         - we worked out an upstream roadmap for further ltsp development see http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/ltsp_roadmap.txt
05:57   ogra    --
05:57   ogra    - ltsp-convergence: all prerequisites fulfilled now, merge of ltsp.org started
05:57   ogra    - fixed edubuntu-artwork
05:57   ogra    - fixed remaining known ltsp bugs
05:57   ogra    - fixed a nasty esd regression in ltsp that prevented the second user from having sound on thin clients
05:57   ogra    - ltsp-daily-image-tarballs - still need meeting with infinity ... starts to become urgent, will try to catch him asap if he returns
05:57   ogra    * next-week:
05:57   ogra    - find remaining bugs in ltsp
05:57   mdz     ogra: the ltsp hackfest seemed both extremely productive and extremely entertaining
05:57   ogra    - prepare the isos for beta release
05:57   ogra    - known edubuntu RC bugs that need fixage so far:
05:57   ogra       - bug 61688
05:57   Ubugtu  Malone bug 61688 in lsb "[Edgy]  "unbound variable" in /etc/lsb-base-logging.sh" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/61688
05:57   ogra         - apparently the portmap postinst is doing an rpcinfo -p in the postinst that takes ages to complete.
05:57   ogra           since thats only used to echo the portmap driven services in an info message to the cli
05:57   ogra           i think we can just drop that line completely from our package
05:57   ogra       - bug 61681
05:57   Ubugtu  Malone bug 61681 in ubuntu-cdimage "the preseed option for static devices in netcfg for edubuntu can go" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/61681
05:57   ogra         - postinst change for edubuntu d-i, we dont need to default to a static IP for the first interface anymore (one line fix)
05:57   ogra    mdz, oh, i forgot the initramfs issue you mailed me about ... need to fix that as well ...
05:57   ogra    yeah, it was
05:57   ogra    upps
05:58   mdz     ogra: what changes were made to get down to 32M?
05:58   ogra    that was bug 61668
05:58   Ubugtu  Malone bug 61668 in portmap "Building LTSP chroot stops during portmap installation" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/61668
05:58   ogra    mdz, automatic nbd swap
05:58   ogra    even its not our desired fully-automatic-swapserver it is fine for a start
05:58   Kamion  ogra: yeah, I'll hoover up that ubuntu-cdimage bug in my general pass, it's easy
05:58   mdz     ogra: congratulations on the milestone of ltsp-convergence, that's a great achievement for ubuntu
05:58   ogra    (thats why the spec is set to deferred, vagrantc and me will care fir it in edgy+1)
05:59   ogra    yeah
05:59   ogra    redhat is the first adopter
05:59   ogra    and warren even agreed to maintain everything in launchpad *g*
05:59   mdz     looking forward to the writeup on that
06:00   ogra    right, i wanted to do it yesterday, but somehow had no opportunity to sleep at all, to many bugs to fix before the freeze
06:00   fabbione        ogra: don't be so surprised.. there are more RH developers using ubuntu and lp that you can think of
06:00   mdz     ogra: 61688 doesn't have its milestone set; please set it if you consider it a blocker
06:00   mdz     and Importance as well
06:00   ogra    ok
06:00   Kamion  I'll look at 61688 straight after the meeting
06:00   mdz     ogra: thanks
06:00   ogra    jammcq_laptop and sbalneav started switching to ubuntu ltsp everywhere btw
06:00   mdz     fschoep: next
06:00   fschoep Done:
06:00   fschoep * ubuntu-art-polish-human-icons: contact Dave, now waiting for initial batch of icons
06:00   fschoep * firefox-themes-ubuntu: fix bugs (consider switching to Epiphany)
06:00   fschoep * looked into some other bugs
06:00   fschoep Ongoing:
06:00   fschoep * usplash-artwork: work with Seveas and msikma to get a new design in
06:00   fschoep * community-artwork: conference call with jmak and sabdfl tomorrow
06:01   fschoep * art-polish-human-gtk-theme: decide on color tweaks based on artwork direction
06:01   fschoep * sound-themes: got in touch with cbx33, will work on shortening sounds
06:01   fschoep * theme-teams: (try to) package their work
06:01   mdz     fschoep: switching to epiphany -> that is so not funny :-)
06:01   fschoep mdz: no comment :)
06:01   Keybuk  mdz: it'd solve potential trademark issues
06:01   Riddell fschoep: the text on the current ubuntu wallpaper needs moved up, it's covered by the panel
06:01   ogra    fabbione, but not RH employees that use it for distro work (yet at least)
06:02   fschoep Riddell: thanks for spotting it
06:02   dholbach        xulrunner+epiphany! yay! :)
06:02   fabbione        ogra: yup.. those too :)
06:02   ogra    oi
06:02   fschoep Riddell: I am trying to get it right ;)
06:02   fschoep But this does bring up an important issue
06:02   ogra    dholbach++
06:02   mdz     fschoep: sounds like there is s till a lot of artwork churn.  is there anything absolutely urgent which might justify an exception for the beta freeze?
06:03   fschoep mdz: yes, everything I think (not the right answer?)
06:03   fschoep mdz: I'm on the phone with Mark tomorrow
06:03   mdz     fschoep: no, not the right answer
06:03   fschoep mdz: We'll pretty much have to rip out what's in there currently and create new stuff
06:03   dholbach        mdz: I'll upload a human icon theme soon-ish (some added icons)
06:03   mdz     fschoep: if the artwork isn't final, we'll deal with that, but we can't have it changing as we're preparing the release
=== Keybuk blinks at fschoep
06:04   mdz     fschoep: please send me an email after the call with the outcome
06:04   fschoep mdz: We (I) tried the community approach and it kind of blew up in my face
06:04   mdz     fschoep: actually, scratch that.  send me the info for the call and I'll dial in
06:04   fschoep mdz: OK, I'll try to get that arranged with Claire
06:04   mdz     fschoep: thanks
06:04   mdz     and argh
06:04   mdz     kwwii: next
06:04   kwwii   Done:
06:04   kwwii   made different usplash aniimation ideas...in the end decided this is something for the future
06:04   mdz     kwwii: I hope you have good news ;-)
06:04   fschoep Keybuk: morituri te salutant ;)
06:04   kwwii   Made new window deco buttons, gradient for window deco, wallpaper, amarok theme, metabar theme, color tweaking in kde and the window deco, new panel background.
06:04   kwwii   new themeing elements in place. All in all we are very close to final
06:05   kwwii   Todo:
06:05   kwwii   akademy next week
06:05   kwwii   finish usplash (reduce the size/form of the logo, tweak progress bar graphics) 640x480!!
06:05   kwwii   about, app start, help page?
06:05   kwwii   throbber for konqueror?
06:05   kwwii   keep polishing where and when necessary
06:05   mdz     kwwii: any final touches for beta should go in tomorrow; it's likely that we'll be locking down uploads early next week
06:05   ogra    whats metabar ?
06:05   kwwii   mdz: we have accomplished everything we set out to do and are outdoing ourselves
06:05   kwwii   mdz: cool, I will make sure to get an updated upslash in
06:06   kwwii   ogra: it is shown in the sidebar in konqueror, kinda like MS
06:06   mdz     kwwii: thanks
06:06   mdz     doko_: next
06:06   doko_   status:
06:06   doko_   - edgy-toolchain: implemented
06:06   doko_   - edgy-toolchain+1: no status change, opening of edgy+1 needed,
06:06   doko_      test rebuilds of the archive needed.
06:06   doko_      planning a coordinated glibc-2.5 / binutils update for not later
06:06   doko_      than Oct 6.
06:06   doko_   - python-roadmap: need to go over the list of application packages
06:06   doko_      in main, mostly bug fixes / missed syncs
06:06   doko_   - python2.5: final uploaded, extension packages are built for
06:06   doko_      2.4 and 2.5, 2.5 will not be the default python in edgy.
06:06   doko_   - java-roadmap: classpath-0.92 based gcj in the archive,
06:06   doko_      packages providing jni bindings built natively, built
06:06   doko_      the core java packages as native (-gcj) packages.
06:06   doko_      gcj-4.2 should be removed for edgy (although we should keep it
06:06   doko_      for test builds for edgy-toolchain+1 until before the release.
06:06   doko_   - openoffice.org-l10n: delayed
06:06   doko_   this week:
06:07   doko_   - scan OOo bugs for printing related bug reports, discuss some
06:07   mdz     doko_: what's the latest from infinity/soyuz regarding test rebuilds?
06:07   doko_      printing issues with tkamppeter, start OOo bug triage
06:07   doko_   - prepare and upload OOo 2.0.4, the usual build failures; binary
06:07   doko_      packages will hit the archive not before tomorrow.
06:07   doko_   - check and upload printing packages
06:07   doko_   - python2.5 final upload
06:07   doko_   - some more gcc/gcj fixes.
06:07   doko_   - other: fix python-defaults breakage, finally got tired of xfs fs
06:07   doko_      corruptions on my notebook, reinstalled edgy, recoverd my email setup.
06:07   doko_   - started SoC summary
06:07   doko_   next week:
06:07   doko_   - continue OOo bug triage
06:07   Kamion  doko_: openoffice.org-l10n> "delayed" = "deferred"? or post-beta?
06:07   doko_   - OOo bug triage, focusing on python reports
06:07   doko_   mdz: no news
06:07   doko_   Kamion: deferred
06:07   Kamion  ok
06:07   fabbione        doko_: if you can give the packages i can do sparc toolchain easily
06:07   doko_   fabbione: ok, will do.
06:07   mdz     doko_: ok, I'll make an inquiry
06:08   doko_   mdz: I'll have to coordinate with jbailey, so the time line is not yet final
06:08   mdz     doko_: LP guys are forming a plan regarding opening edgy+1, I"ll talk more with kiko
=== diego [n=diego@168.7.253.150] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
06:10   doko_   Kamion, Keybuk: will outstanding syncs be processed a last time tomorrow before the beta freeze?
06:10   mdz     I haven't read the emails about the oo.o rejects yet, but I will read and reply properly; discuss out of bnad
06:10   mdz     band
06:10   mdz     doko_: python2.5 final tomorrow, otherwise should probably wait until after beta
06:10   doko_   mdz: is already in
06:10   Kamion  doko_: well, the beta freeze has already started
06:11   Keybuk  doko_: I did a sync run earlier, were there new ones you've added?
06:11   mdz     doko_: oh? I thought the last one I saw was an rc
06:11   tkamppeter      mdz, doko_, will Python be switched to 2.5 in Edgy? I hope this does not break HPLIP.
06:11   Kamion  doko_: but in any event I'm still waiting for the descriptions of the Ubuntu changes you're overriding for those ada and zope syncs
06:11   mdz     but there it is
06:11   Kamion  we need those in the bug, please
06:11   pitti   tkamppeter: no, it won't
06:11   pitti   tkamppeter: it's available, but not the default
06:11   mdz     tkamppeter: no, default is still 2.4
06:11   doko_   Kamion: ajmitch did this for the zope packages, yes, I ahve to do that for ada
06:12   Kamion  yes, please do
06:12   Kamion  I can do the zope syncs if mdz's ok with that
06:12   Kamion  (https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/59001)
06:12   Ubugtu  Malone bug 59001 in Ubuntu "sync zope packages" [Untriaged,Needs info]  
06:12   mdz     Kamion: I am
06:12   Kamion  ok
06:12   mdz     doko_: ok, thanks
06:12   doko_   then we can drop python2.3 ... even if it's universe
06:12   mdz     fabbione: next
06:12   mdz     doko_: yay
06:12   fabbione        Done
06:12   fabbione        * ubuntu-edgy-cluster: more bug fixing. Pending one bug in userland. GFS2 marke
06:12   fabbione        d as experimental. Not stable enough for production.
06:12   fabbione        * pkgsum.u.c: no progress
06:12   fabbione        * edgy-sparc: lots of bug fixing here to get to install and run properly. Left: silo on niagara isn't very happy and a corner case where initramfs is loaded underneath the kernel. One kernel SMP bug on Niagara discovered. ETA for fixes: sometimes during next week.
06:12   fabbione        * a lot of other bug fixing (mdadm in particular since it had a few regressions from dapper)
06:12   fabbione        To do
06:12   fabbione        * sparc bug fixing.
06:12   fabbione        * Bug fixing in general.
06:12   fabbione        * fire up sparc edgy rebuild of death.
06:13   fabbione        Note:
06:13   fabbione        * been offline most of the day. PSU on ws is dead (replacement by tomorrow) and
06:13   fabbione        got laptop fixed only a few minutes ago.
06:13   fabbione        (few minutes before the meeting.. now.. it's one hour ago :)
06:14   mdz     fabbione: please get the sparc bugs filed  and set the beta milestone so they're tracked
06:14   fabbione        mdz: ok.
06:15   mdz     fabbione: there was no sparc knot-3, right?
06:15   fabbione        mdz: no because i come back that week and not enough time to go trough all the backlog
06:15   fabbione        but we will have beta
06:15   mdz     fabbione: are there dailies?
06:16   fabbione        mdz: yes.
06:16   fabbione        and i test from netinstall
06:16   fabbione        so basically on the immediate archve snapshot
06:16   fabbione        archive even
06:16   mdz     have the dailies been tested?
06:16   mdz     the ISOs I mean
06:16   fabbione        not from me
06:16   mdz     please do test them before monday
06:16   fabbione        will do
06:17   mdz     fabbione: thanks
06:17   mdz     Keybuk: next
06:17   Keybuk  Done:
06:17   Keybuk  * TearDown: examined every package in main and changed some to not stop on shutdown or reboot
06:17   Keybuk  * Readahead improvements
06:17   Keybuk  * BootMessageLogging improvements, fsck output now displayed on console and removing "quiet" will do the right thing
06:17   Keybuk  * Usplash and splash down neatening
06:17   Keybuk  To do:
06:17   Keybuk  * No outstanding bug fixes for beta
06:17   Keybuk  * I don't yet have any release-critical bugs which have sufficient information to debug; but I'm sure I'll get some after beta :)
06:17   Keybuk  * Hunt for other bugs I can fix
06:17   mdz     Keybuk: prereadahead doesn't take as long as I thought it would
06:17   Keybuk  prereadahead ?
06:17   mdz     Keybuk: reading in the foreground
06:18   Keybuk  right, it actually takes less time than reading in the background
06:18   Keybuk  as then you aren't reading files twice
06:18   Keybuk  and aren't thrashing the disk while trying to do other stuff
06:18   mdz     it shouldn't read files twice if the list is sorted properly
06:18   Keybuk  yeah, it would in the background
06:18   mdz     but I think this way is more predictable anyway
06:18   Keybuk  cause it'd start reading the list, while other stuff started
06:18   Keybuk  which was further down the list, because the blocks were near the end of the filesystem
06:19   mdz     Keybuk: if reading in the background, the list should be sorted by order of access
06:19   Keybuk  then the disk head skips everywhere, which .... defeats the object
06:19   mdz     but I guess it wasn't
06:19   Keybuk  there's definite winnage from having the list read in disk position order
06:19   mdz     Keybuk: is upstart single-user pretty happy now?
06:19   Keybuk  seems to be
06:20   Keybuk  it should behave as sysvinit now, both for "exit" and "shutdown"
06:20   mdz     excellent
06:20   mdz     Keybuk: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.10-beta is a good starting point if looking for bugs to fix
06:20   mdz     s/if/when/
06:20   Keybuk  yes, I've seen it
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06:21   mdz     Keybuk: ;-) thanks
06:21   mdz     BenC: next
06:21   BenC    * linux-kernel-crash-dump: Will end up disabling kdump on ppc64 and amd64, where it doesn't seem to work. kexec scripts to handle dumping to shell to get useful info will be uploaded with next kexec tools (non-invasive changes to normal kernel operation).
06:21   BenC    * Last week (kernel): Bug crack down time. Spent 12-16 hours per day going through bug reports. Will be doing this the remainder of the release.
06:21   BenC    * Next week (kernel): Nailing down critical bugs. Promoting bugs that need to be fixed before Edgy is released.
06:21   BenC    * Current Major efforts:
06:21   BenC      - Merging of Mactel patches.
06:21   BenC      - AGP/DRM update (already done, clean merge, uploading with today's kernel).
06:21   BenC      - Core 2 Duo backports from 2.6.18 (mainly to do with JMicron controllers). This should be complete now. Dozens of people can't boot Ubuntu on Core 2 Duo because of this. I'm ordering a Core 2 Duo laptop in the next couple of days, so I'll be able to do install testing on this platform.
06:21   BenC      - PPC64 fixes for sata_svw crash. Fixed now.
06:21   BenC      - Still working on making sure the crashes related to apport are tested and fixed. Current kernel (upload today) has fixes that should handle one type of crash, and maybe the other. Major concern is that these crashes are obviously security concerns. The fixes need to be tested very throroughly, else apport may be in jeopardy for Edgy release.
06:22   mdz     I had a pretty hairy kernel day on my desktop yesterday while I was trying to get vmware working. hit the crash handler bug several times, and also some other crashes I wasn't able to capture information for
06:22   mdz     it's been stable since then, but I'm uneasy
06:22   fabbione        BenC: don't forget silo love for next week please :)
06:22   BenC    mdz: Did you get the kernel I built for you yesterday?
06:22   pitti   BenC: I'll give it some hard testing here
06:22   BenC    has the fix I implemented
06:22   mdz     BenC: I downloaded it but didn't have time to test yet
06:22   BenC    fabbione: Ah yes, good ole silo
06:23   mdz     it's on my laptop
=== Broken_Arrow [n=Julien@AToulon-152-1-80-228.w83-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Quitte]
06:23   BenC    mdz: apport related bugs are my #1 prio right now, I promoted one to ubuntu-6.10-beta
06:24   mdz     BenC: ok, thanks
06:24   mdz     zul: next
06:24   zul     Done
06:24   zul         * Xen0 and XenU kernels for x86.
06:24   zul         * Ported xen to dapper
06:24   zul         * bug fixing
06:24   zul     To do
06:25   zul         * Porting Xen to 2.6.17 before universe freeze.
06:25   zul         * Xen0 and XenU kernels for amd64
06:25   zul         * bug fixing
06:25   mdz     zul: anything for the beta hit list?
06:25   zul     nope not for me
06:25   BenC    mdz: Chuck's trying to get the xen package to build by build-dep'ing on linux-source-2.6.17 and patching it from there, which I think we be better for security updates
06:26   BenC    s/we/will/
06:26   mdz     that'd be handy, yes, if it's now updated fo r2.6.17
06:26   mdz     zul: ok, thankss
06:26   mdz     iwj: next
06:26   BenC    zul: Let me know if you need any help with that too
06:26   iwj     package-dependency-field-breaks: All complete except for the critical changes to update-manager, which I'm starting to get worried about.  See also mvo's report.
06:26   iwj     automated-testing-deployment: No significant change since last report.
06:26   zul     BenC: sure the patch is just a bit hairy
06:26   iwj     this week so far: Have spent it all wrestling trying to get firefox 1.5 into breezy as a security update.  Main difficulty was an obscure string handling bug now reported upstream, for which I have a hideous workaround.  Have had some conversations with timeless from the upstream community about this too but unfortunately not with any better outcome for us (so far).
06:26   iwj     todo: make firefox ship xpidl again (in -dev)
06:26   iwj     todo: anything but firefox! aaargh! etc.
06:27   iwj     Since I wrote that timeless has provided quite a bit more useful help and I think I can actually cross-port the real fix for 1.5.
06:27   iwj     pitti: So if you would reject that firefox upload from earlier ...
06:27   pitti   iwj: I can't; just upload another one with a higher version
06:27   iwj     OK.
06:28   mdz     iwj: timeless...he was making noise on the security group list this week about patches not being sent upstream; I looked over the changelog and it seems almost entirely ubuntu-specific. did he talk with you directly?
06:28   pitti   iwj: I'll do the locale package upgrading for breezy; it's a bit hairy and now I know how to do it
06:28   iwj     No.  I've been talking to him on IRC today and he didn't mention it.
06:28   iwj     pitti: OK.
06:28   mdz     iwj: anything but firefox -> interview prospective firefox gurus ;-)
06:29   iwj     mdz: Quite :-).
=== pitti wonders whether asac would be interested
06:29   mdz     pitti: I don't know who asac is, but we welcome all qualified applicants
06:29   iwj     mdz: I'll do that just as soon as I don't mind losing all the state in my head about these fourteen different ff trees I'm hacking.
06:29   iwj     mdz: Alexander Sack.
06:29   pitti   mdz: Alexander Sack, Debian's tbird maintainer and the guy who did the last round of backporting; he does know the code pretty well
06:30   iwj     We should probably invite him to throw his hat in if he's interested.
06:30   mdz     pitti: if you have a dialog with him, feel free to contact him
06:30   pitti   then again, he's aware of the job offer and didn't ask me so far
06:30   pitti   yes, I'm talking to him quite often, but he didn't express interest so far; will ask him more directly, I guess :)
06:30   Kamion  sometimes it does no harm to invite people explicitly
06:30   iwj     pitti: Yes, do.
06:30   mdz     pitti: perhaps a subtle hint ;-)
06:31   Kamion  the best people often underestimate their own abilities
06:31   mdz     Kamion: unless they're known to believe that we eat children
06:31   pitti   'We're screwed, fix Ubuntu, kthxbye'
06:31   mdz     Kamion: agreed regarding underestimation though
06:31   mdz     that goes for all the job postings currently up
06:31   iwj     Dammit, we eat children ?  Where's my share ?
06:31   mdz     tell your friends
06:32   mdz     we are looking for the best
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06:32   mdz     I think that's all for today
06:32   mdz     any other brief business?
06:32   Riddell no kees?
06:32   mdz     Riddell: I believe he starts next week
06:32   Riddell ok
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06:32   Kamion  he joined earlier and I think he's been watching
06:32   Kamion  (hi!)
06:32   pitti   Riddell: next Wednesday
06:33   pitti   yeah, I invited him to see the general format
06:33   mdz     ok, great
06:33   mdz     thanks, everyone
06:33   mdz     adjourned