This is the 20th meeting of the UKTeam, starting at 19:30 GMT and finishing at 20:30 GMT

Attendance

38 members were present

Agenda

Minutes

• Mootbot summary

IRC LOGS

Started logging meeting in #ubuntu-uk
[13:30:12] <brobostigon> present
[13:30:20] <ianto> Present
[13:30:24] <Daviey> present
[13:30:27] <daubers> present
[13:30:29] <freesitebuilder> present
[13:30:35] <AlanBell> Present
[13:30:37] <popey> present
[13:30:38] <Daviey> (everyone type present who is paying attention, and here for the meeting)
[13:30:43] <etali> present
[13:30:45] <jpds> presents?
[13:30:45] <MunkyJunky> present
[13:30:46] <automatical> present
[13:30:47] <Mez> present
[13:30:49] <dutchie> present
[13:30:50] <laeg> popey
[13:30:54] <DJones> present
[13:30:56] <laeg> know much about ssh?
[13:30:58] <jonathan3> I'm only paying attention, but...
[13:30:59] <jonathan3> present
[13:31:01] <andy101> present
[13:31:10] <laeg> sorry you're having a meeting./
[13:31:17] <zleap> what meeting
[13:31:18] <daubers> Cor, thats a good turnout!
[13:31:20] <ianto> laeg: There's an IRC meeting taking place at the moment, could this wait a little or move to the #ubuntu support channel?
[13:31:25] <Daviey> laeg: We've just started a meeting, if you need support would be better to go to #ubuntu or wait until the end of the meeting
[13:31:26] <laeg> it can wait :)
[13:31:27] <laeg> sorry!
[13:31:31] <ianto> OK no worries :)
[13:31:36] <daubers> [TOPIC] Review of events from '09
[13:31:54] <zleap> i will be 1/2 here
[13:32:12] <daubers> Righty, I thought it best to go over what we did last year before planning for next year
[13:32:30] <daubers> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/2009events
[13:32:37] <Daviey> (for reference the Agenda is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeamMeetingAgenda)
[13:32:49] <daubers> Thanks Daviey (my bad)
[13:33:26] <Mez> daubers: You're missing the "Global Jam" from October
[13:33:42] <popey> Mez: did we do anything for that event?
[13:33:42] <daubers> The 2 biggest things that have occured that need mention of course is to thank popey, Daviey, Ciemon, laura, and tony for the last season of the podcast
[13:33:44] <Daviey> So, 2009 brought us the most real life events the team has yet had.
[13:33:57] <Mez> popey: yes, we did....
[13:34:12] * ianto remembers Mez on webcam feed at global jam
[13:34:16] <daubers> Mez: Thought I put it in... feel free to add it
[13:34:22] <popey> ianto: burned into your brain huh?
[13:34:24] <Mez> ianto: http://sourceguru.org/videos/7/ <--
[13:34:58] <ianto> Mez: Yeah the Welsh were observing you and we wore the same shirt
[13:35:10] * issyl0 is here now
[13:35:18] <daubers> Can anyone see anything else that is missing from that list?
[13:35:32] <AlanBell> so part of the reason for documenting the events done in the year is that at some point the loco team will go for it's annual re-approval
[13:35:36] <Daviey> daubers:
[13:35:43] <Daviey> Cloud Expo Europe - also had a stand.
[13:36:00] <daubers> [ACTION] People to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/2009events to make it accurate
[13:36:32] <daubers> I didn't know teams had to be reapproved each year
[13:36:39] <popey> not each year, but regularly
[13:36:48] <popey> its somethin the loco council is only just starting to do
[13:37:30] <daubers> Is it worthwhile making a proforma to document next years events as we go along then? Make sure we don't miss anything
[13:37:37] <etali> how much activity does the loco council expect?
[13:38:01] <popey> etali: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoGettingApproved
[13:38:16] <etali> popey: thanks
[13:38:17] <Daviey> Is there anything else on this topic?
[13:38:37] <AlanBell> so there is a wiki page for re-approval to be completed/updated
[13:38:37] <popey> might be nice to announce the review of the year activity on the mailing list?
[13:38:40] <Daviey> any questions and/or comments?
[13:38:44] <popey> AlanBell: not yet
[13:38:59] <AlanBell> ok, should someone take starting such a page as an action then?
[13:39:09] <daubers> Daviey: Fancy writing a year in review thing as official head of the LoCo?
[13:39:16] <issyl0> That'd be good, what popey said.
[13:39:17] <Daviey> daubers: happy to.
[13:39:36] <daubers> [ACTION] Daviey to write a year in review post to the mailing list
[13:39:40] <popey> AlanBell: wait till the loco council have said what they're after
[13:39:46] <Mez> To be fair, it's quite obvious just from here and the podcast that we're active. I don't see any reason why people wouldn't think we're active!
[13:39:48] <AlanBell> popey: ok, thanks.
[13:40:01] <daubers> Ok, anything else on this topic?
[13:40:02] <issyl0> Mez: true!
[13:40:16] <Daviey> Mez: it's importiant to document, some of the most active people in the loco were unaware events were held in October.
[13:40:17] <gord> Daviey, prolly worth blogging it as well so it gets on the ubuntu planet :)
[13:40:24] <popey> gord: +1
[13:40:32] <Daviey> gord: good thinking.
[13:40:52] <Mez> daubers: I think that the popularity of the UUPC should be noted and congratulations given to those concerned ;)
[13:41:07] <Daviey> Mez: keep up!
[13:41:15] <Daviey> 19:33:43 < daubers> The 2 biggest things that have occured that need mention of course is to thank popey, Daviey, Ciemon, laura, and tony for the last season of the podcast
[13:41:15] <daubers> [ACTION] UUPC to feel smug and proud of their achievments
[13:41:24] <daubers> Mez: That do?
[13:41:27] <issyl0> Hehehe
[13:41:30] <czajkowski> heh
[13:41:33] <Mez> daubers: I missed that
[13:41:33] <popey> heh
[13:41:34] <Daviey> heh, thanks daubers
[13:41:35] <Mez> and yes :D
[13:41:37] <popey> popularity..
[13:41:40] <issyl0> And yeah, UUPC is great :)
[13:41:43] <daubers> Also, well done with the partial running of Oggcamp
[13:42:02] <popey> thanks
[13:42:07] <daubers> That goes over to the Outlaws too :)
[13:42:08] <Mez> 3 cheers ?
[13:42:20] <Mez> :P
[13:42:23] <daubers> :P
[13:42:23] <popey> hip_hip_hooray^3
[13:42:41] <Mez> popey: s/\^/*/
[13:42:42] <czajkowski> yes they are rather entertaining
[13:42:55] <Daviey> Just as a note, UUPC jhas had in the region of 78,9161 downloads
[13:43:07] <popey> i think you mean 789,161 :)
[13:43:12] <Daviey> err, yes
[13:43:14] <issyl0> Daviey: wow!
[13:43:20] <matti> Heh.
[13:43:23] <daubers> It's also worth noting that we now have an average of ~100 people active in here, and still have a moderatley active mailing list (While we're on statistics)
[13:43:25] <Mez> roll on 1,000,000
[13:43:34] <gord> we upped the number of release parties we have this year too, i think we are at 300% of what we used to have now! (no one else do the maths on that, it sounds better as 300%)
[13:43:41] <daubers> Daviey: There may be cake when you reach 1,000,000
[13:43:53] <dutchie> will there be cake for the mirrors?
[13:43:58] <Mez> daubers: while [1]; wget ....
[13:44:01] <Daviey> daubers: oh, yes - we need to improve the cake throughput.
[13:44:08] <popey> there are 664 people on the mailing list
[13:44:18] <matti> Mez: Same IP address.
[13:44:19] <matti> ;p
[13:44:25] <issyl0> *sigh* all this talk of cake!
[13:44:27] <matti> Mez: But that can be solved...
[13:44:28] <matti> ;p
[13:44:48] <Mez> matti: We just need to get the freenode spammers to lend us their botnets
[13:44:48] <czajkowski> always with the cake comments
[13:44:52] <Daviey> 622 members of the ubuntu-uk launchpad team.
[13:44:58] <daubers> Ok, so in general 2009 was a significant improvement for the LoCo :)
[13:45:02] <daubers> Lets move on shall we?
[13:45:05] <AlanBell> yes
[13:45:06] <popey> yup
[13:45:10] <Daviey> daubers: sounds good.
[13:45:15] <daubers> [TOPIC] Plan for events to be held in '10
[13:45:31] <matti> Mez: I could ask every single machine I have access to at work to download a file.
[13:45:32] <AlanBell> etherpad linkie please
[13:45:37] <matti> Mez: But this may actually DDoS UUPC ;]
[13:45:42] <popey> http://etherpad.com/tL2xvcuQXK
[13:45:47] <daubers> [LINK] http://etherpad.com/tL2xvcuQXK
[13:45:53] <Mez> We've already had confirmation that Linux Emporium are happy to host next year's Jams
[13:45:57] <daubers> popey: Beat me
[13:46:05] <issyl0> Hmm well there definitely needs to be more real life meets.. although you're working on that :)
[13:46:05] <Daviey> Mez: awesome.
[13:46:07] <Mez> popey: there's a request you can't refuse
[13:46:19] <daubers> Mez: Is that the london one or the Birmingham one?
[13:46:24] <matti> Eh.
[13:46:27] <Daviey> Brum
[13:46:29] <AlanBell> for those seeing the etherpad for the first time the top bit is a review of 2009, go down a bit for th 2010 plan
[13:46:30] <matti> :(
[13:46:36] <Mez> daubers: Birmingham
[13:46:46] <daubers> Ta, just for clarification
[13:47:21] <daubers> popey: raised a point in the etherpad (linked above) That the next release is LTS, so it might be worth realling going for it on the Jams
[13:47:33] <daubers> sorry, unneeded : there
[13:47:51] <MunkyJunky> Might be worth going all out on release parties too ;)
[13:47:59] <daubers> MunkyJunky: Jams first
[13:48:09] <Daviey> I would like to see a better structured day, with a timetable of planned activities.
[13:48:20] <Daviey> I think it could make the day(s) more productive.
[13:48:21] <AlanBell> lets go through it section by section
[13:48:34] <AlanBell> firstly locations, are there any other venues to add?
[13:48:49] <popey> linux emporium isnt in there
[13:49:03] <issyl0> AlanBell: I don't know, etherpad won't let me see, more than 16 people are viewing it at the moment :/
[13:49:08] <daubers> If I can swing it, I may attempt a Jam in Newbury, but need to speak to a friend at the college first
[13:49:24] <popey> didnt realise there was a limit on etherpad
[13:49:41] <issyl0> On the free version there is apparently a limit of 16.
[13:49:46] <daubers> Daviey: Is that limit in the pro one?
[13:49:47] <Daviey> another reason to use a self hosted version :)
[13:49:48] <Mez> popey: Wave ? :P
[13:49:56] <AlanBell> http://pastebin.com/m4c7909db
[13:50:02] <gord> MunkyJunky, any thoughts on a jam in manchester?
[13:50:04] <daubers> Ok, we'll keep the discussion in here as much as we can then
[13:50:10] <Daviey> daubers: not as far as i'm aware, but that is a comment out sectiona way :)
[13:50:14] <daubers> Please
[13:50:25] <daubers> Daviey: Good good :)
[13:50:44] <MunkyJunky> gord: I'd love one in Manchester
[13:50:49] <emma> unquery
[13:50:54] <MunkyJunky> gord: Would give me a chance to attend one
[13:51:21] <gord> MunkyJunky, heh yeah, i was thinking more of what would you think about uptake? would people come basically ;)
[13:51:25] <jpds> http://wiki.earth.li/FOSDEM2010/
[13:51:28] <daubers> gord / MunkyJunky, are you willing to attempt it?
[13:51:52] <Mez> jpds: lol :D I should probably remove my details from there now
[13:51:54] <MunkyJunky> gord: release parties seemed popular, and there's plenty of linux-y people about.
[13:52:20] <gord> daubers, i can put feelers out but not being in manchester makes it hard for me to organise something, i wouldn't put it down for certain right now
[13:52:22] <MunkyJunky> daubers: I can /help/ with one, but not run one alone
[13:52:36] <issyl0> Ok.
[13:52:45] <daubers> [ACTION] gord and MunkyJunky to investigate a possible jam in Manchester
[13:52:56] <AlanBell> ok, next bit on the list is general/uncategorised where we have "regular IRC meetings"
[13:53:02] <MunkyJunky> I feel special now, cheers daubers
[13:53:07] <popey> thats for all stuff that doesnt fit in the sections below it
[13:53:13] <popey> probably best to look at those sections first
[13:53:19] <popey> and anything that doesnt fit, can go in general
[13:53:28] <popey> these are 'types of events'
[13:53:30] <AlanBell> ok, so Advocacy events
[13:53:41] <AlanBell> where we have the release parties
[13:53:46] <czajkowski> oh what kinds?
[13:53:57] <daubers> I assume Canonical will run one in London again?
[13:54:03] <popey> most likely
[13:54:12] <issyl0> Hope so.
[13:54:12] <popey> but that doesnt stop us doing one
[13:54:13] <Daviey> daubers: I wuld imagine so, but we can't gurantee.
[13:54:26] <popey> and in fact I'd rather we organised one
[13:54:38] <popey> theirs usually ends up being a beer in an (expensive) bar
[13:54:41] <popey> I think we can do better
[13:54:43] <AlanBell> I would rather we organised one too
[13:54:45] <issyl0> It'll be in April sometime for Lucid?
[13:54:46] <daubers> Do we want to stick with London with that then? Or branch out?
[13:54:52] <AlanBell> or worked with canonical to do something better
[13:55:01] <popey> issyl0: last weekend of april
[13:55:02] <Darael> issyl0: End of April, yah.
[13:55:06] <Daviey> popey: I don't agree that having two parties in a similar geophrapical area, at a similar time is useful.
[13:55:16] <popey> daubers: lets not have the location debate yet :)
[13:55:16] <issyl0> popey: oh awesome. And yes, we can do better!
[13:55:26] * Daviey additionally points out that he doesn't like this keyboard.
[13:55:26] <daubers> Ok
[13:55:29] <AlanBell> I would like to do a daytime event followed by an evening event
[13:55:32] <popey> we spent far too long in previous meetings arguing about what venue
[13:55:44] <daubers> Do we have the contact details for the person in Canonical that organises it?
[13:55:45] <gord> one thing to point out is that the canonical one is aaaaaaaalllways on a thursday
[13:55:47] <popey> Daviey: I didnt suggest that
[13:55:48] * Mez thinks that the release parties being in London and Expensive = PITA.
[13:55:50] <czajkowski> uk is big enough you could a few as long as not too close to make people chose
[13:56:27] <popey> Daviey: I'm not suggesting we organise a 'party' but as AlanBell suggests, an 'event'
[13:56:35] <issyl0> Mmhmm.
[13:56:38] <issyl0> czajkowski: yeah
[13:56:38] <gord> Mez, czajkowski we do have a few all over the country
[13:56:52] <brobostigon> i think i will either do, oxford (daytime), or banbury (evening or daytime), both still in the planning for me,
[13:57:02] <Daviey> popey: that i entirely agree with, although i think Canonical would be interested in helping if it is held in London.
[13:57:02] <AlanBell> A launch event, followed by a party
[13:57:08] <Daviey> Perhaps skills matter.
[13:57:09] <popey> yeah
[13:57:13] <popey> better!
[13:57:14] <Mez> gord: nothing easy, and well - the "official" one in London isn't good.
[13:57:21] <Mez> Mabe if it were in a cheap bar
[13:57:23] <AlanBell> up to now, they have skipped over the lauch event and gone straight to the party bit
[13:57:26] <popey> Mez: it is good
[13:57:28] <daubers> Ok, popey/daviey would you be able to liase with canonical?
[13:57:30] <YaManicKill> planning on one in scotland
[13:57:31] <popey> Mez: i just think we can do better
[13:57:38] <jpds> Mez: The last one was brilliant. .
[13:57:39] <popey> yay YaManicKill
[13:57:39] <issyl0> AlanBell: that's not very good is it?!
[13:57:50] <YaManicKill> popey: its not definate yet, but its a plan
[13:57:54] <Mez> popey: I've not been so can't comment - just heard it was damn expensive (and more so for those travelling in)
[13:57:56] <automatical> YaManicKill: we could maybe grab saajuk to help us out...
[13:58:01] <daubers> [ACTION] YaManicKill to investigate a possible launch party in Scotland
[13:58:05] <Mez> might see if I can "persuade" Keybuk to give me a lift ;)
[13:58:12] <YaManicKill> automatical: yeah, i already said to him we should do it and he said it'd be a good idea
[13:58:23] <popey> Mez: I have not seen him at a release party recently
[13:58:25] <Daviey> Hmm.. I think we need to clarify event content type, before contacting people/organisations outside the loco
[13:58:25] <popey> ever in fact
[13:58:27] <daubers> popey: What kind of launch event would you envisage?
[13:58:30] <matti> Being stuck in London is blah.
[13:58:32] <jpds> popey: He was at the last one.
[13:58:32] <Mez> popey: ah, ok, sucks
[13:58:35] * popey points daubers to AlanBell 
[13:58:43] <automatical> YaManicKill: just keep reminding him :)
[13:58:45] <matti> I live so close, yet past 10pm I have to think about getting back home.
[13:58:45] <popey> heh, memoryfail
[13:58:56] <YaManicKill> wow...my first ever sentence in a UbuntuUk meeting and i already have an action :P
[13:58:58] <popey> ok, again, lets not get bogged down with location
[13:59:04] <Daviey> popey: Keybuk was at release party before last.
[13:59:04] * Mez reckons we should just invade Daviey or Popey's house for location ;)
[13:59:05] <AlanBell> daubers: one that I can invite customers to, and one that journalists will turn up for
[13:59:15] <matti> Mez: Approved!
[13:59:17] <matti> ;]
[13:59:18] <daubers> AlanBell: So a more corporate one?
[13:59:31] <AlanBell> yes, but without being stuffy
[13:59:31] <Mez> matti: which ? :P
[13:59:51] <daubers> Could we combine that with some hands on training stuff?
[13:59:54] <matti> Mez: Invading Daviey and popey ;]
[14:00:02] <popey> skillsmatter would be ideal for that
[14:00:03] <Daviey> hmm.. We can have "Ubuntu Showcase"
[14:00:10] <Mez> matti: different geographical areas...
[14:00:17] <Daviey> People showing off cool stuff they are doing with Ubuntu and the latest release.
[14:00:18] <AlanBell> daubers: well a showcase of the new operating system perhaps
[14:00:19] * popey mutes Mez and matti
[14:00:20] <matti> Mez: We can do one after another ;p
[14:00:24] <popey> and points to the topic
[14:00:39] <Mez> popey: it's vaguely meeting related :D
[14:01:02] <Daviey> Mez: we need to up the pace of this meeting.
[14:01:02] <gord> we are getting bogged down in implementation details, general actions is what we want :)
[14:01:07] <AlanBell> perhaps a london launch event action is in order
[14:01:07] <daubers> So, do we agree that a Showcase style Launch Event is a good idea?
[14:01:15] * Mez considers his wrists slapped
[14:01:18] <issyl0> AlanBell: yep
[14:01:25] <popey> daubers: i do
[14:01:28] <AlanBell> daubers: vote, or action
[14:01:48] <Mez> What about the CS Museum for that kind of launch ?
[14:01:50] <gord> its not a votable thing, if you want to do it then you do it
[14:02:00] <daubers> [VOTE] Should we have a showcase style launch? (+1 for yes -1 for no)
[14:02:01] <brobostigon> bletchley?
[14:02:08] <AlanBell> +1
[14:02:08] <Mez> +1
[14:02:09] <daubers> +1
[14:02:12] <brobostigon> +0
[14:02:12] <popey> +1
[14:02:14] <Daviey> +1
[14:02:14] <etali> +1
[14:02:15] <Darael> +1
[14:02:16] <issyl0> +1
[14:02:19] <MunkyJunky> +1
[14:02:22] <jpds> +0
[14:02:30] <matti> +0
[14:02:44] <gord> +1
[14:02:44] <daubers> Ok, so a resounding yes then
[14:02:52] <AlanBell> ok, now give someone an action
[14:02:54] <daubers> [ENDVOTE]
[14:02:56] * Daviey is interested in the reasons for the +0. Would any of those voted that way mind commenting?
[14:03:15] <Daviey> (briefly)
[14:03:18] <daubers> AlanBell: Are you happy to lead that?
[14:03:22] <AlanBell> yes
[14:03:29] <Daviey> Great.
[14:03:45] <daubers> [ACTION] AlanBell to investigate a Showcase style Launch Event for Lucid
[14:04:08] <daubers> Ok, shall we move on?
[14:04:11] <popey> yes
[14:04:11] <AlanBell> other events on the list are oggcamp and software freedom day
[14:04:13] <Daviey> please
[14:04:13] <matti> Daviey: I might not be in the UK by the of Lucid lunch.
[14:04:20] <Daviey> matti: \o/
[14:04:24] <matti> s/the/the time/
[14:04:27] <popey> AlanBell: sfd can be discussed at another meeting
[14:04:31] <AlanBell> anything need to be discussed on them or is it too soon?
[14:04:31] <daubers> Ok, popey/ Daviey want to say a few words on Oggcamp?
[14:04:31] <popey> oggcamp is 'in discussion'
[14:04:39] <Mez> Daviey: that's mean.
[14:04:42] <Daviey> daubers: nah, lets leave that for now.
[14:04:49] <dutchie> is there a tentative date for oggcamp?
[14:04:53] <Daviey> no.
[14:04:56] <popey> yes
[14:04:57] <popey> :)
[14:05:04] <Mez> oggcampradio ? :D
[14:05:06] <Daviey> err? Did i miss that?
[14:05:12] <AlanBell> ok, final bit in that section is after work events in london or the Ubuntu hour thingie
[14:05:14] <popey> possibly :)
[14:05:26] <popey> I'd like to mail the list about ubuntu hour
[14:05:35] <popey> because it's actually not easy to explain
[14:05:40] <popey> and some people have the wrong end of the stick
[14:05:45] <popey> no, its -very- easy to explain
[14:05:45] <AlanBell> daubers: action for popey there
[14:05:51] <popey> but people still have the wrong end of the stick
[14:06:00] <issyl0> Hehe, I dunno what it is even.
[14:06:10] <popey> dutchie: gimmie an action to mail the list about ubuntu hour
[14:06:11] <Daviey> popey: happy to action that?
[14:06:15] <popey> er
[14:06:16] <popey> daubers: :)
[14:06:22] <popey> and Daviey too!
[14:06:23] <daubers> sorry, internet fail
[14:06:31] <issyl0> After work events would be good too :)
[14:06:31] <etali> Would it not be easier to correct misconceptions in real time in IRC?
[14:06:43] <daubers> [ACTION] popey to email the list about Ubuntu Hours
[14:06:55] <Daviey> good stuff.
[14:06:57] <popey> etali: not really, I'll just drop a mail and link to it in the /topic :)
[14:07:04] <Daviey> daubers: move on?
[14:07:11] <AlanBell> ok, so after work events?
[14:07:33] <daubers> Ok, we'll let popey clarify ubuntu hour to the list and come back to it next time
[14:07:44] <Daviey> great
[14:07:50] <Mez> daubers action talking about it next time ?
[14:07:55] <jpds> I went to one, wasn't particularly special.
[14:07:55] <issyl0> Sure
[14:08:10] <daubers> [ACTION] Discussion on Ubuntu Hour in next meeting
[14:08:20] <daubers> RIghy, onto training events
[14:08:42] <Mez> [QUESTION] Big blue room ? huh?
[14:08:50] <popey> either/or Mez
[14:08:50] <daubers> Mez: The real world
[14:08:54] <AlanBell> Mez: the open air
[14:09:05] <Mez> oh
[14:09:10] <Mez> popey: ?
[14:09:12] <popey> nvm
[14:09:36] <Darael> It's... only semi-relevant, but I spoke to a few people who might like to form a study group for the LPICs and the UCP...
[14:09:37] <daubers> There is a planned Ubuntu User Day by the training team (I think)
[14:09:38] <popey> i think for online sessions we should get in touch with the ubuntu learning team and the people who run ubuntu classroom sessions
[14:09:52] <popey> daubers: ubuntu learning team
[14:09:58] <daubers> Thats the one
[14:09:59] <issyl0> popey: :)
[14:10:08] <issyl0> Agree.
[14:10:30] <daubers> popey: Could a screencast of using Lernid be done before the event? Might make life easier
[14:10:39] <popey> dunno if we as a loco should do online stuff for us, or whether we should just ask the loco for help running them and send them on to the learning team?
[14:11:03] <Mez> daubers: what about an IRC session on how to use lernid?
[14:11:06] <popey> there's an awful lot in that 'training' section
[14:11:27] <daubers> Ok, they can be summarised easily though :)
[14:11:29] <Daviey> i feel it's envitable that support and training will become more distributed, and it's something we CAN do online.
[14:11:58] <daubers> Maybe we should liase with the learning team first and put some feelers out
[14:11:59] <gord> loco's should help but it shouldn't be part of an ubuntu-uk-training project or something, popey is right i think
[14:12:01] <popey> be nice to testdrive lernid as a tool, but the big questions are 'what do we teach' and 'who is going to do it'
[14:12:06] <AlanBell> the whiteboard jam is something I would like to do later in the year, probably summer holidays time
[14:12:08] <Daviey> Which in itself will build the team and increace advocacy.
[14:12:27] <daubers> Ok, one thing I would really like to see done is some training in the real world for complete novices
[14:12:39] <popey> daubers: again, skillsmatter can come in helpful there
[14:12:41] <daubers> IRC is very scary for those most in need of this kind of thing
[14:12:43] <popey> they have a training facility
[14:13:17] <daubers> So, should we look at running a public training day in real life and trying to co-ordinate it with an online effort?
[14:13:17] <issyl0> daubers: yes.
[14:13:26] <AlanBell> yes
[14:13:28] <issyl0> daubers: that'd be amazing imo
[14:13:30] <popey> this is a massive undertaking
[14:13:36] <Mez> popey: +1
[14:13:43] <issyl0> But yeah, as popey says.
[14:13:50] <AlanBell> this is something worth throwing resources at
[14:13:51] <Mez> popey: but done well, it's something to be proud of as a LoCO
[14:13:53] <popey> developing the material for one, marketing the day etc..
[14:13:56] <popey> agreed AlanBell
[14:13:56] <issyl0> Lots to do, lots of volunteers, lots to organise...
[14:13:57] <daubers> I know, but I somehow feel that if we want to push forward we need to start doing big things now and again
[14:14:03] <popey> yup, totally Mez
[14:14:03] <issyl0> Yep :)
[14:14:08] <popey> it's something I'd LOVE us to do
[14:14:12] <Mez> popey: me too
[14:14:13] <popey> but I'm just worried about the workload
[14:14:28] <AlanBell> maybe something like a training track at another event
[14:14:31] <Mez> popey: you've just said - you'd LOVE to do it - others probably would to
[14:14:38] <Darael> IT would be fantastic. But yeah, popey, workload could be a small problem.
[14:14:42] <daubers> AlanBell: Maybe we should use that as a starting point
[14:14:47] <Mez> popey: surely then, the workload isn't that much, just need a lot of focus
[14:14:47] <issyl0> Mez: +1
[14:14:48] <popey> well I used to do IT training for a living, and I like doing it.. :)
[14:14:50] <Mez> which am sure we'll get
[14:15:02] <Daviey> well the tasks required should be documented, between now and the next meeting and we then discuss if it's something we are ready to undertake now
[14:15:03] <popey> ok, so action..?
[14:15:10] <Daviey> if not, it's something useful for the future.
[14:15:15] <popey> Daviey: a high level plan would be good
[14:15:21] <popey> to figure out how much work would be involved
[14:15:37] <Daviey> popey: Ie, "Insurance requirements", "Material/Topics to cover"
[14:15:38] <Mez> popey: just think of it as something like "another oggcamp" :D
[14:15:49] <popey> exactly, that kind of level Daviey
[14:15:54] <daubers> Daviey/Popey are you happy to take command of that overview, pulling in other people as needed?
[14:15:54] <issyl0> Yes.
[14:15:59] <popey> no
[14:16:03] <popey> I dont have the time
[14:16:19] <daubers> popey: did you do a similar thing for oggcamp?
[14:16:20] <Daviey> okay, daubers set an action for a wiki/pad brainstorm.. Everyone interested should get involved on that one.
[14:16:31] <popey> daubers: not personally
[14:16:39] <popey> yeah +1
[14:16:42] <Darael> Daviey: +1
[14:16:48] <AlanBell> I am happy to help with that one, but not lead
[14:16:53] <daubers> [ACTION] Wiki/etherpad discussion on overview for a possible real life training event
[14:16:58] <popey> and we can mail the list with a link to the etherpad..?
[14:17:18] <Daviey> AlanBell: at this stage, it doesn't reuqire leadership as such.. It's just a list of requirements and topics for discussion in the next meeting
[14:17:24] <Daviey> viability study if you like :)
[14:17:25] <daubers> [ACTION] Training event discussion to be mailed to the list
[14:17:29] <AlanBell> Daviey: good, I am up for that then
[14:17:32] <issyl0> :)
[14:17:46] <popey> next topic?
[14:17:49] <Daviey> daubers: move on?
[14:17:51] <AlanBell> Social events
[14:18:04] <daubers> Ok, Social Events :)
[14:18:11] <daubers> [TOPIC] Social Events
[14:18:13] * Mez wonders where that is on the schedule
[14:18:27] <AlanBell> Line 81
[14:18:29] <daubers> Mez: It's in the etherpad, we're still going through that
[14:18:46] <daubers> Having covered release parties earlier, there are some other options
[14:18:46] <Mez> daubers: ah
[14:18:51] <Daviey> Last year i threw the idea of having a BBQ / Picnic / Camping event, there wasn't *much* interested, so i didn't pursue it.
[14:18:55] <Daviey> Is this still the case?
[14:19:02] <dutchie> comping--
[14:19:06] <AlanBell> I think there may be more interest now
[14:19:12] <dutchie> camping*
[14:19:18] <AlanBell> with the possible exception of the camping bit
[14:19:18] <daubers> [Vote] Who is interested in a BBQ / Picnic / Camping event?
[14:19:20] <automatical> camping could be interesting
[14:19:24] <popey> +1
[14:19:25] <AlanBell> +1
[14:19:26] <daubers> +1
[14:19:26] <automatical> +1
[14:19:27] <issyl0> dutchie: a geeknic would be good, yeah. Not so sure about camping though.
[14:19:29] <Seeker`> Party at Davieys? :P
[14:19:30] <issyl0> +1
[14:19:31] <brobostigon> -1
[14:19:34] <Daviey> +1
[14:19:35] <dutchie> +1
[14:19:36] <Darael> +1 but would depend on location...
[14:19:38] <Seeker`> 0
[14:19:40] <dutchie> but not camping
[14:19:43] <Seeker`> +0
[14:19:50] <issyl0> Yeah, not camping though.
[14:19:54] <Steve1> +1
[14:19:54] <etali> +0 depends on location
[14:20:07] <brobostigon> -1 in the camping, not the other ideas.
[14:20:12] <daubers> Ok, Is that enough interest to put a mail to the list Daviey?
[14:20:16] <daubers> [ENDVOTE]
[14:20:16] * Daviey wonders when Seeker` snuck in, i don't see him as present :)
[14:20:16] <Mez> +1
[14:20:20] <popey> hah
[14:20:21] <Daviey> daubers: yes.
[14:20:25] <daubers> Sorry Mez
[14:20:28] <Mez> :'(
[14:20:37] <brobostigon> i dont like camping, but i like the other ideas.
[14:20:39] <daubers> [ACTION] Daviey to mail the list about a BBQ / Picnic / Camping event
[14:20:53] <AlanBell> I would drop the camping bit
[14:20:53] <Mez> s/\/ Camping//
[14:20:55] <popey> I have a couple of great locations for bbqs
[14:20:55] <Seeker`> Daviey: after people said "present" :P
[14:20:57] <AlanBell> it limits the venues
[14:21:15] <popey> AlanBell: they're not cumulative, but alternative
[14:21:16] <Mez> WRT BBQ: Debian UK have an annual BBQ. I'm sure ubuntu people would be welcome along
[14:21:25] <daubers> We'll let that all go to the mailing list shall we?
[14:21:35] <Daviey> Next xmas event i feel can be left for now. I someone think it's a little early to plan next xmas, this isn't fairpack :)
[14:21:48] <daubers> :)
[14:21:48] <AlanBell> how about the RAT then
[14:21:56] <daubers> AlanBell: Tell us about the RAT :)#
[14:21:57] <popey> I'd like a RAT to look forward to
[14:22:06] <Daviey> AlanBell: I like the idea of that.
[14:22:23] <AlanBell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicRATParty
[14:22:26] <issyl0> Oh is that that train thingy?
[14:22:33] <AlanBell> it needs to be planned well in advance
[14:22:33] <daubers> Yep
[14:22:40] <issyl0> Ooh.
[14:22:40] <popey> Real Ale Train, steam train, 8 quid (iirc) a ticket, 2 quid a pint, 2 quid for food. Eat, drink, be merry, enjoy steam.
[14:23:00] <Mez> popey: and then it turns into a failtrain when we all get TOO drunk :D
[14:23:00] * brobostigon likes that idea.
[14:23:06] <issyl0> Mez: haha
[14:23:07] <popey> it's great
[14:23:07] <AlanBell> tickets are ?10 each (including first pint) and get sold out 3 months in advance
[14:23:12] <popey> I've done it a couple of times
[14:23:13] <daubers> If we get enough interest is it worth talking to the organisers of that?
[14:23:15] <Daviey> who proposed the RAT idea?
[14:23:18] <popey> a really good social event
[14:23:21] <daubers> Daviey: AlanBell
[14:23:21] <popey> Daviey: AlanBell
[14:23:28] <Mez> Daviey: AlanBell
[14:23:33] <popey> Mez: AlanBell
[14:23:35] <AlanBell> http://www.watercressonline.co.uk/section.php?xSec=191
[14:23:36] <Seeker`> Daviey: AlanBell
[14:23:41] <AlanBell> dates are there^^
[14:23:42] <Mez> (everyone else was doing it, I just wanted to be popular)
[14:23:43] <Daviey> AlanBell: can you kick off a wiki page, asking for tentative interest in attending?
[14:24:00] <AlanBell> Daviey: ok, maybe a doodle poll or something
[14:24:10] <popey> yeah
[14:24:13] <AlanBell> but sure, daubers gimmie an action
[14:24:13] <Daviey> sounds great.
[14:24:16] <daubers> [ACTION] AlanBell to start a wiki page/mailing list discussion or somesuch to gauge interest in the RAT
[14:24:27] <Daviey> GIMMIE GIMMIE GIMMIE
[14:24:30] <daubers> Ok, next on the big etherpad
[14:24:36] <AlanBell> a man after midnight
[14:24:38] <AlanBell> oops
[14:24:41] <daubers> [TOPIC] Media Promotion
[14:25:03] <daubers> Can someone explain Tipcast briefly?
[14:25:06] <popey> http://tipcast.ubuntu-uk.org/
[14:25:15] <popey> explained there :)
[14:25:49] <popey> note the date on that, 6 months ago :S
[14:25:59] <issyl0> popey: oh, brilliant idea!
[14:26:09] <popey> the plan is to make a load of short podcast episodes, like 5 mins _maxiumum_
[14:26:13] <AlanBell> so this is GUI lurve?
[14:26:16] <daubers> popey: What do you need to push that forward?
[14:26:23] <popey> daubers: yeah, gimmie an action
[14:26:29] <Daviey> time methinks :)
[14:26:53] <popey> i need to finish off the document that I have in tomboy :)
[14:26:55] <daubers> [ACTION] Popey to carry on sorting out Tipcast and ask back when he would like more help
[14:26:56] <popey> which details how to get involved
[14:27:15] <popey> AlanBell: yeah, not command lines if we can help it
[14:27:47] <Daviey> NEXT :)
[14:27:47] <popey> the next thing was an idea thats been kicking around for a while
[14:27:53] <daubers> Okies, next up is getting stuff into print
[14:27:59] <popey> encouraging members to write stuff
[14:28:08] <issyl0> popey: why not the command line tips thingy?
[14:28:12] <Mez> popey: write "stuff" or "stuff to do with the loco"
[14:28:20] <popey> issyl0: because they sound crap when read out on a podcast
[14:28:25] <daubers> Mez: I believe the idea is both
[14:28:28] <popey> yeah
[14:28:30] <popey> anything really
[14:28:39] <popey> problem is writing for linux magazines is preaching to the converted
[14:28:40] <issyl0> popey: hmm yeah, didn't think of that :)
[14:28:44] * dutchie points out ubuntu-manual
[14:28:45] <popey> I'm thinking more of non-linux print
[14:28:49] <popey> there's that too
[14:28:53] <MunkyJunky> popey: Is that anything to do with the loco that shows it off?
[14:28:56] <daubers> So local rags and what not?
[14:29:02] <popey> yeah daubers
[14:29:09] <Mez> popey: well, if it's writing anything, that's not hard to do, you just need to be knowledgable about a subject.
[14:29:11] <popey> MunkyJunky: yeah could be
[14:29:16] * Mez has proven that with his articles in LXF
[14:29:27] <popey> sure Mez its more motivating people to y'know actually do it
[14:29:42] <daubers> popey: How do envisage motivating people?
[14:29:44] <Daviey> popey: at the right level, it points out the cool thinks Ubuntu is doing, for non-Ubuntu users. It can also encourage those that what to get involved, either with community stuff or development
[14:29:51] <Mez> popey: there's ??? in it :D
[14:29:55] <Mez> that's motivation
[14:30:02] <issyl0> Daviey: mmhmm
[14:30:04] <Mez> though for me, it was actually the motivation to get my name noticed.
[14:30:04] <issyl0> :)
[14:30:18] <etali> Starting with FOSS in general might be a good idea - get people into open source alternatives in Windows (e.g free accounting software for struggling small businesses), then when they're used to that the leap to Linux is easier....
[14:30:51] <popey> ok, i dunno where I was going with this
[14:30:52] <issyl0> Mez: ooh, you write for LXF?! What about?! 
[14:30:52] <daubers> I think this is one of those really hard people things
[14:30:55] <popey> the next one I think is more important
[14:31:00] <issyl0> daubers: indeed.
[14:31:04] <AlanBell> so writing articles in non-technical media in a subject we are interested in, but slipping in a reference to Ubuntu somewhere
[14:31:12] <The_Toxic_Mite> Hey everyone
[14:31:15] <popey> writing flyers/stickers for the cd
[14:31:57] <popey> I'm happy to bump this to another meeting once we've thought about it :)
[14:32:07] <AlanBell> isn't there a space on the CD slipcase for a sticker
[14:32:10] <daubers> Ok that might be best, as these are difficult things
[14:32:14] * Daviey points out we have just past the hour mark.
[14:32:33] <Mez> Daviey: go put the kettle on then, it's tea break time
[14:32:34] <daubers> [ACTION] People to think about how to motivate people to write stuff
[14:32:53] <daubers> [ACTION] People to think about Stickers/Leaflets for the CD
[14:32:56] <popey> AlanBell: yes
[14:33:04] <popey> for a standard sized one
[14:33:22] <daubers> Right shall we move on then? We're out of the etherpad now :)
[14:33:24] <popey> AlanBell: well, there is on the karmic one
[14:33:30] <Daviey> daubers: please :)
[14:33:46] <AlanBell> ok, so dimensions would be a good input into that conversation
[14:33:59] <popey> AlanBell: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DIYMarketing?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=ubuntu_cd_910.pdf
[14:34:03] <AlanBell> I think we have discussed the first 4 items on the agenda
[14:34:11] <Daviey> dutchie (and AlanPope)
[14:34:12] <popey> oops, wrong on
[14:34:14] <Daviey> #ubuntu-uk-offtopic channel?
[14:34:19] <Mez> -1
[14:34:28] <Daviey> err, daubers [TOPIC] it please :)
[14:34:31] <popey> yeah..
[14:34:33] <AlanBell> Mez: wait for the discussion and vote
[14:34:42] <daubers> net fail
[14:34:57] <daubers> [TOPIC] #ubuntu-uk-offtopic channel?
[14:35:04] <popey> ok, so in the past this has come up and I have been -1, mainly because this was a small channel, now we have grown quite a bit..
[14:35:19] <popey> .. and there is a lot of really massively offtopic stuff that goes on in here
[14:35:21] * Mez is -1 - it'd ruin the "atmosphere" in here.
[14:35:28] <popey> dude
[14:35:31] <popey> gimmie a chance
[14:35:32] <issyl0> Hmm, good point to raise.
[14:35:34] <Mez> sorry
[14:35:49] <popey> there are multiple types of 'offtopic'
[14:35:54] <popey> there's the social banter that we have..
[14:35:58] <popey> which I do _NOT_ want to remove
[14:36:05] <matti> -1
[14:36:12] <popey> then there's completely utterly offtopic mad conversations that happen
[14:36:21] <AlanBell> are we talking stuff that is not
[14:36:21] <matti> -2 even
[14:36:22] <AlanBell> !coc
[14:36:23] <popey> like about the law, privacy, politics, incest.. everything
[14:36:23] <ubot4> The Ubuntu Code of Conduct is a community etiquette document to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere, and can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/ . For information on how to electronically sign the CoC, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SigningCodeofConduct .
[14:36:32] <popey> no
[14:36:40] <Daviey> I am concerned about the amount of radically offtopic, that shouldn't be talked about in the #Ubuntu* channels IMO. Would this turn into an avenue for them?
[14:36:48] <popey> if it's not code of conduct friendly it doesn't belong in _any_ ubuntu channel
[14:37:07] <popey> one of my big issues is that wildly offtopic stuff goes on in here.. when new people arrive
[14:37:09] <issyl0> popey: but then some mught say the social banter *is* offtopic - what constitutes offtopic and surely it's subjective what people consider to be offtopic and ontopic. I do agree about not violating the code of conduct...
[14:37:10] <popey> we say 'hello'
[14:37:17] <matti> But channels are SOCIAL things.
[14:37:18] <issyl0> s/mught/might/
[14:37:21] <matti> Please.
[14:37:24] <popey> and they're dropped into some massively mad conversation about oddball stuff
[14:37:25] <Daviey> Additionally, there is aspect of the additional operators requirement for that - however, that is in the implentation.
[14:37:27] <matti> If you take the social aspect of it.
[14:37:27] <gord> we already have an offtopic channel for the ubuntu namespace, #ubuntu-offtopic, there's no need to create another one, if we want to forward offtopic stuff to #u-o then thats fine
[14:37:29] <matti> It is pointless.
[14:37:40] <issyl0> matti: +
[14:37:42] <matti> I am not here for the Ubuntu thing.
[14:37:44] <issyl0> In a way
[14:37:49] <popey> ok, I'm happy to point people at -offtopic
[14:37:49] <matti> I have enough technical knowledge.
[14:37:52] <Darael> gord: +1
[14:37:55] <matti> I am here FOR THE PEOPLE i like.
[14:37:59] <Mez> gord: that'd end up being like #ubuntu where you have to be VERY careful about what you say in here.
[14:38:04] <AlanBell> !offtopic
[14:38:04] <ubot4> #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, for all Ubuntu-related support questions. Please use #ubuntu-offtopic for other topics. Thanks!
[14:38:05] <popey> but I want people to be more mindful of the utter garbage that goes on in here which is nothing to do with being social
[14:38:07] * Mez feels this channel is about the banter, etc etc.
[14:38:15] <Daviey> hmm
[14:38:20] <gord> Mez, we can create our own rules of what we deem is offtopic, it does not have to follow the ubuntu ones
[14:38:20] <ali1234> oh jeez, don't bring up ubuntu-offtopic...
[14:38:22] <issyl0> Hard decision to make.
[14:38:24] <matti> issyl0: :)
[14:38:26] * popey didnt even finish his point
[14:38:27] <popey> ah well
[14:38:29] <Mez> I feel, that the support stuff is more offtopic in here than "o4o" stuff
[14:38:41] <Darael> popey: Please continue!
[14:38:42] <Daviey> We *should* be careful of banter in a channel people might join for the first time. It could easily be conveyed as a small cliche.
[14:38:52] <Mez> popey: sorry, I saw other people jumping in and assumed I could
[14:38:56] <Mez> Daviey: TINC
[14:39:05] <Omahn> Daviey: +1
[14:39:09] <DanielRM> I think that Mez is correct there to be honest.
[14:39:24] <popey> which is wrong
[14:39:27] <popey> massively wrong
[14:39:31] <daubers> popey: This might be better off reasoned out in a blog post, and then discussed on the list or in the channel, then have a specific meeting about it?
[14:39:49] <Mez> daubers: good point ;)
[14:39:53] <DanielRM> There's #ubuntu for support whereas #ubuntu-uk is more a UK community for Ubuntu.
[14:40:07] * matti is confused.
[14:40:08] <DanielRM> And community is about social interaction.
[14:40:10] <Mez> DanielRM: that's my view at least.
[14:40:12] <Gary> we should be welcoming to all :-)
[14:40:12] <daubers> I'm not trying to brush it under the carpet, but it's something that people are going to have to think about
[14:40:22] <Daviey> Gary: ssshhh!
[14:40:23] <issyl0> Gary: ++
[14:40:27] <gord> i think the point is that 90% of the conversation in here is not ubuntu related i find
[14:40:28] <Mez> DanielRM: maybe we should get some clarification on what this channel actually is?
[14:40:32] <DanielRM> I can agree to being cautious, which is why we have the CoC.
[14:40:52] <popey> but the stuff can be CoC friendly but massively irritating to other poeple
[14:41:01] <DJones> There's still the code of conduct which should still apply, given that #ubuntu-uk is still part of the #ubuntu namespace
[14:41:03] * Daviey does think it's an idea worthy of time limited experiment.. If it doesn't work out, we drop it.
[14:41:05] <DanielRM> Yes, but that applies to anything.
[14:41:12] <issyl0> Yes.
[14:41:31] <DanielRM> I find Tories massively irritating but I can still tolerate them talking.
[14:41:37] <AlanBell> it costs nothing to set up a channel, if nobody uses it then it will dissapear
[14:41:38] <gord> one thing i can say is that any idea like this would need some very clearly defined rules
[14:41:42] <DanielRM> And indeed people talking about them.
[14:41:43] <popey> I guess I'm just tired of coming in here, seeing a new person arrive in the middle of a ridiculoud political 'debate'
[14:41:44] <daubers> Ok, shall we vote on a week long experiment of said idea?
[14:41:55] <popey> *ridiculous
[14:41:56] <issyl0> daubers: why not.
[14:42:04] <matti> People like our channel.
[14:42:07] <popey> daubers: I havent talked about implementation
[14:42:10] <DanielRM> Communities don't always get along without friction.
[14:42:13] <matti> How many times I've heard that they even love us.
[14:42:14] <Daviey> daubers: err, hold fire.
[14:42:16] <Mez> popey: Daviey did
[14:42:17] <matti> And the help we offer.
[14:42:17] <daubers> popey: Sorry, please carry on
[14:42:21] <AlanBell> so when would we send a conversation to -offtopic vs ##politics-uk?
[14:42:24] <matti> Ask soopos for instance.
[14:42:36] <gord> politics is offtopic even for -offtopic AlanBell
[14:42:37] <matti> People also like being close to the communitites.
[14:42:39] <popey> exactly Mez
[14:42:41] <DanielRM> If people are offended by something not contrary to the CoC then isn't that a sign that maybe they're a bit too insensitive.
[14:42:41] <popey> er matti
[14:42:54] <matti> #ubuntu is very black-and-white channel.
[14:42:55] <gord> heh, we don't allow politics in offtopic but we do in here, that says something ;)
[14:42:57] <popey> _in_sensitive DanielRM ?
[14:43:07] <DanielRM> Gah.
[14:43:07] <popey> exactly my point gord !
[14:43:14] <DanielRM> Handling two conversations at once popey. :(
[14:43:15] <zbrahead-dedi> Hello
[14:43:23] <DanielRM> So brain not fully engaged with either.
[14:43:27] <matti> zbrahead-dedi: Hello.
[14:43:33] <Mez> popey: at the moment, I think we have a good balance. I've not heard any people complain about the "banter" or "offtopicness" in here, and I personally, find it refreshing (but then I have bad karma with Ubuntu IRC). I'm also astounded at times when I flick to the channel and see the in-depth support that's being given...
[14:43:33] * issyl0 is confused and will shut up for a bit :)
[14:43:39] * Mez thinks the channel works well as is.
[14:43:43] * Daviey would be happy with just *doing it*, and in the next meeting dicuss if it serves a purpose - if so, what should we change with the implementation, as by that tike we will be aware of it's pitfalls.
[14:43:45] <MattJ100> OTOH the fact that this channel has grown... doesn't that mean it's doing a good job at welcoming newcomers?
[14:43:47] * DanielRM agrees with Mez.
[14:43:59] * matti seconds Mez and DanielRM 
[14:44:03] <popey> *boggle*
[14:44:05] <daubers> popey: How would you impliment this?
[14:44:17] <Mez> popey: I've got a 10 letter word.
[14:44:18] <popey> how many times have I had to tell people to curb their conversation the last week or so?
[14:44:18] <MattJ100> I think I'm with Daviey on trialing a change
[14:44:19] * issyl0 agrees with matti and everyone else who agrees with Mez.
[14:44:23] <gord> how about scrapping the fowarding to offtopic idea and instead incorporating ubuntu offtopics offtopic4offtopic ness
[14:44:31] * brobostigon also agrees with Mez 
[14:44:31] <DanielRM> I've no objection to an experiment though.
[14:44:31] * matti hugs issyl0 
[14:44:41] <gord> ie: certain subjects just lead to flaming and horribleness so they aren't allowed, here are some channels that you can do it in, ##politics and hte like
[14:44:46] <popey> ok, well it must be me then
[14:44:52] <DanielRM> I just think that the experiment won't be a success.
[14:44:57] <popey> I seem to be the only one who gets annoyed with the continuous political stuff in here
[14:45:01] <MattJ100> popey: It's not just you
[14:45:01] <Darael> gord: Very sensible.
[14:45:03] <Daviey> no, i proposed 2 years ago having an offtopic channel.
[14:45:10] <daubers> popey: Def. not just you
[14:45:10] <Mez> popey: I agree, sometimes things get out of hand.... but surely, that's where the CoC and !o4o steps in ?
[14:45:14] <gord> popey, i do also, indeed i talk less in here because of it
[14:45:21] <jpds> popey: No, me too sometimes.
[14:45:23] <popey> aaargh
[14:45:26] <gord> Mez, !o4o does not apply in here currently
[14:45:27] <matti> Daviey: I am not saying we cannot... and there is nothing like experiment of course.
[14:45:28] <popey> it's nothing to do with the CoC
[14:45:28] <Gary> me too, I am rather non-political though
[14:45:30] <popey> forget the CoC
[14:45:37] <popey> it's about offtopicness
[14:45:39] <Mez> gord: really?
[14:45:41] <brobostigon> popey: people need to be pointed in the right direction then, when politics does get discussed, isnt that simpler?
[14:45:41] <matti> Daviey: I am just concerened that we might take the spirit from this channel.
[14:45:44] <popey> which has very little to do with CoC-compliance
[14:45:51] <issyl0> popey: we have to have *some* degree of sociable chatter, and sometimes that delves into politics, but when it does we can sort that out by sugggesting people move to different channels, surely?!
[14:45:51] <gord> Mez, offtopic4offtopic is just for u-o
[14:45:52] <Mez> gord: I've always thought of it as being relative here.
[14:45:56] <popey> brobostigon: yes, but we do that and people still dont listen
[14:46:05] * Daviey is less active in here because of the general chatter.
[14:46:18] <Mez> A suggestion: treat THIS as an offtopic chan, and enforce !o4o style rulings?
[14:46:20] <Daviey> I do get concerned i miss relevant Ubuntu and/or LoCo stuff.
[14:46:21] <Darael> it's true that it can get out of hand, but placing a separate -offtopic has risks, and maybe it would be better just to agree to police ourselves a bit more.
[14:46:29] <brobostigon> popey: we be slowly more persuasive.
[14:46:30] <gord> Mez, i just said that ;P
[14:46:38] <Mez> gord: I may have missed that
[14:46:42] <Mez> gord: apologies.
[14:46:57] * Daviey looks at the clock.
[14:46:59] <popey> ok, I am happy to go along with Daviey, we get a *teensy* bit more strict in here
[14:47:04] <issyl0> Yes.
[14:47:07] <Mez> +1
[14:47:14] <Mez> (I think)
[14:47:15] <issyl0> +1
[14:47:19] <MattJ100> +1 (though I'm not present :) )
[14:47:21] <DanielRM> +1
[14:47:21] <AlanBell> ok, so can we move to a vote on something?
[14:47:24] <ianto> From my experience the majority of stuff that goes on in this channel is vaguely offtopic and general chat and honestly I think that people prefer this to be that way rather than focused too much on Ubuntu like the official #ubuntu channel, then again what I said may be "off-topic" since I have only just come back into the conversation
[14:47:32] <Darael> Indeed, if we police ourselves a bit more strictly, tha should be all we need.
[14:47:34] <brobostigon> can we layout specific rules then as to the changes and limits then?
[14:47:35] <zbrahead-dedi> More strict!? :(
[14:47:41] <Daviey> Action = Trial offtopic channel until next meeting, where we review it.
[14:47:43] <Daviey> ?
[14:47:52] <gord> -1 on an offtopic channel no no no
[14:47:54] <AlanBell> vote^^
[14:47:56] <MattJ100> ianto: I think that's correct, but the people that like the chatter can simply make -offtopic where they hang out
[14:47:58] <Mez> Daviey: vote on that
[14:48:08] <popey> i dont want a -uk-offtopic anymore :)
[14:48:12] <MattJ100> Heh
[14:48:14] <gord> as i said before, we have an offtopic channel in the ubuntu namespace, #ubuntu-offtopic
[14:48:17] <popey> i just want people to talk less crap :)
[14:48:27] <daubers> So we're going with the ops just being a touch stricter?
[14:48:33] <popey> i think so, yes
[14:48:35] <Mez> popey: /mode #ubuntu-offtopic +b Mez
[14:48:36] <zbrahead-dedi> popey: you cant heave both :P
[14:48:36] <Darael> popey: People will talk crap wherever you pput them, though.
[14:48:53] <Gary> that'd get a +1 from me (slightly stricter)
[14:48:54] <issyl0> :)
[14:48:58] <daubers> [ACTION] Ops in #ubuntu-uk to be a touch stricter on content, this to be reviewed at next meeting
[14:48:59] <popey> so long as it aint here, I dont care Darael
[14:49:01] <Mez> a small point raised there:- do we need a review of the ops team in here if we make things "stricter" ?
[14:49:23] <Daviey> i'm not sure we do.. seems to be functional atm.
[14:49:28] <Mez> aka, are there enough
[14:49:33] * matti is sad.
[14:49:34] <daubers> popey: It might be worth an email to the list/blog post about what this change will ensue
[14:49:37] <popey> yeah, i dont have a problem with any of the existing ops
[14:49:40] <brobostigon> daubers: can we layout where ops will be stricter?
[14:49:40] * popey stabs Gary 
[14:49:41] <matti> Daviey: You are quiet on other channels as well.
[14:49:42] <gord> if there are any problems with it we can bring it up at the next meeting
[14:49:48] <gord> until we try it we won't know however
[14:49:52] <Gary> Mez: maybe, I've not altered it for a while, so if thats deemed a yes, please let me or popey know and we can review
[14:49:52] <brobostigon> exactly*
[14:49:57] <zbrahead-dedi> How about allowing things to go offtopic until someone actually comes in after help
[14:50:00] <etali> What does the topic in this channel usually say? Is it clear what the channel is for, so people know what kind of conversation is OK and what's going too far?
[14:50:10] <matti> zbrahead-dedi: We do that right now.
[14:50:10] <matti> ;]
[14:50:14] <issyl0> Oh, I didn't realise so many people had ops. :)
[14:50:29] <matti> issyl0: :)
[14:50:35] <ianto> It may be helpful to review/rewrite this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/IRC
[14:50:37] <MattJ100> zbrahead-dedi: How do you know they've come for help?
[14:50:38] <daubers> Is someone happy to layout what this change will mean?
[14:50:42] * Mez had his ops in here changed a week ago ?
[14:50:52] <popey> daubers: sure
[14:50:58] <b1ackcr0w> I tend to find it intimidating to break up conversation to ask questions in the ontopic channels
[14:51:00] <daubers> popey: Thank you :)
[14:51:00] <popey> daubers: action me
[14:51:10] <zbrahead-dedi> MattJ100: we welcome them and if they ask then badoom-tish
[14:51:27] <popey> lies
[14:51:30] <daubers> [ACTION] popey to blog/email what the #ubuntu-uk IRC changes will mean
[14:51:32] <zbrahead-dedi> xD
[14:51:41] <ianto> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/IRC
[14:51:47] <Mez> Daviey: blog/email/wiki
[14:51:49] <gord> are we done then?
[14:51:52] <Daviey> top banana
[14:51:53] <zbrahead-dedi> How about we go stricter on welcoming new users?
[14:51:57] <Gary> Mez: yeah, I did alter them a tiny bit :p was wondering if you'd notice
[14:52:10] <AlanBell> gord: no, date of next meeting
[14:52:15] <daubers> Ok
[14:52:21] <Mez> no AOB?
[14:52:36] <popey> i say we get more strict with people who have only the following letters in their nicknames : "a, b, d, e, h, i, r, z"
[14:52:46] <daubers> Does anyone have any (brief) other business?
[14:52:46] <AlanBell> Mez: the agenda is a wiki, no need for AOB :-)
[14:52:48] * Mez gets strict with popey
[14:52:57] * YaManicKill smiles :P
[14:53:09] <MunkyJunky> Question: Is there a calendar of meeting dates? One that I can subscribe to in Google Calendar / Evolution - or are they only on the Wiki?
[14:53:14] <Mez> AlanBell: there is a need, as some may want to add something as the meeting goes on. Noy everyone refreshes
[14:53:20] <popey> MunkyJunky: not currently
[14:53:21] <Mez> MunkyJunky: fridge.ubuntu.com
[14:53:31] <matti> :<
[14:53:31] <Mez> oh, we're not on the fridge calendar?
[14:53:31] <popey> dunno if our meeting went to the fridge
[14:53:34] <popey> we can add it
[14:53:37] <gord> MunkyJunky, thats a great idea though
[14:53:37] <popey> anyone can
[14:53:41] <daubers> I'll take that as a no... on the AOB
[14:53:43] <MunkyJunky> I think it'd be nioce to have one, I generally only find out about meetings after they happen
[14:53:47] <zbrahead-dedi> Hmmm.
[14:53:50] <Mez> daubers: I have AOB
[14:53:58] <daubers> Mez: Carry on then
[14:53:59] <popey> ok MunkyJunky we should add it to the list of things to do
[14:54:00] <gord> i would looove a google calendar setup for our meetings :)
[14:54:03] * matti is sad by the way how things are going to be.
[14:54:06] <MunkyJunky> acecakes
[14:54:07] * Daviey proposes meeting for a month time.
[14:54:10] <Mez> daubers: [ACTION] meetings to be put on fridge
[14:54:13] <Mez> :P
[14:54:22] * dutchie was about to suggest that
[14:54:22] <r-> I filtered those letters out and am now reduced to r-
[14:54:23] <daubers> [ACTION] Meetings to be put on fridge
[14:54:34] <issyl0> r-: haha
[14:54:35] <r-> :-(
[14:54:35] <popey> r-: you missed that I mentioned r
[14:54:37] <daubers> [TOPIC] Date of Next Meeting and Volunteer for Chair
[14:54:50] <daubers> Daviey suggested a months time
[14:54:55] <r-> curses!
[14:54:56] * Mez may be able to chair dependant on WHEN
[14:54:58] <popey> i say 2 weeks today
[14:55:02] <Mez> r-: ncurses
[14:55:08] <Daviey> *however*, i think we should try and be pretty strict for an hour length.
[14:55:22] <issyl0> Daviey: yep.
[14:55:24] <daubers> Mez: Would you be able to chair in 2 weeks time?
[14:55:36] <DanielRM> matti: why?
[14:55:40] <Mez> Daviey: as much as that'd be nice, it's not neccesarily possible
[14:55:45] <Mez> daubers: TIME?
[14:55:47] <Mez> damn caps
[14:55:56] <daubers> Mez: About the same as today?
[14:55:57] <Daviey> popey: why 2 weeks? Is that enough time for people to complete the ACTION's?
[14:55:59] <u-uk-offtop> DanielRM: can chair :p
[14:56:01] <DJones> Should meetings be held in -meeting? What do other loco's do, or is it just the primary channels that use -meeting?
[14:56:04] <matti> DanielRM: I can't say. We have to go on -offtopic.
[14:56:05] <daubers> Daviey: Popeys suggestion
[14:56:06] <matti> DanielRM: ;]
[14:56:17] <daubers> Daviey: And actions can be ongoing :)
[14:56:18] <popey> Daviey: because we havent had meetings for a while, seemed like a good way to get cracking
[14:56:22] <popey> and keep things moving
[14:56:28] <popey> can revert back to monthly after?
[14:56:32] <Daviey> ok
[14:56:33] <Mez> daubers: I can do 2 weeks time
[14:56:36] <popey> not expecting all actions to be done
[14:56:39] <popey> just some
[14:56:40] <Daviey> 2 weeks sounds good
[14:56:41] <popey> maybe a start
[14:56:43] <Daviey> 2 weeks today?
[14:56:48] <DanielRM> matti: heh, we didn't action that though.
[14:56:48] <popey> ya
[14:56:49] <AlanBell> 2 weeks, 17th
[14:56:52] <daubers> ok, Mez has volunteered to chair 2 weeks today :)
[14:56:52] <matti> DanielRM: The rule of thumb: Ain't broken, don't fix it.
[14:57:05] <issyl0> 17th...hmm, let me look at my calendar.
[14:57:05] <popey> matti: we didnt say go to -offtopic
[14:57:11] <Mez> daubers: 7:30, right?
[14:57:18] <daubers> [ACTION] Mez to chair the next meeting on the 17th
[14:57:25] <matti> popey: Yes, I know. :)
[14:57:30] <daubers> Mez: Ish, feel free to move it a little to suit you
[14:57:31] <Daviey> super.
[14:57:35] <popey> can someone add it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Calendar
[14:57:37] <DanielRM> matti: the problem is that some people think it is broken. I don't like the idea much of becoming slightly more strict, but if it's not overbearing and it makes some people feel more comfortable then I've no objection.
[14:57:45] <daubers> Are we done?
[14:57:46] <issyl0> Hmm, I'll endeavour to be around on the 17th, no garuntees though. :)
[14:57:47] <Mez> daubers: nah, it's just so I know where to put it on my calendar :D
[14:57:50] * Daviey prods daubers with endmeeting
[14:57:59] <daubers> #endmeeting
Meeting ended.

CategoryUKTeam