SII/Meetings/2011-02-17

Meeting started by JackyAlcine at 19:00:14 UTC. The full logs are available at http://mootbot.libertus.co.uk/wintermute/2011/wintermute.2011-02-17-19.00.log.html .

Meeting summary

S.I.I and Wintermute - Recap
Development and Wintermute

LINK: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AtldExcu_OSxdE16NlZOc1VtTVlDS0R3dXlZSnZiWVE&hl=en&authkey=CKzipdgM#gid=0 (JackyAlcine, 19:09:55) IDEA: Split up the project list for appropriate team mananging. (JackyAlcine, 19:12:53)

Development of Wintermute: Linguistcs

ACTION: Look at Trac for project management. (JackyAlcine, 19:19:42) LINK: http://ubuntuone.com/p/cMj/ (Artir, 19:19:52) LINK: http://ubuntuone.com/p/cec/ (Artir, 19:20:11) IDEA: Consider adding programming languages as a means of a communication language for Panlingua. (JackyAlcine, 19:30:35) ACTION: Ataraxus brings in a diagram on how to hash words into real numbers. (JackyAlcine, 19:32:46) IDEA: Consider using MD5 and SHA256 hashing for word construction, if integer method fails. (JackyAlcine, 19:33:26)

Development of Wintermute: Databases, Semantic Relations and Neural Networks

LINK: https://docs.google.com/document/d/10MKbliLAFQy88lR5Tc-2r3EjDNEpPwH5LZCdP9wtls8/edit?hl=en&pli=1&authkey=COmsyLYH# (JackyAlcine, 19:35:16) LINK: http://goo.gl/Swuwn (c0d3m0nk3y_, 19:35:21) ACTION: Read A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning and see how we can use it. (JackyAlcine, 19:49:08) ACTION: JackyAlcine: Begin team design for Wintermute implementation (JackyAlcine, 19:59:19)

Development of Wintermute - Databases

LINK: https://lists.launchpad.net/wintermute-devel/png0jObHJckR8.png (JackyAlcine, 20:03:02)

Implementing the Linguistic Bridge
Final Words / Open Forum

LINK: http://undifined.dyndns.info needs help with iptables (UndiFineD, 20:41:42) LINK: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568334/ (UndiFineD, 20:43:04)

Meeting ended at 20:55:50 UTC.

Votes

Who are capable of programming a neural network?
- For: 3 Against: 3 Abstained: 3
Psych or Dev?
- For: 4 Against: 5 Abstained: 1

Action items

Look at Trac for project management.
Ataraxus brings in a diagram on how to hash words into real numbers.
Read A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning and see how we can use it.
JackyAlcine: Begin team design for Wintermute implementation

Action items, by person

Ataraxus
* Ataraxus brings in a diagram on how to hash words into real numbers.
JackyAlcine
* JackyAlcine: Begin team design for Wintermute implementation

* **UNASSIGNED**

* Look at Trac for project management.
* Read A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning and see how we can use it.

People present (lines said)

JackyAlcine (275)
Artir (192)
DanteAshton (86)
abbax (60)
UndiFineD (56)
meetingology (43)
c0d3m0nk3y_ (41)
Ataraxus (26)
phillw (17)
c0d3m0nk3y (10)
wolfpack (10)
gentoolx (10)
Daniel0108 (8)
pindonga (6)
DragonEyes (3)
Jagged_Jax (2)
JoseLuisRicon (1)
kapcom01 (1)

Full Log

19:00:14 <JackyAlcine> #startmeeting
19:00:14 <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Feb 17 19:00:14 2011 UTC. The chair is JackyAlcine. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell.
19:00:14 <meetingology> Useful Commands: #topic #action #link #idea #voters #vote #chair #action #agreed #help #info #endmeeting.
19:00:19 <JackyAlcine> #chair DanteAshton
19:00:19 <meetingology> Current chairs: DanteAshton JackyAlcine
19:00:26 * DanteAshton sits on his chair 19:00:31 * Artir gets popcorns
19:00:35 <JackyAlcine> Please say a 'o/' if you're here, for a head count.
19:00:39 <Artir> o/
19:00:41 <c0d3m0nk3y> o/
19:00:46 <DanteAshton> o/
19:01:01 <abbax> o/
19:01:12 <DanteAshton> four people with heads, everyone else has lost theirs...
19:01:40 <JackyAlcine> Once again, the agenda is avialable on https://docs.google.com/document/d/10MKbliLAFQy88lR5Tc-2r3EjDNEpPwH5LZCdP9wtls8/edit?hl=en&pli=1&authkey=COmsyLYH#
19:02:02 * DanteAshton wants a throne, instead of a chair
19:02:14 <JackyAlcine> #topic S.I.I and Wintermute - Recap
19:02:14 <meetingology> TOPIC: S.I.I and Wintermute - Recap
19:02:15 * Artir wants supersize pocorns rather than mini
19:02:40 <JackyAlcine> Who doesn't know what the SII is and would like an description?
19:02:46 <c0d3m0nk3y> o/
19:03:06 * DanteAshton makes a note to describe it on the ML
19:03:06 <c0d3m0nk3y> (me, if isnt a raised hand as i think it is)
19:03:29 <DanteAshton> Jacky, do you want to tell our codemonkey friend over here, or shall I?
19:03:46 <UndiFineD> here
19:03:58 <phillw> is here, was in the bathroom 19:04:54 * UndiFineD point to nixeagle
19:05:01 <UndiFineD> friend os Omega
19:05:03 <UndiFineD> of
19:05:16 <JackyAlcine> DanteAshton: go ahead.
19:05:18 <DanteAshton> The Synthetic Intellect Institue (S.I.I) is an organization designed to be one large software house, developing and assisting in the development of GPL'ed Artificial intelligence
19:05:37 <c0d3m0nk3y> i see
19:06:08 <DanteAshton> it is designed to connect interests developers and those with projects and ideas. Hopefully we will also be able to provide financial assitance, in some point in the future
19:06:18 <DanteAshton> interested*
19:06:44 <DanteAshton> any questions, codemonkey?
19:07:13 <c0d3m0nk3y> is this an intiative that is being built by the UAIT, or some external institute?
19:07:27 <DanteAshton> by the UAIT.
19:07:48 <c0d3m0nk3y> ok
19:07:56 <DanteAshton> many people have shown interest in helping out, and the S.I.I is a more 'professional' organization then just a Launchpad team.
19:08:08 <JackyAlcine> If there aren't any more questions...
19:08:30 <c0d3m0nk3y> none from my side, thanks DanteAshton
19:08:38 <DanteAshton> no probs
19:08:45 <JackyAlcine> #topic Development and Wintermute
19:08:45 <meetingology> TOPIC: Development and Wintermute
19:08:59 <JackyAlcine> As stated on the blog, we're big fans on software re-use
19:09:20 <JackyAlcine> So a few of us went out and searched for projects on SourceForge that could aid the Wintermute building process.
19:09:29 <Artir> :3
19:09:36 * DanteAshton notes to go through that list soon
19:09:49 <UndiFineD> it may need expansion
19:09:51 <JackyAlcine> There's a sketchy list of projects we found.
19:09:55 <JackyAlcine> https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AtldExcu_OSxdE16NlZOc1VtTVlDS0R3dXlZSnZiWVE&hl=en&authkey=CKzipdgM#gid=0
19:10:07 <abbax> is the list sketchy or the projects?
19:10:21 <JackyAlcine> the list, lol.
19:10:33 <abbax> that's ok then
19:10:35 <Artir> We still need to go through freshmeat and google code
19:10:37 <DanteAshton> both, to a degree :P
19:10:42 <Artir> and check the resulting list
19:10:43 <abbax> oh
19:10:51 <Artir> but all sourceforge was parsed
19:10:53 <Artir> by hand
19:10:54 <Artir> xD
19:10:56 <DanteAshton> Some projects are barely off the ground, others are fully developed and could go no further...
19:11:19 <DanteAshton> and some are just plain dead.
19:11:25 <JackyAlcine> And neural networks happen to be the most prominent kind we found.
19:11:33 <Artir> yeah
19:11:34 <abbax> that's good
19:11:37 <Artir> people do love neural netwroks
19:11:41 <abbax> we sure do
19:11:47 <c0d3m0nk3y> agree
19:12:02 <JackyAlcine> Indeed.
19:12:12 <abbax> can we split the list according to areas and maybe send it to the according teams?
19:12:17 <JackyAlcine> But you'll see in a moment something I ran into.
19:12:23 <JackyAlcine> abbax: very good idea.
19:12:27 <abbax> *appropriate teams
19:12:53 <JackyAlcine> #idea Split up the project list for appropriate team mananging.
19:13:03 <abbax> I would love to go through the NN projects to see what we can scavenge
19:13:13 <Artir> The list isn't finished yet. I would wait till we have at least freshmeat in
19:13:24 <Artir> just 300 projects there regarding AI
19:13:26 <JackyAlcine> Artir: There's about 195 projects.
19:13:32 <abbax> maybe even get more people on board
19:13:41 <Artir> we had 1000 projects in sourceforge AI list
19:13:45 <JackyAlcine> Cutting this down, and have more found is a bit productive.
19:13:45 <Artir> that went down to 195
19:14:11 <JackyAlcine> Right, any questions?
19:14:41 <UndiFineD> only specify usefull programs
19:14:47 <JackyAlcine> We're tried to.
19:14:54 <Artir> I'll volunteer for parsing 100 projects of freshmeat
19:14:58 <Artir> who's up for the other 200?
19:14:59 <Artir> :P
19:15:14 <DanteAshton> I would just like to annouce Watson beat the top players in Jeopardy; it is now the Deep Blue of TV game shows :P
19:15:17 <Artir> yeah
19:15:22 <Artir> I read that today
19:15:27 <abbax> saw that too
19:15:42 <Artir> It won like 77.000 dollars in game plus 1 million outside it
19:15:48 <c0d3m0nk3y_> read it, was super happy
19:16:14 <Artir> yeah
19:16:24 <Artir> I want to see what IBM does now with their DeepQA code
19:16:28 <JackyAlcine> On topic.
19:16:29 <Artir> but we're going offtopioc
19:16:30 <Artir> yeah
19:16:33 <phillw> can someone post the link?
19:16:35 <JackyAlcine> Any questions regarding projects?
19:16:42 <JackyAlcine> ಠ_ಠ
19:16:58 <c0d3m0nk3y_> i do not really know how i should get involved with UAIT
19:17:15 <c0d3m0nk3y_> other than these meetings, i dont have any "task" assigned or something
19:17:26 <JackyAlcine> That's something I was going to address today.
19:17:38 <Artir> c0d3m0nk3y_, go for the freshmeat parsing, yay!
19:17:46 <c0d3m0nk3y_>
19:17:53 <c0d3m0nk3y_> sure, im just not sure im qualified enough
19:17:54 <JackyAlcine> Moving on..
19:17:56 <JackyAlcine> #topic Development of Wintermute: Linguistcs
19:17:56 <meetingology> TOPIC: Development of Wintermute: Linguistcs
19:18:01 <abbax> I think we need a more solid task assignment method, many people seem to not know what they're meant to be doing
19:18:17 <JackyAlcine> abbax, you have an idea?
19:18:21 <JackyAlcine> o.O
19:18:28 <abbax> I'm thinking
19:18:44 <c0d3m0nk3y_> just off my mind, why not something like trac?
19:18:44 <abbax> I'll let you know as soon as the light bulb turns on
19:18:44 <JackyAlcine> Can it wait for the next session?
19:18:47 <Artir> A spreadsheet with tasks
19:18:52 <c0d3m0nk3y_> or i think launchpad itself has bug tracking?
19:18:53 <Artir> Or blueprints in lp and assign
19:18:58 <Artir> or bugs, yeha
19:19:06 <JackyAlcine> blueprints are very heavy.
19:19:14 <Artir> be bugs then
19:19:15 <wolfpack> Is there any project documentation available?
19:19:19 <c0d3m0nk3y_> and then anyone can accept tasks and set ETA for them?
19:19:19 <Artir> there kinda is
19:19:25 <JackyAlcine> wolfpack: There is, a bit in the mailing lists.
19:19:33 <JackyAlcine> c0d3m0nk3y_: I'll look into that.
19:19:38 <Artir> Should I paste the links
19:19:42 <Artir> to ABC of language here?
19:19:42 <JackyAlcine> #action Look at Trac for project management. 19:19:42 * meetingology Look at Trac for project management.
19:19:50 <JackyAlcine> Artir: Yes, please.
19:19:52 <Artir> http://ubuntuone.com/p/cMj/
19:19:56 <JackyAlcine> I need to get to that.
19:20:08 <JackyAlcine> I keep talking about how Panlingua can do this, and can do that.
19:20:11 <Artir> http://ubuntuone.com/p/cec/
19:20:27 <JackyAlcine> But I've encountered a serious development issue that of which can be found on the Launchpad branch
19:20:39 <JackyAlcine> lp:~wintermute-devel/wintermute/linguistics
19:20:51 <JackyAlcine> That's the branch containing Panlingua.
19:21:17 <JackyAlcine> The problem is that we aren't able to make a good hash function.
19:21:48 <JackyAlcine> The hash function is needed to ensure that Panlingua can pull words from disk without having to save a long string in memory.
19:22:21 <c0d3m0nk3y_> what about software reuse? someone out there definitely had this problem before us
19:22:21 <JackyAlcine> This is defeating a rule of Programmers' optimization before implementation, but it's needed for Panlingua to support multi language comprehension.
19:22:22 <Artir> I think the problem is the base64 that was proposed is way too much heavy. 10^10 words are a huge lot
19:22:46 <JackyAlcine> c0d3m0nk3y_: I haven't found an application that can generate a number from a word.
19:22:50 <Artir> A single instance of panlingua will use at much maybe 20, 30, 10 languages?
19:23:19 <JackyAlcine> Like 'CAT' = 0x0000302 and 'ELEPHANT' = 0x0339402
19:23:37 <Artir> And 1 language is 300k words, that is, for 30 languages 9000k words
19:23:47 <c0d3m0nk3y_> yeah, get what you mean JackyAlcine
19:23:49 <JackyAlcine> One language doesn't have a fixed size.
19:24:01 <JackyAlcine> I don't want us to code ourselves into a box.
19:24:02 <Artir> well, more or less
19:24:05 <Artir> it's a rough stimation
19:24:12 <Artir> Wintermute won't be using all of them
19:24:22 <JackyAlcine> At once?
19:24:26 <JackyAlcine> Perhaps.
19:24:47 <JackyAlcine> Some individuals that are panlingual do use more than one language to communicate.
19:25:00 <c0d3m0nk3y_> but we still need to support case for ALL languages at the same time
19:25:03 <Artir> That's why I said 30 languages
19:25:06 <Artir> or even 209
19:25:12 <c0d3m0nk3y_> number of languages simultaneous shouldnt be a barrier
19:25:13 <JackyAlcine> There's 2,600 languages known to Man.
19:25:21 <Artir> Who on earth uses more than 30 languages
19:25:23 <Artir> simultaneously
19:25:25 <c0d3m0nk3y_> dont think we'll support all these!
19:25:25 <JackyAlcine> Lol, I do.
19:25:28 <Artir> 30
19:25:28 <c0d3m0nk3y_>
19:25:29 <Artir> !?
19:25:43 <Artir> Creole, Spanish,English,French, ok
19:25:47 <Artir> that's 4
19:25:52 <JackyAlcine> On a serious note, we can scale down for now, but the case albeit is storing the value in memory.
19:25:53 <Artir> a reasonable number
19:26:26 <JackyAlcine> Since Panlingua is also very dynamic, it doesn't load and keep the word in memory, it uses it only when needed and free the memory afterwards
19:26:36 <JackyAlcine> \o/ for realloc and malloc
19:26:47 <c0d3m0nk3y_> why not expand the hash to include a special number for lang as well
19:26:59 <Artir> The parameters are length and base
19:27:08 <UndiFineD> frisian, dutch, english, german, french, spanish, swedish, norsk, finnish, turce
19:27:08 <Artir> c0d3m0nk3y_, I proposed that
19:27:18 <c0d3m0nk3y_> Artir, i second it
19:27:20 <Artir> UndiFineD, that's 10
19:27:24 <Artir> far from 30 or 20
19:27:34 <UndiFineD> eh
19:27:50 <Artir> But if we had a data like
19:27:56 <Artir> 000x00000
19:28:04 <JackyAlcine> For now, we can use the same base64 encoding that's used in MIME transports.
19:28:09 <Artir> or whatever, we could encode a language in some data and the word in other one
19:28:11 <UndiFineD> and what about programming languages
19:28:21 <JackyAlcine> UndiFineD: I felt someone was going to ask that.
19:28:25 <UndiFineD>
19:28:35 <JackyAlcine> That's a very experimental idea I had.
19:28:44 <Ataraxus> hello all together!
19:28:44 <Artir> To teach an AI a programming language
19:28:45 <JackyAlcine> But I had no idea on how to get it to work.
19:28:56 <Artir> O_o
19:28:59 <c0d3m0nk3y_> teach AI programming for it to write better programs?
19:29:02 <c0d3m0nk3y_> skynet anyone?
19:29:03 <JackyAlcine> Indeed.
19:29:09 <JackyAlcine> minus Skynet.
19:29:17 <UndiFineD> not so skynet is lame
19:29:32 * DanteAshton hears the Forbidden Word mentioned
19:29:39 <UndiFineD> lame ?
19:29:41 <Ataraxus> darknet
19:29:48 <Artir> lolz
19:29:48 <Artir> xD
19:29:49 <JackyAlcine> Lol, we can haddock anyone who says SkyNet.
19:29:52 <c0d3m0nk3y_> seriously though, i think teaching AI to write code is AWESOME, but wouldn't be a bit off-scope for what we want, in terms of "wintermute, get me my mail"?
19:29:54 <DanteAshton> ;violence c0d3m0nk3y
19:29:55 * DragonEyes stomps on c0d3m0nk3y with a dirty admin.
19:30:05 <JackyAlcine> c0d3m0nk3y_: it is.
19:30:05 <Artir> ;haddock Artir
19:30:18 <JackyAlcine> But an idea is an idea.
19:30:26 <c0d3m0nk3y_> JackyAlcine, off course
19:30:35 <JackyAlcine> #idea Consider adding programming languages as a means of a communication language for Panlingua.
19:30:52 <JackyAlcine> We didn't address the hash issue, though.
19:30:55 <JackyAlcine> Should we:
19:31:02 <JackyAlcine> 1) use base64 / url encoding?
19:31:07 <UndiFineD> JackyAlcine: seen in the other channel ?
19:31:15 <JackyAlcine> o.O
19:31:32 <c0d3m0nk3y_> UndiFineD, other channel?
19:31:48 <UndiFineD>
19:31:50 <JackyAlcine> that's another topic
19:32:02 <JackyAlcine> But I guess that can be used.
19:32:10 <JackyAlcine> MD5 hashes and SHA256 hashes.
19:32:13 <Artir> 2600 languages: 0000x000000
19:32:14 <JackyAlcine> but they get long.
19:32:22 <Ataraxus> JackyAlcine: i have an idea/concept how to handle the "hash" issue. I'll try to make a diagram in the next day
19:32:25 <Artir> wwith integers
19:32:26 <Artir> only
19:32:29 <Artir> in pairs
19:32:29 <JackyAlcine> Ataraxus: Please do.
19:32:46 <JackyAlcine> #action Ataraxus brings in a diagram on how to hash words into real numbers. 19:32:46 * meetingology Ataraxus brings in a diagram on how to hash words into real numbers.
19:32:53 <Artir> up to one million words per language
19:32:54 <Ataraxus> ack
19:32:55 <JackyAlcine> Ataraxus: Remember, you can use floats as well.
19:33:26 <JackyAlcine> #idea Consider using MD5 and SHA256 hashing for word construction, if integer method fails.
19:33:31 <JackyAlcine> Alright, any questions?
19:34:10 <Ataraxus> i'll grep this idea and build on that, but i need at least another n8
19:34:10 <JackyAlcine> Advancing.
19:34:15 <JackyAlcine> No problem.
19:34:18 <JackyAlcine> #topic Development of Wintermute: Databases, Semantic Relations and Neural Networks
19:34:18 <meetingology> TOPIC: Development of Wintermute: Databases, Semantic Relations and Neural Networks
19:34:21 <JackyAlcine> Now.
19:34:32 <JackyAlcine> Before I begin, I have to mention something.
19:34:44 <JackyAlcine> Can everyone see the Google docs?
19:34:49 <UndiFineD> no
19:34:50 <abbax> yup
19:34:53 <wolfpack> yes
19:34:54 <c0d3m0nk3y_> no
19:34:54 <phillw> nope
19:34:59 <gentoolx> yes
19:35:03 <Ataraxus> what docs?
19:35:11 <c0d3m0nk3y_> now yes
19:35:16 <JackyAlcine> https://docs.google.com/document/d/10MKbliLAFQy88lR5Tc-2r3EjDNEpPwH5LZCdP9wtls8/edit?hl=en&pli=1&authkey=COmsyLYH#
19:35:17 <Artir> yup
19:35:21 <c0d3m0nk3y_> http://goo.gl/Swuwn
19:35:37 <JackyAlcine> Thanks, c0d3m0nk3y_.
19:35:40 <JackyAlcine> How about now?
19:35:43 <phillw> can now
19:35:57 <Ataraxus> thx
19:36:07 <JackyAlcine> Can you guys see the comments?
19:36:12 <Artir> yep
19:36:17 <UndiFineD>
19:36:17 <c0d3m0nk3y_> orange ones on the right?
19:36:20 <JackyAlcine> Yes.
19:36:23 <wolfpack> yes
19:36:24 <JackyAlcine> Click on Wintermute Agenda
19:36:55 <Artir> Read
19:37:03 <JackyAlcine> Now, as I continued exploring how Panlingua could work, I noticed that neural networking became a bit ... eccentric.
19:37:09 <JackyAlcine> I didn't see how it was needed.
19:37:18 <JackyAlcine> If Wintermute can understand a language,
19:37:21 <Artir> If we assume Panlingua allows the pc to understand what we say
19:37:25 <JackyAlcine> and pull meanings.
19:37:33 <Artir> In order to anwer, it needs some kind of intelligence
19:37:47 <Artir> It's that or hardcoded comands
19:37:50 <Artir> *commands
19:38:23 <JackyAlcine> How would Wintermute learn to open a file then?
19:38:40 <c0d3m0nk3y_> well, i guess thats two parts
19:38:47 <c0d3m0nk3y_> teach it to understand the command
19:38:54 <c0d3m0nk3y_> and teach it how to do the command
19:39:05 <Artir> Hmm
19:39:09 <c0d3m0nk3y_> front-end understand open file
19:39:18 <c0d3m0nk3y_> back-end translates into vim file, for example
19:39:18 <gentoolx> If thought of user can be transformed to unified command, then neural network is not needed any more.
19:39:21 <Artir> We would have a commands module
19:39:30 <Artir> DanteAshton, thoughts?
19:39:38 * JackyAlcine waits.
19:39:52 <DanteAshton> Wintermute's fore-forerunner did use neural networks to do what we're trying to do for Wintermute
19:40:01 <Artir> I kinda see the point here, but we would loose the fun of having an AI :P
19:40:07 <Artir> *lose
19:40:37 <c0d3m0nk3y_> Artir, why?
19:40:49 <JackyAlcine> How so?
19:41:01 <Artir> Because we wouldn't be able to talk to it
19:41:12 <JackyAlcine> If we tell Wintermute "Use module #2393 to open files".
19:41:13 <Artir> Sure it would do X predefined actions
19:41:52 <DanteAshton> however, Wintermute's forrunner also had multple problems
19:42:02 <DanteAshton> hard-coded functions may help here
19:42:02 <abbax> sorry, connection problems
19:42:06 <c0d3m0nk3y_> how about if it learnt?
19:42:14 <DanteAshton> but instead of a conversationalist AI, we'd have more of a workaholic
19:42:15 <gentoolx> One thought may be expressed in many ways so neural network could be used to classify these expression as commands understandable to computer, I think.
19:42:24 <Artir> The thing is what do we want to achieve?
19:42:34 <Artir> The panlingua stuff alone is quite impressive itself
19:42:37 <c0d3m0nk3y_> EXACTLY, spot on Artir
19:42:38 <JackyAlcine> gentoolx: Interesting point.
19:42:47 <abbax> are we discussing the NNs?
19:42:48 <Artir> We could go for that, and later on, plug an AI in.
19:42:48 <c0d3m0nk3y_> do we want a chatter, or a butler?
19:42:55 <JackyAlcine> abbax: In and out, yes.
19:43:07 <JackyAlcine> c0d3m0nk3y_: We're aiming for both, come to think of it.
19:43:10 <DanteAshton> yes, abbax; and their usefulness in NLP
19:43:13 <abbax> an approach I saw, which I thought was cool
19:43:24 <abbax> is you break up the NLP into many small tasks
19:43:40 <abbax> and then using a generic module
19:43:43 <abbax> for each one
19:43:58 <abbax> you train them all concurrently
19:44:05 <JackyAlcine> ö.ö
19:44:23 <JackyAlcine> Concurrently, how?
19:44:31 <abbax> the research ended up with pretty good results and only did it with a few hundred neurons
19:44:43 <JackyAlcine> And what would be classified as a task?
19:44:51 <JackyAlcine> Is there a link to this project?
19:45:01 <abbax> JackyAlcine: they share resources so essentially they use the same knowledge to perform different tasks
19:45:16 <abbax> it's an academic/research paper
19:45:19 <JackyAlcine> Ah, very interesting.
19:45:33 <JackyAlcine> So, it's been implemented?
19:45:37 <abbax> it has been
19:45:42 <abbax> 3 years ago
19:45:42 <Ataraxus> i'll be glad too about an link to the paper, or a google buzzword for it
19:45:44 <abbax> and it worked
19:46:07 <JackyAlcine> abbax: You understand what you found?
19:46:13 <Daniel0108> JackyAlcine: I GOT IT!!!
19:46:14 <JackyAlcine> O.O my brain's melting.
19:46:22 <abbax> oh I know
19:46:40 <c0d3m0nk3y_> this is kinda over my head o_0
19:46:45 <abbax> the paper is called: A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning
19:46:49 <phillw> JackyAlcine: join the club!
19:47:02 * DanteAshton wonders why that name looks familar
19:47:13 <abbax> anyone that can't find it I can give you a cop
19:47:14 <c0d3m0nk3y_> DanteAshton, me too... was just thinking the same
19:47:16 <JackyAlcine> Wait, I've seen that paper.
19:47:18 <abbax> *copy
19:47:22 <abbax> yes you have
19:47:55 <JackyAlcine> Well, this paper is our blueprint.
19:48:00 <c0d3m0nk3y_> search for title, first result on google
19:48:02 <Artir> Which one?
19:48:08 <Artir> the above mentioned?
19:48:26 <DanteAshton> abbax; is that system capable of conceptual understanding, or at least conceptual formation?
19:48:34 <abbax> that was my feeling, I just needed more people to agree
19:48:34 <abbax> it's mighty powerful and promising
19:48:36 <JackyAlcine> Artir: yes.
19:48:46 <Artir> I'll give it a read tomorrow
19:49:04 <abbax> DanteAshton: it deals with semantic tasks if that answers your question
19:49:08 <JackyAlcine> #action Read A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning and see how we can use it. 19:49:08 * meetingology Read A Unified Architecture for Natural Language Processing: Deep Neural Networks with Multitask Learning and see how we can use it.
19:49:17 <abbax> successfully that is
19:49:19 * DanteAshton thinks
19:49:48 <JackyAlcine> UndiFineD, ideas?
19:49:55 <Artir> The main point is to decide if we go with or without without AI
19:50:04 <c0d3m0nk3y_> without AI?
19:50:06 <JackyAlcine> Remember guys, we're a team, your idea is as important as everyone else's.
19:50:10 <c0d3m0nk3y_> what would we be doing then?
19:50:10 <Artir> We could read that, and take the decision next meeting
19:50:13 <DanteAshton> Artir: AI is AI, NN or not
19:50:17 <UndiFineD> yeah, I see we get a multi set of different neural structures
19:50:26 <Artir> Well, NN
19:50:27 <Artir> I mean
19:50:29 <abbax> with some luck and/or niceness we might even get the researchers to send us their code so that would save tons of working hours for us
19:50:32 <UndiFineD> knops of specific funtion
19:50:38 <JackyAlcine> Define AI, c0d3m0nk3y_.
19:50:39 <Artir> Just Panlingua plus some structure on top of it
19:50:44 <DanteAshton> You can't, Jacky :P
19:50:45 <JackyAlcine> First define intelligence.
19:50:56 <DanteAshton> We're going offtopic...
19:51:00 <Artir> We are
19:51:03 <c0d3m0nk3y_> well, JackyAlcine i kinda consider NN to be AI
19:51:11 <DanteAshton> NN's are AI, but not only AI
19:51:18 <JackyAlcine> Not really, the topic's Databases, NN, and Semantic Relations.
19:51:33 <Artir> So we can have an AI without NN,
19:51:37 <DanteAshton> Yes
19:51:38 <Artir> with Panlingua
19:51:39 <JackyAlcine> And the Trac feature support will be up when the site's up.
19:51:39 <abbax> NNs will save us A LOT of work because we don't have to design anything
19:51:42 <Artir> and some sauce
19:51:45 <JackyAlcine> WHICH should be UP soon.
19:51:58 <DanteAshton> AI: Anything that acts in an intelligent manner....thats about the best defintion you wil lget
19:52:01 <Artir> I personally would want to go for the NN
19:52:05 <abbax> hence Generic, read the paper and if you're not convinced..
19:52:12 <DanteAshton> hard-coding it would be easier
19:52:13 <c0d3m0nk3y_> Artir, again, i second your notion
19:52:14 <Artir> In the long term, I feel it'll be better
19:52:18 <DanteAshton> and could mean a matter of months, rather then years
19:52:32 <JackyAlcine> Artir: The NN to do what?
19:52:35 <JackyAlcine> Learn a language?
19:52:43 <JackyAlcine> And attach actions?
19:52:45 <Ataraxus> I'm curios too
19:52:46 <Artir> JackyAlcine, for the fun of it
19:52:51 <Artir> plainly
19:52:55 <Artir> plus some extra benefits
19:52:58 <DanteAshton> *sigh*
19:52:59 <Artir> a chatterbot?
19:53:02 <abbax> DanteAshton: we could try both
19:53:02 <Artir> maybe
19:53:10 <JackyAlcine> Hm, I was trying to build an AI within my lifetime, not afterwards.
19:53:15 <DanteAshton> abbax; that would strech our resoruces...
19:53:22 <Artir> That would have been said by Dante
19:53:22 <Artir> lol
19:53:27 <abbax> DanteAshton: good point
19:53:37 <JackyAlcine> We're lucky with our current time size.
19:53:39 <JackyAlcine> *team size
19:53:46 <JackyAlcine> Greetings kapcom01
19:53:49 <DanteAshton> Abbax, do you feel an NN would be able to do this work?
19:54:01 <JackyAlcine> Please see our agenda (https://docs.google.com/document/d/10MKbliLAFQy88lR5Tc-2r3EjDNEpPwH5LZCdP9wtls8/edit?hl=en&pli=1&authkey=COmsyLYH#).
19:54:04 <JackyAlcine> ^ kapcom01
19:54:08 <abbax> DanteAshton: but I get the feeling some people are experts with NNs here so that would be misusing our resources
19:54:19 <DanteAshton> one or two..
19:54:20 <JackyAlcine> I was afraid of that.
19:54:30 <abbax> DanteAshton: it could, I can't promise anything
19:54:46 <JackyAlcine> To be honest, we might be able to do that, I don't know exactly who's who.
19:55:02 <JackyAlcine> Alright, hold on. We're casting a vote.
19:55:02 <DanteAshton> abbax; I advise you think about the matter: I've only seen this in an eariler project I was involved in, but did not see anything behind the scenes
19:55:30 <JackyAlcine> Casting a vote in.
19:55:31 <JackyAlcine> #vote Who are capable of programming a neural network?
19:55:31 <meetingology> Please vote on: Who are capable of programming a neural network?
19:55:31 <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
19:55:40 <JackyAlcine> Give a +1 if you can.
19:55:42 <UndiFineD> +1
19:55:42 <meetingology> +1 received from UndiFineD
19:55:43 <abbax> DanteAshton: can I speak on behalf of the project about it with the researchers that wrote the paper?
19:55:47 <JackyAlcine> Give a -1 if you can't.
19:55:49 <Artir> -1
19:55:49 <meetingology> -1 received from Artir
19:55:52 <abbax> +1
19:55:52 <meetingology> +1 received from abbax
19:55:56 <phillw> -1
19:55:56 <meetingology> -1 received from phillw
19:55:56 <JackyAlcine> Give a +0 if you're not sure.
19:55:57 <Ataraxus> +1
19:55:57 <meetingology> +1 received from Ataraxus
19:55:59 <JackyAlcine> +0
19:56:08 <wolfpack> -1
19:56:08 <meetingology> -1 received from wolfpack
19:56:10 <JackyAlcine> 0
19:56:10 <meetingology> 0 received from JackyAlcine
19:56:13 <DanteAshton> +0
19:56:19 <gentoolx> +0
19:56:24 <DanteAshton> 0
19:56:24 <meetingology> 0 received from DanteAshton
19:56:25 <JackyAlcine> It's a zero, no plus.
19:56:31 <DanteAshton> thought so
19:56:47 <JackyAlcine> Is that everyone, this vote is crucial.
19:57:02 <gentoolx> 0
19:57:02 <meetingology> 0 received from gentoolx
19:57:04 <JackyAlcine> nixeagle? Omega? kapcom01?
19:57:07 <UndiFineD> c0d3m0nk3y_: CensoredBiscuit
19:57:26 <DanteAshton> ahh, Jax
19:57:28 <DanteAshton> welcome
19:57:31 <JackyAlcine> Greetings.
19:57:34 <kapcom01> hi
19:57:42 <Jagged_Jax> Hey all
19:57:43 <JackyAlcine> Have you been following?
19:57:46 <JackyAlcine> #endvote
19:57:46 <meetingology> Voting ended on: Who are capable of programming a neural network?
19:57:46 <meetingology> Votes for:3 Votes against:3 Abstentions:3
19:57:46 <meetingology> Deadlock
19:57:49 <JackyAlcine> WOW.
19:57:57 <UndiFineD> haha
19:58:02 <wolfpack> oh
19:58:09 <Artir> lulz
19:58:15 <JackyAlcine> pindonga \o/
19:58:20 <pindonga> hey JackyAlcine
19:58:20 <Artir> hola pindonga
19:58:25 <pindonga> hi Artir
19:58:27 <UndiFineD> maybe we should do a channel notice
19:58:33 <UndiFineD> and redo the vote
19:58:36 <gentoolx> Nice votes
19:58:40 <JackyAlcine> UndiFineD: can you handle it?
19:58:40 <Artir> Yeah
19:58:42 <abbax> well, that's not bad
19:58:49 <UndiFineD> JackyAlcine: if time allows
19:58:56 <JackyAlcine> It's not accurate, but okay.
19:58:56 <abbax> it just shows in what what subteams we need to split up
19:59:02 <JackyAlcine> abbax: Indeed.
19:59:19 <JackyAlcine> #action JackyAlcine: Begin team design for Wintermute implementation
19:59:19 * meetingology JackyAlcine: Begin team design for Wintermute implementation
19:59:37 <JackyAlcine> #topic Development of Wintermute - Databases
19:59:37 <meetingology> TOPIC: Development of Wintermute - Databases
19:59:43 <JackyAlcine> NOW, the fun part.
19:59:48 * DanteAshton goes to sleep
19:59:58 <c0d3m0nk3y> sorry, got dc 20:00:10 * Artir goes to prepare dinner
20:00:21 <UndiFineD> Select * from DanteAshton where awake=true
20:00:40 <JackyAlcine> In order to have such a functionally intelligent AI, it should be able to access data very easily.
20:00:57 <JackyAlcine> Did everyone get the diagram I made of the database framework?
20:01:01 <UndiFineD> no
20:01:02 <phillw> JackyAlcine: MySQL is extremely scalable.
20:01:04 <Ataraxus> I think the "hash" issue will be coupled with the database design. i'm keyed up
20:01:45 <JackyAlcine> Ataraxus: It's mainly for Panlingua, the means of database access is more or less different.
20:01:58 <Artir> the UML?
20:02:09 <c0d3m0nk3y> i know this is prob off topic, but we should also try to think of including some "power-computing" techniques (openCL/CUDA/etc)
20:02:14 <UndiFineD> JackyAlcine: even a neuron can be stored
20:02:36 <UndiFineD> c0d3m0nk3y: agreed
20:03:02 <JackyAlcine> https://lists.launchpad.net/wintermute-devel/png0jObHJckR8.png
20:03:05 <JackyAlcine> That's the image.
20:03:11 <Artir> c0d3m0nk3y, +1
20:03:14 <UndiFineD> queued storage writers
20:03:17 <JackyAlcine> c0d3m0nk3y: And it's going to be needed.
20:03:38 <Artir> See what happens with VirgilBot and its speed. If we scale that up, it'll be quite slow if we don't use opencl or such
20:03:52 <Artir> *virgil, rather
20:04:25 <JackyAlcine> Any critique on that image?
20:04:56 <UndiFineD> lesser arrows
20:04:57 <Artir> So we have 3 main databases
20:05:09 <Ataraxus> yeah whats that, a class diagram UML ? Database arch? I miss a topic on this pic
20:05:14 <Ataraxus> ah, k
20:05:18 <DanteAshton> sorry people, laptop died.
20:05:27 <JackyAlcine> Ataraxus: it is.
20:05:53 <JackyAlcine> And yes, 3 primary databases.
20:05:57 <JackyAlcine> Stored locally.
20:05:58 <abbax> I would suggest multiple NNs, as modules that work in parallel rather than one big one
20:06:13 <JackyAlcine> abbax: Well, I didn't consider that then, before your suggestion.
20:06:21 <Artir> VIRGIL itself uses two NN
20:06:27 <DanteAshton> though one is defunt
20:06:30 <DanteAshton> defunct*
20:06:33 <DanteAshton> well...useless
20:06:35 <abbax> JackyAlcine: I thought so, that's ok
20:06:40 <UndiFineD> abbax: exactly what i said, knobs of neural concentration
20:06:47 <Artir> DanteAshton, the ratings one then is useless?
20:07:06 <DanteAshton> yes, because the ratings net for some odd reason always defaults to -3, the 'netural' rating#
20:07:14 <JackyAlcine> abbax and UndiFineD, would you guys like to lead the NN composition?
20:07:20 <Artir> DanteAshton, mine doesn't
20:07:30 <abbax> JackyAlcine: sure
20:07:41 <DanteAshton> it will after two weeks of continues, automatic statment generation
20:07:44 <Artir> DanteAshton, I've seen lots of different parameters
20:07:45 <Ataraxus> how are the databases marked? which symbol stands for it? i dont get it
20:07:47 <UndiFineD> JackyAlcine: only if time permits.. you know I am a busy guy
20:07:50 <Artir> :/
20:08:39 <JackyAlcine> Indeed.
20:08:59 <JackyAlcine> And the databases are only (as mentioned in a previous document) the General Knowledge Database,
20:09:03 <JackyAlcine> the User Database,
20:09:11 <JackyAlcine> and the Semantic Relations Datbase.
20:09:20 <JackyAlcine> Think of the GKD as what you learn over time.
20:09:34 <JackyAlcine> the UD as your personal information and your life's attributes.
20:09:49 <JackyAlcine> and the SRD being the bridge between the two.
20:10:13 <JackyAlcine> Questions?
20:10:23 <DanteAshton> yes. What is the meaning of life?
20:10:23 <UndiFineD> JackyAlcine: you remembered the list of needed classes ?
20:10:28 <Artir> DanteAshton, I can answer that
20:10:30 <Ataraxus> i didn't make it to read all the papers, yet. so thx for the comprehension.
20:10:32 <Ataraxus> 42
20:10:37 <Artir> DanteAshton, ant not 42 lol
20:10:37 <Artir> xD
20:10:42 <DanteAshton> if you say 42 I may have to kill you
20:10:43 <Artir> But it'd be offtopic
20:10:46 <DanteAshton> oh damn
20:10:47 <Artir> and a fun discussion to have
20:10:55 <DanteAshton> now I have to kill Ataraxus
20:10:57 <Artir> I reached it analicically
20:11:00 <Artir> *analitically
20:11:10 <Artir> * analytically
20:11:13 <Ataraxus> turn of youporn
20:11:23 <JackyAlcine> UndiFineD: Yeah, gah, I need to include that..
20:11:36 <Artir> so I'll rant about the meaning of live tomorrow :P
20:11:45 <JackyAlcine> ;fail | Artir.
20:11:47 <DragonEyes> JackyAlcine: You failed. Better kick yourself :P
20:11:48 <Artir> and you'll alla agree with me
20:11:54 <JackyAlcine> >_>
20:11:56 <JackyAlcine> Anyways.
20:11:56 <Artir>
20:12:01 <JackyAlcine> Moving on..
20:12:16 <UndiFineD> hotwheels
20:12:26 <JackyAlcine> beat that.
20:13:13 <Artir> Well let's continue
20:13:36 <DanteAshton> ///
20:13:39 <DanteAshton> ...*
20:13:51 <Artir> ¬P^Q?
20:14:31 <UndiFineD> Develop Semantic Relations ?
20:14:58 * DanteAshton waits
20:15:07 * UndiFineD pokes JackyAlcine
20:15:20 <JackyAlcine> Gah.
20:15:27 <JackyAlcine> yes, but that's superceded now.
20:15:48 <JackyAlcine> Wait, no.
20:15:51 <JackyAlcine> Web mining.
20:16:06 <JackyAlcine> Wintermute + Internet = Web 3.0
20:16:21 <Artir> JackyAlcine, +1
20:16:24 <UndiFineD> part of the classes ... curl grab, store crc32, extract data, store it together
20:16:52 <Artir> I saw W3.0 described somewhere a something like google, but that could parse NLP
20:16:57 <UndiFineD> you do not want to keep ful html
20:17:01 <JackyAlcine> W3.0 = Semantic Web.
20:17:05 <Artir> Exactly
20:17:15 <DanteAshton> though Wintermute might be the bridge to 4.0
20:17:20 <JackyAlcine> Indeed.
20:17:23 <JackyAlcine> I was typign that!!!
20:17:25 <DanteAshton> :P
20:17:27 <Artir> And what would be 4.0?
20:17:27 <Artir> :p
20:17:28 <JackyAlcine> *typing.
20:17:33 <DanteAshton> The web wakes up...
20:17:37 <JackyAlcine> And runs.
20:17:49 <UndiFineD> calls everyone a n00b
20:17:54 <JackyAlcine> Indeed. I'll send an e-mail with these data classes UndiFineD have compiled.
20:18:11 <Artir> DanteAshton, lulz
20:18:25 <JackyAlcine> What should Wintermute use to pull data from?
20:18:30 <Artir> WIkipedia
20:18:31 <JackyAlcine> Like data sources?
20:18:33 <Artir>
20:18:34 <JackyAlcine> That's one.
20:18:35 <DragonEyes> OMG! A wink!
20:18:43 <Artir> knol maybe
20:18:44 <DanteAshton> ;dance
20:18:53 <Artir> it's limited, but meh
20:18:56 <JackyAlcine> But DBpedia provides it in an structured fashion.
20:18:59 <Artir> Maybe dictionaries too
20:19:04 <UndiFineD> facebook :P
20:19:12 <JackyAlcine> that's three.
20:19:15 <DanteAshton> we could also consider the use of ConceptNet/WordNet
20:19:25 <JackyAlcine> four.
20:19:25 <Artir> encarta
20:19:27 <JackyAlcine> Anyone else?
20:19:27 <DanteAshton> which could be valuable resources
20:19:28 <Artir> just 4 the lulz
20:19:34 <DanteAshton> TrueKnoweldge
20:19:38 <gentoolx> Maybe WolframAlpha?
20:19:39 <Artir> wolframaplha
20:19:41 <Artir> there
20:19:42 <Artir> xD
20:19:45 <gentoolx> Hehe
20:19:55 <DanteAshton> Wolfram just has a large amount of data...
20:20:01 <Artir> that knowledge is the easier to get
20:20:09 <Artir> The other way is to google it, crawl, and datamine
20:20:11 <JackyAlcine> And does what Wintermute can do in its sleep.
20:20:12 <UndiFineD> wait, there was somone who built a spider here
20:20:17 <Artir> Watson's DeepQA would be nice fpr that
20:20:17 <DanteAshton> also, the START natural langauge service
20:20:21 <Artir> shame it's closed source..
20:20:25 <phillw> you may want to also consider http://www.oed.com/ if he wants to learn words
20:21:30 <Ataraxus> Wolfram claims, that deepqa is just a bunch of data and wolfram|alpha can actually compile knowlegde
20:21:46 <JackyAlcine> Knowledge isn't compilable.
20:22:08 <JackyAlcine> That's like compiling data.
20:22:24 <Artir> Ataraxus, DeepQA is a set of algorithms
20:22:46 <Artir> Ataraxus, to search through information and determine an answer based in context
20:22:55 <Artir> and the question asked
20:23:47 <JackyAlcine> Alright, advancing a bit more..
20:23:54 <JackyAlcine> If there isn't any questions.
20:24:15 <UndiFineD> such data should be stored compressed
20:24:42 <JackyAlcine> The Web 3.0 data won't be downloaded.
20:24:47 <JackyAlcine> Unless it's accessed often.
20:25:25 <UndiFineD> even when storing urals we could compress
20:25:29 <UndiFineD> urls
20:25:55 <JackyAlcine> Hm. TinyURL? or is that impractical?
20:26:01 <Ataraxus> just for the info: http://blog.stephenwolfram.com/2011/01/jeopardy-ibm-and-wolframalpha/
20:26:42 <UndiFineD> well I would store a full url in binary compressed form
20:26:55 <UndiFineD> along with a crc32
20:26:59 <Ataraxus> TinyURL has to store beside the "hash" the url too...
20:27:01 <Artir> Ataraxus, IBM's approach is basically to throw averything to the wall to see what sticks
20:27:25 <Artir> Ataraxus, it does work. But it's NLP is far more advanced than wolfram's
20:28:06 <Ataraxus> yep and i thought, that wolfram alpha is different, fram just search through data
20:28:14 <Ataraxus> fram=from
20:28:38 <JackyAlcine> Wolfram|Alpha's way of searching for data seems to be more accurate.
20:28:45 <Artir> JackyAlcine, true
20:28:56 <Ataraxus> but i guess thats off topic.. lets go on
20:30:14 <JackyAlcine> #topic Implementing the Linguistic Bridge
20:30:14 <meetingology> TOPIC: Implementing the Linguistic Bridge
20:30:21 <JackyAlcine> This is going to be quick.
20:30:32 <JackyAlcine> And merely an unproven proof.
20:30:40 <JackyAlcine> If Panlingua can understand language (a)
20:30:52 <JackyAlcine> and switch between languages (b)
20:31:16 <JackyAlcine> And use them concurrently.
20:31:21 <JackyAlcine> Then what did you create?
20:31:41 <Artir> spanglish 4 the lulz
20:31:43 <UndiFineD> universal translator
20:32:03 <JackyAlcine> Indeed.
20:32:19 <UndiFineD> no need for hoshi :P
20:32:54 <JackyAlcine> With Panlingua, Wintermute can eventually prove to be the epitome of FOSS(H) and perhaps change a lot of things.
20:33:15 <JackyAlcine> being able to speak on behalf of political leaders that don't know a particular language..
20:33:43 <JackyAlcine> that's all, food for though.
20:33:47 <JackyAlcine> Moving on..
20:34:30 <JackyAlcine> #topic Final Words / Open Forum
20:34:30 <meetingology> TOPIC: Final Words / Open Forum
20:34:56 <Artir> Well, so from now to next meeting what should psy/dev teams do?
20:35:18 <JackyAlcine> Well, for one, we need to split those teams up.
20:35:39 <JackyAlcine> Vote a +1 for psych, -1 of dev, and 0 those unsure.
20:35:40 <UndiFineD> I need some help with iptables portforwarding, so my server can act as a playground for bots etc
20:35:55 <wolfpack> -1
20:35:58 <JackyAlcine> wait.
20:36:05 <Artir> What
20:36:09 <JackyAlcine> lol
20:36:11 <Artir> split the teams?
20:36:14 <Ataraxus> 0
20:36:20 <Artir> +pi
20:36:21 <wolfpack> lol
20:36:22 <JackyAlcine> like find who's who.
20:36:24 <Artir> aah
20:36:25 <Artir> wight
20:36:27 <Artir> *right
20:36:32 <JackyAlcine> #vote Psych or Dev?
20:36:32 <meetingology> Please vote on: Psych or Dev?
20:36:32 <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
20:36:39 <Artir> +1
20:36:39 <meetingology> +1 received from Artir
20:36:43 <Ataraxus> 0
20:36:43 <meetingology> 0 received from Ataraxus
20:36:47 <wolfpack> -1
20:36:47 <meetingology> -1 received from wolfpack
20:36:50 <Jagged_Jax> -1
20:36:50 <meetingology> -1 received from Jagged_Jax
20:36:51 <JackyAlcine> This is because some haven't put names on IRC.
20:36:51 <UndiFineD> -1
20:36:51 <meetingology> -1 received from UndiFineD
20:37:01 <JackyAlcine> *on Launchpad.
20:37:01 <gentoolx> -1
20:37:01 <meetingology> -1 received from gentoolx
20:37:02 <abbax> +1
20:37:02 <meetingology> +1 received from abbax
20:37:26 <JoseLuisRicon> :P
20:37:28 <DanteAshton> +1
20:37:28 <meetingology> +1 received from DanteAshton
20:37:33 <Daniel0108> +1
20:37:33 <meetingology> +1 received from Daniel0108
20:37:35 <JackyAlcine> pindonga? nixeagle?
20:37:50 <JackyAlcine> Daniel0108; +1 is psych.
20:37:53 <JackyAlcine> -1
20:37:53 <meetingology> -1 received from JackyAlcine
20:37:59 <JackyAlcine> #endvote
20:37:59 <meetingology> Voting ended on: Psych or Dev?
20:37:59 <meetingology> Votes for:4 Votes against:5 Abstentions:1
20:37:59 <meetingology> Motion denied
20:38:01 <Artir> Daniel0108 is psych?
20:38:06 <Artir> ah
20:38:07 <Artir> xD
20:38:07 <JackyAlcine> Hm. Okay. That's good.
20:38:24 <JackyAlcine> Please add your IRC nicknames to your Launchpad accounts.
20:38:39 <abbax> can I just say two things? well one thing really: we need infrastructure a) a place where discussion will go on outside these meetings which I think aren't enough for roughly 60 people and b) a way to break up work into manageable chunks and a way to assign it to people
20:38:49 <JackyAlcine> We'll be moving soon in the future, from here into separate channels to prevent clutter
20:39:03 <Artir> We have the mailing lists there plus the future SII page
20:39:04 <pindonga> JackyAlcine, sorry was distracted by work
20:39:06 <Daniel0108> JackyAlcine: oh okay, I didn't know that psych is +1 :PP
20:39:18 <pindonga> +1 is dev?
20:39:26 <wolfpack> no its -1
20:39:27 <JackyAlcine> -1, but I have to make a note.
20:39:30 <Daniel0108> oh..
20:39:38 <pindonga> ok
20:39:39 <pindonga> -1
20:39:43 <Daniel0108> -1
20:39:55 <JackyAlcine> abbax: In terms of online resources, we can't do much until the site's online.
20:40:10 <UndiFineD> abbax: I proposed a number of classes to be build
20:40:16 <UndiFineD> or taken
20:40:25 <JackyAlcine> Launchpad is quite a hassle in terms of building projects
20:40:32 <abbax> JackyAlcine: how about a wiki or a forum? something to keep the discussion going otuside the meetings?
20:40:44 <abbax> *outside
20:40:45 <JackyAlcine> abbax: All can be done when we get a site working.. =/
20:41:26 <JackyAlcine> DanteAshton has recommended that Psych meetings be held on Tuesdays at 7 PM UTC.
20:41:32 <Artir> JackyAlcine, is someone already working on it?
20:41:42 <UndiFineD> http://undifined.dyndns.info needs help with iptables
20:41:46 <JackyAlcine> Artir: Well, define 'work'.
20:41:56 <JackyAlcine> it does. >_<
20:42:01 <Artir> :P
20:42:28 <Artir> JackyAlcine, person working to get it done: person that makes the time till the page is there smaller.
20:42:29 <Artir> That
20:42:42 <Artir> *shorter,rether
20:42:44 <Artir> *rather
20:42:45 <Artir> >.<
20:42:54 <JackyAlcine> I have the site's code on my computer, we have server space, and we have a domain name.
20:43:04 <UndiFineD> http://paste.ubuntu.com/568334/
20:43:06 <JackyAlcine> We just need to link the tthree.
20:43:36 <Artir> Well, that is easy isn't it?
20:43:44 <Artir> Put A in B, then point C to B
20:44:12 <JackyAlcine> A bit, but I'll explain the complication later.
20:44:18 <JackyAlcine> Any questions, guys?
20:44:35 <Artir> Tasks for us?
20:44:41 <DanteAshton> for who?
20:44:48 <DanteAshton> Psych or dev?
20:44:55 <Artir> psych, in my case
20:45:02 <Artir> but also dev, for those there
20:45:11 <DanteAshton> Psych team: Learn about the Uncanny Valley, and the "AI Effect"
20:45:29 <DanteAshton> It will be discussed on Tuesday, in here, 6PM UTC
20:45:53 <abbax> people in the psych team interested in NNs read the paper I talked about earlier
20:45:57 <abbax> please
20:46:07 <Artir> abbax, thanks
20:46:08 <JackyAlcine> abbax: Mail it to the mailing list both psych and UAIT
20:46:18 <abbax> ok
20:46:20 <DanteAshton> oh, one last thing people
20:46:26 <JackyAlcine> dev: Tinker with lp:~wintermute-devel/wintermute/linguistics; any progress should be either mentioned on the mailing list and/or in this channel.
20:46:27 <DanteAshton> When the SII is up and running
20:46:40 <DanteAshton> this room, plus the UAIT, will be decommisioned
20:46:45 <DanteAshton> and everyone will be migrated over
20:46:53 <JackyAlcine> EVERYONE.
20:47:02 <phillw> Can I also ask a couple of questions?
20:47:07 <JackyAlcine> of course.
20:47:08 <DanteAshton> go ahead, phillw
20:47:17 * JackyAlcine pushes DanteAshton
20:47:20 * DanteAshton swears him and Jacky are brothers
20:47:21 <JackyAlcine> :p
20:47:21 <Artir> DanteAshton, Will we have our own IRC server?
20:47:34 <DanteAshton> Jacky?
20:47:35 <JackyAlcine> If only, Artir. lol
20:47:39 <DanteAshton> :P
20:47:41 <phillw> 1) do you want me completely lock down the Lab1 area for you?
20:47:45 <UndiFineD> I could set one up
20:47:51 <JackyAlcine> phillw: I have to PM you about that.
20:47:55 <abbax> is the division in teams visible somewhere on the launchpad page? and if not can we make it so?
20:47:57 <Artir> What's the point of another IRC?
20:48:04 <Artir> freenode is *usually* stable
20:48:05 <Artir> :P
20:48:14 <JackyAlcine> abbax: For Dev and Psych, yes.
20:48:35 <Artir> we were supposed to be given cool mails with the teams in them :P
20:48:43 <phillw> You can also have a password protected on my forum, if you so wish.
20:49:19 <phillw> do you want a wiki page setting up on the ubuntu area?
20:49:43 <JackyAlcine> Everyone in Psych needs to PM DanteAshton, so we can have a head count.
20:49:50 <DanteAshton> Good call, Jacky
20:49:55 <UndiFineD> phillw: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SII
20:50:15 <JackyAlcine> philw for the time-being sure, but we'll need to move eventually.
20:50:54 <phillw> JackyAlcine: I can set you a dedicated forum up, it takes little time
20:51:10 <JackyAlcine> Time's as plentiful as we make it.
20:51:21 <JackyAlcine> Is it exportable?
20:51:24 <DanteAshton> Not for me it bloody well isn't...
20:51:50 <JackyAlcine> =>>>>>>
20:52:00 <phillw> JackyAlcine: yes any founder can download the database of posts / comments etc.
20:52:15 <JackyAlcine> Okay then, and it's phpBB, no?
20:52:26 <phillw> JackyAlcine: indeed it is.
20:52:36 <JackyAlcine> We're in business.
20:53:05 <Ataraxus> i'm out!
20:53:10 <JackyAlcine> \o
20:53:14 <phillw> there is no point in having an admin who cannot admin :P
20:53:17 <JackyAlcine> No more questions?
20:53:43 <abbax> not for now
20:54:01 <Daniel0108> no, not really.
20:54:27 <JackyAlcine> In that.
20:54:33 <JackyAlcine> I hereby declare this meeting ended.
20:54:37 <JackyAlcine> Wait.
20:54:44 <JackyAlcine> Next meeting, next week, same time.
20:54:48 <Daniel0108>
20:54:50 <DanteAshton> 8 UTC? :P
20:54:50 <JackyAlcine> Cool?
20:54:56 <JackyAlcine> 8 PM UTC.
20:54:57 <wolfpack> yes
20:54:57 <Daniel0108> yes
20:55:11 <gentoolx> yes
20:55:15 <Artir> cool
20:55:16 <Artir> z
20:55:21 <phillw> I think my padawans would like to know what style etc you want for new website, but that can be done out of meeting.
20:55:35 <JackyAlcine> Ooh, I have that covered, lol
20:55:40 <JackyAlcine> And in that case,
20:55:43 <DanteAshton> That wallpaper should give an idea...
20:55:46 <JackyAlcine> this meeting is hereby ended.
20:55:50 <JackyAlcine> #endmeeting

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