Meeting 2008 Mar 16th

• Meeting Topic - How to proceed for April

Team Page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom
Meeting Minutes by: Trevor Sharpe

Present

The following were present during this meeting:

• visualperception
• Zelut
• Heartsbane
• herlo
• pleia2
• highvoltage

Agenda

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom/MeetingAgenda2008Mar16

Proceedings

• Meeting called to order at 1:59PM EST (GMT -0500), by Christer Edwards(Zelut)

• Review of Agenda
  • Nothing from US Teams
  • Solid date for Openweek
    • awaiting reply from Jono Bacon
  • New Wiki Layout: completed.
    • Announcement banner needed
  • Marketing blog widgets
    • To be discussed on mailing list
      • artwork
      • slogans
  • Discuss Hiveminder for group assignments
    • Is it a barrier to a open disclosure
      • Output methods: RSS, atom, ical, plain text

  • continue to use gobby?: gobby no longer in use except for group collaboration

  • Ubuntu-training email do we need to contact Belinda Lopez to perhaps join us?
• Follow up meeting date/time was established
• Classroom Guidelines moved back to next meeting

• Meeting called to end at 3:05PM EST (GMT -0500), by Christer Edwards(Zelut)

Assignments

• Contact Belinda Lopez at Ubuntu Training: pleia2
• Announcement banner: heartsbane
• Widgets Layout: visualperception
• seeking Presentation: Zelut
• Incorperate hiveminder output into the wiki: heartsbane
• Better IRC support on wiki: heartsbane

Additional

• Agreed to table discussion of Classroom Guidelines until next meeting again

  • https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom/Guidelines

    • definite review of sections 1.1.3 and 1.2.1

Discussion

The following is the discussion that took place in IRC. Times are MDT (GMT -0700):

11:59 < Zelut> looks like its about time to start
11:59 -!- etank [n=etank@ubuntu/member/etank] has joined #ubuntu-classroom
12:00 < Zelut> who do we have attending this time?
12:00  * highvoltage  
12:00 < visualdeception> just wondering would creating like a classroom-meeting room help??
12:01 < Zelut> let's give it a try in here, keep it public.
12:02 < Zelut> To get started, the agenda for this weeks meeting is here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom/MeetingAgenda2008Mar16
12:02 < Zelut> I'll just dive into the items..
12:02  * herlo is here
12:02 < Zelut> 1)  What have we heard back from Aaron Toponce at USTeams?
12:02 < Zelut> we've heard nada
12:03 < Zelut> So, we're going to scrap that for now.  I have followed up with him, but no progress so far.
12:03 < Zelut> We'll keep it on the table, but I think longer term.
12:03 < Zelut> any comments on that item?
12:04  * Zelut wonders if everyone is awake :)
12:04  * etank kinda
12:04 < visualdeception> sounds good to me
12:04 < Zelut> Let's try item 2
12:04 < Zelut> 2)  Can we define a solid date for Openweek?
12:05 < Zelut> I have emailed Jono about it.  Waiting for a reply.
12:05 < Zelut> I think it would be nice to produce OpenWeek this time around, we'll just need to collaborate with him.
12:05  * pleia2 nods
12:05 < visualdeception> agreed
12:05 < Zelut> So that item should be added to next weeks Agenda, and we'll wait for a reply.
12:06 < Zelut> 3)  Migrate new-improved wiki to overwrite old.
12:06 < Zelut> This task has been done.  Big ups to Heartsbane for attention there.
12:06 < pleia2> yay Heartsbane :)
12:06 < Zelut> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom looks much nicer and organized.
12:07 < Zelut> Heartsbane ftw!
12:07 < Zelut> 4) #
12:07 < Zelut> Should we create an announcement banner on the wiki?
12:08 < Zelut> This item was listed on hiveminder and Heartsbane took teh assignment.
12:08 < Zelut> He did mention he might be late today so perhaps we'll come back to that.
12:08 < Zelut> 5)  Creation of marketing blog widgets for upcoming events?
12:09 < Zelut> visualdeception: can you link to the draft widget you made?
12:09 < visualdeception> yep
12:09 < Zelut> I'd like to have some discussion on what we would like here.
12:09 < Zelut> I think these'll be great for marketing on blogs, etc.
12:09 < Heartsbane> I am here
12:10 < visualdeception> http://linux.dudenhofer.net/ubuntuclassroom.png
12:10 < Zelut> Heartsbane: cool. lets talk widgets and come back to the banner.
12:10 < visualdeception> a logo would be nice...not sure about the slogan
12:11 < Zelut> What does everyone think about a logo / slogan to put on these blog widgets?
12:11 < Zelut> I figured they could be like these - http://crunchbang.net/advocacy/,
12:11 < Zelut> thoughts?
12:12 < visualdeception> like a bulb? maybe in the ubuntu logo?
12:12 < pleia2> visualdeception's looks nice, we can think of a slogan
12:12 < Heartsbane> Maybe something less busy... not a bulb but a 'open' boot
12:13 -!- Syntux [n=jad@unaffiliated/madeye] has joined #ubuntu-classroom
12:13 < Heartsbane> just a thought
12:13 -!- highvoltage [n=jonathan@ubuntu/member/highvoltage] has left #ubuntu-classroom ["Leaving"]
12:13 < Zelut> something like - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IconsPage?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=info.png
12:13 < Zelut> or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IconsPage?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=example.png
12:14 < Zelut> Heartsbane: an open boot?
12:14 < pleia2> I like the chalkboard
12:14 < Heartsbane> Zelut: s/boot/book/
12:14 < Zelut> Heartsbane: open book?
12:14 < Heartsbane> sorry
12:14 < Heartsbane> I like the second suggestion
12:14 < Heartsbane> the chalkboard
12:15 < Zelut> maybe we can find something from the tango artwork.. they seem to have tons of custom icons.
12:15 < Zelut> how about a slogan?
12:15 < Zelut> what would we like the widgets to say?
12:16  * Heartsbane is thinking.
12:17 < pleia2> I don't have any ideas off the top of my head, I'll think about it though
12:17 < Zelut> "Ask not what Ubuntu can do for you, but what you can do for Ubuntu" ;)
12:18 < visualdeception> lol
12:18 < Heartsbane> Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. -- W. Edwards Deming (1900 - 1993)
12:19 < Zelut> Heartsbane: maybe a random polling of education/learning quotes
12:19 < visualdeception> if anyone thinks of one could just add it to the to do list
12:19 < Heartsbane> ya that quote is more like something for a scared straight ad
12:19 < herlo> Ubuntu-Classroom, not just for newbs
12:19 -!- mypapit [n=mypapit@pdpc/supporter/active/mypapit] has quit ["Leaving"]
12:19 < herlo> or noobs
12:20 < pleia2> heh
12:20 < visualdeception> do we want the slogan in the ubuntu font??
12:20 < Zelut> maybe we should start compilig a list
12:20 < Zelut> visualdeception: I don't think the slogan needs to be in the font, just readable..
12:21 < visualdeception> ok
12:21 < herlo> Ubuntu-classroom, we provide you bananas for every class you attend :)
12:21 < Heartsbane> no
12:22 < herlo> :) lol
12:22 -!- Gunirus [n=Gunirus@unaffiliated/Gunirus] has joined #ubuntu-classroom
12:22 < herlo> Ubuntu-classroom, the juggernaut to understanding
12:23 < Zelut> I'll create a hiveminder item where we can list slogans in comments. how 'bout that?
12:23 < pleia2> sounds good
12:23 < Heartsbane> k I think that this is something we can..... exactly... either that or mailing list
12:23 < Heartsbane> next item
12:24 < Zelut> Heartsbane: how about back to the banner.
12:24 < Heartsbane> k
12:24 < Zelut> Heartsbane: I see you've taken that assignment. anything to report?
12:25 < Heartsbane> I was going to only use the banner to report upcoming events, short and simple
12:25 < Heartsbane> but
12:25 < Heartsbane> someone suggested we could use it for more
12:25 < Heartsbane> I just wanted someone else thoughts
12:25 < pleia2> well, I think we do want to keep it relatively simple
12:25 < Zelut> what is 'more'?
12:27 < Heartsbane> well someone, who is not in the group suggested that we should use it to remind people
12:27 < Heartsbane> that you should ask support related questions in #ubuntu, #kubuntu, #edubuntu, or #xubuntu.
12:27 < Zelut> I think those reminders are handled well enough within IRC.  I don't think we need it on the wiki
12:28 < Heartsbane> and several other things but .... okay .... that is my thought something simple good
12:28 < Heartsbane> just throw that out there
12:28 < Heartsbane> k I will make a banner sometime tonight
12:28 < Zelut> I imagine something simple just to show the upcoming schedule.
12:28 < Heartsbane> unless anyone else has anything else to say
12:29 < visualdeception> simple is usually better on a webpage imo
12:29 < Heartsbane> k, next?
12:29 < Zelut> ok
12:29 < Zelut>  Try to get some more solid assignments for others on the list
12:30 < Zelut> one attempt to achieve this was to create the tasks in hiveminder that people can volunteer for.
12:30 < Zelut> for some of the main contributors we can assign tasks, but those that have been lurking can easily take a job.
12:30 < Zelut> the only problem is I don't think we can share that list to the general public
12:31 < visualdeception> add one to the wiki? but them someone has to be constantly updating that
12:31 < Heartsbane> I don't see the trouble if they want to help, shouldn't they formally join the group?
12:31 < Zelut> visualdeception: yeah, then there is duplication and more effort to keep thim synched.
12:32 < Zelut> Heartsbane: should we just have a standard 'if you're in LP you have access to the tasks'?
12:32 < Zelut> Heartsbane: that way if they are formally part of the group they can take any job they want?
12:32 < Zelut> ..and the tasks are all planning related, which is what LP has been limited to so far.
12:32 < Heartsbane> Zelut: that is my personal thought, anyone else want to weigh in a opinion
12:33 < Zelut> pleia2: thoughts?
12:33 < pleia2> well, it would be nice if the tasks could be made public, then people could see what there is before they decide to join the project
12:33 < Zelut> pleia2: I know you have concern about needing to learn additional applications..
12:33 < pleia2> but if there isn't a way to do it..
12:33 < pleia2> yeah, using hiveminder does increase the barrier to entry
12:33 < Zelut> pleia2: if we could submit 'bugs' against a team we could do it on LP.. but I don't think we can.
12:33 < pleia2> which is unfortunate
12:34 < visualdeception> is there a way we could sync hiveminder....or vice versa
12:34 < Zelut> this kind of leads to the next item which we can combine here..
12:34 < pleia2> I'm wondering about visualdeception's idea - maybe just put major tasks up on a wiki page? or just describe the *types* of stuff we need done rather than specifics?
12:34 < Heartsbane> Zelut: why is it, prohibitted to submit a bug against a Team in LP?
12:34 < Zelut> should we keep using hiveminder?  those that have been using it, what are your thoughts?
12:35 < Zelut> Heartsbane: there just isn't the functionality.. no 'submit bug' button for teams/people.
12:35 < visualdeception> i think its nice, but might be leaving people out that might be willing to help if they knew what needed to be done
12:35 -!- andrea-bs [n=andrea@ubuntu/member/beeseek.developer.andrea-bs] has joined #ubuntu-classroom
12:35 < visualdeception> hiveminder does have an rss feed
12:35 < Heartsbane> thank god or I would have a whole lot of bugs
12:35 < visualdeception> woops atom
12:36 < pleia2> oh, an atom feed might be useful
12:36 < Zelut> visualdeception: that could to the trick
12:36 < herlo> visualdeception: I think it does rss too
12:36 < Zelut> it does plain text, ical or atom output
12:36 < Zelut> that could help with publishing the tasks without manual reproduction
12:36 -!- andrea-bs [n=andrea@ubuntu/member/beeseek.developer.andrea-bs] has left #ubuntu-classroom []
12:36 < Heartsbane> visualdeception: nice
12:36 < herlo> oh
12:37 < Zelut> so should we have people subscribe to the atom feed? output the plain text to a wiki import?
12:37 -!- Syntux [n=jad@unaffiliated/madeye] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
12:37 < Zelut> RSS is zero work on our part, a little on the user.
12:37 < visualdeception> probably, is there a way we could automate this
12:37 < pleia2> output plain text to a wiki import?
12:38 < pleia2> if that could be automated that would be nice
12:38 < Zelut> pleia2: output the plain text listing of tasks and manually import it to the wiki, but that still leaves that overhead for us.
12:38  * pleia2 nods
12:38 < Zelut> the problem I think with the RSS is that it outputs once per 24hrs
12:38 < visualdeception> what about that program nixternal wrote about...hold let me check something
12:38 < Zelut> ..so someone might subscribe wondering the tasks, and not see them until the next day.
12:39 < Zelut> visualdeception: editmoin? we'd still have to maintain it.
12:39 < pleia2> well, it would at least give some idea to folks about the project - then they can join up and take tasks once they join
12:39 < Zelut> what about the ical?
12:39 < visualdeception> http://blog.nixternal.com/2008.03.08/ubuntu-wiki-editing-made-easy/
12:39 < Zelut> visualdeception: yeah, that's just CLI based wiki editing..
12:40 < Zelut> visualdeception: it won't import anything, so its the same amount of work.
12:40 < Heartsbane> visualdeception: ya ya ya editmoin already doing it
12:40 < visualdeception> lol
12:40 < Heartsbane> :)
12:40 < visualdeception> wasnt sure if you could import
12:40 < Heartsbane> nope
12:40 < visualdeception> that sucks
12:40 < Zelut> wait, one sec..
12:41  * Heartsbane waits.
12:41 < Zelut> does this require authentication?
12:41 < Zelut> http://hiveminder.com/let/christer.edwards%40gmail.com/feed/format/text/tokens/owner%20nobody%20not%20complete
%20but_first%20nothing%20group%203584/28cf2cfc54ea8a33
12:42 < Zelut> yeck, tinyurl ftw
12:42 < Zelut> what I'm trying to find is whether we can just link to the plain text output
12:42 < Zelut> that way, if they are interested, they open the plain text link and see what's on the agenda
12:42 -!- Syntux [n=jad@unaffiliated/madeye] has joined #ubuntu-classroom
12:42 < Zelut> if they want to work with us in hiveminder they join LP and we add them too the group
12:44 < pleia2> yeah that works without login
12:44 < Zelut> so maybe we tinyurl a direct link to the plain text? that's simple enough on both ends right?
12:45 < pleia2> +1
12:45 < Zelut> we don't have to maintain anything seperate and they just read a text file..
12:45 < visualdeception> does the text link auto update when a task is added or closed?
12:45 < Zelut> it should
12:46 < Zelut> it looks like its auto-generated based on the URL
12:46 < visualdeception> cool
12:46 < Heartsbane> I think that is worht a shot
12:46 < Zelut> ok then.
12:47 < Zelut> so we'll use that to show what we are working on, and if they want to join they can join LP and they'll be given access to hiveminder too.
12:47 < Zelut> deal?
12:47 < visualdeception> sounds good to me
12:47 < Heartsbane> +1
12:47 < Zelut> done
12:47 < Zelut> next item.
12:47 < Zelut> #
12:47 < Zelut> Continue using gobby? irc? what to do about lurkers in classroom?
12:48 < Zelut> I think, now that we're done with the main wiki work, we may not need gobby?
12:48 < visualdeception> +1
12:48 < Heartsbane> I like gobby for collaborative thinking, when you all need to be working together
12:48 < pleia2> +1
12:49 < Heartsbane> but that i just me I can go with the group
12:49 < pleia2> Heartsbane: but that might be only sometimes? rather than full meetings?
12:49 < Heartsbane> true
12:49 < Zelut> it has its place, true.
12:49 < Heartsbane> I abstain, with a 0 ... :)
12:49 < Heartsbane> I will go with the group
12:49 < Zelut> I think, moving forward, unless there is a real need for it we won't hold the meetings in gobby?
12:50 < Zelut> but when there is a document (perhaps submitted presentations) to be looked over we can plan to use it.
12:51 < Zelut> also, do we want to keep meeting in here with all these lurkers? :)
12:51 < pleia2> yes, most of the lurkers are here beause they are interested in the project :)
12:51 < Zelut> I'm guessing a portion of these people are lurking since the last openweek :)
12:51 < Heartsbane> Yes
12:52 < Heartsbane> Open discussions might spark more involvement, and presentations
12:52  * pleia2 nods
12:52 < Zelut> so we'll keep it in here and be transparent and all that :)
12:52 < Zelut> +1
12:53 < Heartsbane> unless anyone objects
12:53 < pleia2> +1
12:53 < visualdeception> +!
12:53 < visualdeception> 1
12:53 < Heartsbane> hahaha
12:53 < Zelut> ok, next item.
12:53 < Zelut> #
12:53 < Zelut> Discussion of invitation from Belinda Lopez at Ubuntu-Training to collaborate on future events.
12:53 < Heartsbane> Does anyone know belinda?
12:53 < Zelut> Heartsbane: I do
12:53 < pleia2> yep
12:54 < Heartsbane> I don't ... I would really like to see them present
12:54 < Zelut> I guess I don't quite understand the item..
12:54 < Zelut> we want to have ubuntu-training present?
12:54 < Heartsbane> I didn't quite understand her email
12:54 < Heartsbane> What exactly is she offering?
12:55 < Zelut> nobody sure?
12:55 < Heartsbane> Anyone? Belinda are you out there?
12:55 < visualdeception> looking for her email
12:55 < pleia2> her nick is dinda - she's not here
12:55 < pleia2> I can ask her for clarification though, I talk to her often enough
12:55 < Zelut> she's rarely on IRC that I've seen
12:56 < Zelut> or maybe I'm just in all the wrong channels
12:56 < Heartsbane> I take it you both have had contact with her? can someone ask her how ubuntu-training would like to contribute?
12:57 < Zelut> pleia2: can you follow up with her then?
12:57 < pleia2> Zelut: will do
12:57 < Zelut> ok
12:57 < Zelut> last item and we need to wrap up
12:57 < Zelut> Since we don't have a solid team locked-in perhaps a public 'call for papers' and have a big community-powered presentation?
12:57 < Zelut> I was thinking we could treat it like a conference and give people a chance to submit presentations.
12:58 < Zelut> the project does aim to help people get involved, how better than letting users teach other users how to get involved.
12:58 < Heartsbane> I know something done in Django on google code
12:58 < visualdeception> sounds good....for the march class or later on?
12:58 < Heartsbane> *cough* maybe we could adapt it *cough*
12:59 < Zelut> Heartsbane: how so?
13:00 < Zelut> I think march is out, but april should still work.
13:00 < Heartsbane> we could just redo conman if you want to do call for papers web based app
13:00 < Heartsbane> but I don't really see the need quite yet
13:00 < Zelut> Heartsbane: I hadn't thought of conman, but I figured people could just email in their proposals.
13:01 < Zelut> if presenters submit to us we don't have to go looking for them (outside of marketing)
13:01 < Heartsbane> oh just sounded to me like you were looking for something bigger
13:01 < Zelut> same style, but just let people submit presentations to us and market a 'call for papers' type of thing in the marketing.
13:02 < Heartsbane> k
13:02 < Zelut> not conference-big, but a similar idea with the call for papers..
13:02 < Heartsbane> Can I ask that we put the redo of the Classroom Guidelines on next weeks agenda
13:02 < Heartsbane> it needs a serious overhaul
13:02 < Zelut> Heartsbane: sure
13:03 < Zelut> also, remember any of you can add/manage tasks in hiveminder
13:03 < Zelut> if you think of anything that needs done assign it or put it in the 'up for grabs'
13:03 < Heartsbane> k
13:04 < Zelut> I need to wrap up and get ready for my flight.
13:04 < Zelut> anything left unresolved?
13:04 < Heartsbane> Any other suggestions for next week? or unresolved?
13:05 < Zelut> I think that's about it then.
13:05 < Heartsbane> anyone still at the keyboard?
13:05 < Heartsbane> anyone?
13:05 < visualdeception> yes
13:05  * Zelut pounds the gavel. adjourned!
13:05 < pleia2> :)
13:07 < Heartsbane> K I will have this all typed up by tonight as per usual