This is a log or summary of an Edubuntu Meeting. Please go to the Meeting Page for more information about our meetings.
Meeting March 29, 2006
=== highvoltage rolls drums 01:58 highvoltage 2 minutes to meeting! === ogra is particulary busy with flight-6 02:00 JaneW hi 02:00 pips1 hello all 02:00 JaneW ogra: it going to be out today? 02:01 ogra looks like === jelkner [email@example.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 02:01 ogra latest tomorrow 02:01 ogra depends which kind of bugs we'll find testing it === flint [firstname.lastname@example.org] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === kjcole yawns and rubs eyes... 02:02 flint good morning campers... 02:03 highvoltage hi mr flint 02:03 flint kjcole, is this the right channel? it is 07:03 and I hav not pissed anyone off yet! 02:03 flint highvoltage, good morning jonathan!! 02:04 highvoltage yay! only one h! 02:04 kjcole flint, shhh. I'm pretending to still be blissfully asleep. 02:04 jelkner flint: call me back, i didn't get to tell you about the next hack yet 02:04 flint highvoltage, remember what i always say jonathan, there is only one "I" in idiot... 02:05 highvoltage who's here and who's not? 02:05 flint :^) === highvoltage is Jonathan Carter 02:05 jelkner ogra: did you see my bablings on #edubuntu yesterday? 02:05 highvoltage :) === kjcole is Kevin Cole 02:05 JaneW ok we have a silent ogra === jelkner is Jeffrey Elkner 02:05 JaneW preparing edubuntu flight 6 02:05 ogra JaneW, s/silent/busy/ 02:05 ogra :) 02:06 JaneW ogra: is edubuntu dapper basically done now? === irvin_ [email@example.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra is OliverGrawert 02:06 ogra JaneW, apart from artwork and CD pressing i think so ... 02:06 JaneW ogra: excellent, thanks and WELL DONE 02:06 ogra thats also my tech update ... :) 02:06 JaneW way ahead of the original schedule even 02:06 highvoltage wow, that was a short tech update! :) 02:06 ogra new and improved artwork package, flight-6 preparation 02:07 JaneW ogra: you showing off your artwork in flight 6? 02:07 ogra yep === JaneW will have to get highvoltage to demo 02:07 ogra thats why i have to rebuild it currently ... === JaneW realises she started here 1 year ago tomorrow... 02:07 highvoltage ogra: Bluekuja and I will rally up some testers, we also want to work with you to create a kind of a standard testing feedback form/checklist 02:07 JaneW wow 02:07 ogra kde was rebuuilt yesterdayx, so kdeedu was broken 02:07 JaneW the cookbook meeting is tomorrow 02:07 ogra yep 02:07 kjcole ogra, so is Flight 6 = final? or even > final (Dapper+1)? 02:08 JaneW kjcole and jelkner will you be attending that? ^^ 02:08 ogra kjcole, final is june 1st 02:08 ogra or a week before that date 02:08 JaneW kjcole: not dapper +1, we are still working on Dapper! 02:08 ogra there will still be many flights 02:08 kjcole janew, though I doubt I'll have much to say, I plan to be there. 02:08 jelkner JaneW: already on it! 02:08 highvoltage JaneW: but ogra said we can have dapper+1 on june 1 :( 02:08 JaneW kjcole: but we are down to QA and bug fixing mostly now, so no MAJOR changes now 02:08 ogra :P 02:09 JaneW highvoltage: dream on 02:09 JaneW although at this rate ogra could do it 02:09 ogra we'll surely get docs in as much as we can before release 02:09 jelkner JaneW: i'm in the process of upgrading our existing labs to Dapper 02:09 ogra oh, and we had a squeak bughunt yesterday 02:09 JaneW jelkner: great, how's it going? 02:09 jelkner early indication is that is works *much* better 02:09 JaneW ogra: good, and? 02:09 ogra so squeak will work as expected by the squeak community 02:09 kjcole janew, I was curious if "edubuntu dapper is basically done now" what flight 6 was if not final 02:09 JaneW jelkner: awesome! 02:09 ogra (which it apparently didnt in breezy) 02:09 jelkner the little bugs that used to appear (such as log in failing) are gone 02:10 highvoltage kjcole: it needs testing and bug fixing, it's feature-complete, though 02:10 jelkner it boots faster, logs in faster 02:10 jelkner looks better 02:10 ogra :) 02:10 JaneW kjcole: we have a set release date with the rest of Dapper, the delay is for extensive localisation work and MAJOR QA and bug fixing 02:10 kjcole janew, ogra ah. I see. 02:10 jelkner what's not to love! 02:10 ogra great to hear that from you jelkner :) 02:10 JaneW jelkner: get yourself quoted in the press again === ogra makes not to put some extra effort into LDA for dapper+1 to please jelkner :) 02:11 ogra s/not/note/ 02:11 flint ogra, LDA is local storage eh? 02:11 highvoltage so. can i say a few words on some edubuntu community ideas? 02:11 highvoltage or are we still on tech? 02:11 jelkner ogra: yes, we will need that, but for now, flint is working on a hack solution 02:12 ogra flint, exactly 02:12 ogra jelkner, we'll get all the stuff from ltsp.org into universe 02:12 kjcole ogra, you KNOW he won't be pleased enough, and will just want more. ;-) 02:12 ogra (for dapper and if mdz doesnt deny it indeed :) ) 02:12 highvoltage kjcole: and that's why we love him 02:13 highvoltage *ahem* 02:13 jelkner ogra: i have a question about the new features such as watch teacher, etc. === G0SUB [n=ghoseb@ubuntu/member/g0sub] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 02:13 ogra jelkner, watch teacher ? 02:13 jelkner does herman know how they work, and will he be able to get them in the cookbook? === janimo [n=jani@Home03207.cluj.astral.ro] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 02:14 jelkner the thing you showed me at below zero that allows teachers to view the processes of students 02:14 ogra ah 02:14 jelkner and to share their desktops with students 02:14 ogra the student-control-panel .... 02:14 jelkner yes 02:14 jelkner where is that? 02:14 ogra sharing isnt implemented for dapper 02:14 ogra in universe 02:14 jelkner ah 02:14 jelkner thanks! 02:15 ogra it currently gives you only control to see students and kick them off 02:15 flint ogra, ollie, is language switching included or includable into the student control panel? 02:15 ogra but in #ltsp several intrested people showed up that want to write extensions and patches 02:15 ogra flint, nope, since it should be done with the language selector ... 02:16 ogra its completely unrelated to s-c-p 02:16 flint ogra, the language selector is run from the student console. this is not right for a classroom 02:16 ogra flint, the language selector is the tool we use in ubuntu for language selection 02:16 kjcole flint, jelkner I might be blind, but I just noticed language-selector showing up in synaptic a few days ago... 02:16 flint ogra, thus the student controls the language. the teacher needs control. 02:17 ogra flint, about the language ? 02:17 ogra what for ? 02:17 jelkner ogra: absolute beginners shouldn't have to set anything 02:17 ogra kjcole, its installed by default since breezy on every ubuntu/edubuntu desktop ... 02:17 jelkner i need to preset it for them 02:18 ogra jelkner, yes, so use the language selector to do that :) 02:18 jelkner ok 02:18 kjcole ogra, has it been in dapper long? (That's where I remember seeing it show up.) 02:18 ogra if it doesnt work as expected, file a bug against language selector 02:18 ogra kjcole, it has been there since breezy ... 02:19 flint ogra, i will take a look at the new language selector in dapper. 02:19 ogra flint, its not new :) 02:19 kjcole ogra, so, I am blind. ;-) 02:19 flint ogra, if it is the old one, then it does not do the job required by elkner. 02:20 flint ogra, we got a hack that does the job. no problem 02:20 ogra flint, see above 02:20 ogra hacks are not the solution ... 02:20 jelkner i'm a bit behind in preparing for today's classes, i need to run 02:20 flint ogra, gotcha, but hacks are a step towards a solution. 02:20 jelkner great work on dapper! it rocks! 02:21 ogra if you had filed that wehne we discussed it (i remember telling jelkner to use the language selector after UBZ in #edubuntu) it would be fixed now 02:21 flint ogra, he only told me about it two weeks ago. I found it an interesting problem, build a solution and posted it. 02:22 pips1 ogra, do you know of any new/extra feature that made it into dapper "unexpectedly", because of the delay? or none? (I know the delay wasn't for adding features, but still... :-) ) 02:22 ogra flint, try to improve what we have to work right is the way we do it in ubuntu :) 02:22 flint ogra, you know about the interesting problem problem. 02:22 ogra pips1, nope 02:22 ogra apart from network manager WPA support 02:22 pips1 right === highvoltage [n=Jono@126.96.36.199] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 02:23 ogra (i never undestood who needs that anyway, but people cry for it) === pips1 googles for WPA support 02:23 flint ogra, what is WPA support? (early no coffee:^) 02:24 JaneW same as last time you asked flint :P 02:24 highvoltage hehe 02:24 ogra flint, some weird encryption stuff for wireless 02:24 JaneW wireless protocol authenication support 02:24 ogra the next generation WEP :) 02:24 flint JaneW, I had coffee last time I asked... 02:24 JaneW flint: ah, valid point :) 02:24 ogra i have never used it and dont know *anybody* who does personally ... 02:24 flint ogra, why do we care about wireless support in Edubuntu? 02:25 ogra but users scream for it, so thats our exception of the "no new features" rule 02:25 ogra flint, because we support it 02:25 flint ogra, you are just pulling my leg he he... 02:26 flint ogra, Ollie, if there was ever a need for the exception to the "no new features" rule it is LDA... 02:27 flint ogra, Hacking is a time honored form of civil disobedience. in this case my hacking is adversarial with the "ubuntu way" but it remains a protest. 02:27 ogra flint, nope ... NM and WPA is existent LDA would have to be developed 02:27 flint ogra, ok i should try to develop it. bash here i come!!! 02:27 flint :^) 02:27 ogra flint, it will happen for dapper+1 02:28 flint ogra, any idea how and who? 02:28 ogra and i'm pretty happy to have the ltsp LDA implementation at this time to find the drawbacks and improve it for us ... 02:28 kjcole flint, your distro can be "Lame Duck" to differentiate it from "Dapper Drake". ;-) 02:28 ogra flint, likely me 02:28 flint kjcole, I even have the graphic!!! ask Jane 02:29 ogra flint, and through scripted commands, magic and rocket science (to answer the how) 02:29 flint ogra, if it is likely you, and you can tolerate my "help" i would be honored to help you. 02:29 ogra any other tech questions ? 02:30 flint :^) 02:30 ogra flint, appreciated ! :) 02:30 ogra i'm not yet sure if i want to go the ltsp.org path, we might end up with something completely different 02:30 pips1 who wouldn't remember http://www.flint.com/wvus ? ;-) 02:31 ogra but thats stuff for the conference and BOFs 02:31 flint pips1, I have a great affection for that duck which is spilling over to you. :^) 02:31 pips1 flint, indeed 02:32 flint lol... 02:32 pips1 :-) 02:32 pips1 highvoltage ? === highvoltage is here 02:33 pips1 "highvoltage: so. can i say a few words on some edubuntu community ideas?" 02:33 highvoltage is it our turn now? 02:34 flint ogra, final stoopid question. is flight 6 in the daily build queue? 02:34 highvoltage oh, yes. 02:34 highvoltage I've been chatting to Bluekaja, young guy from Italy 02:34 highvoltage his real name is Andrea Veri 02:34 ogra flint, not yet ... the isos wait for a new network manager package to be finished 02:34 highvoltage he's very excited and enthusiastic about ubuntu and edubuntu 02:34 ogra flint, but the daily that comes today will be flight6 02:35 highvoltage and he's doing lots of advocacy work in italy, talking to educators in schools close by. 02:35 flint ogra, congratulations 02:35 kjcole highvoltage, pips1 is this re the CC agenda about Edubuntu LoCo's? 02:35 ogra flint, thanks, kepp testing ;) 02:35 highvoltage he wants to start an edubuntu loco team, and we'll have to put some thinking in that 02:35 ogra *keep even 02:35 highvoltage kjcole: yes 02:35 highvoltage kjcole: i put it in the agenda of the next CC meeting 02:36 flint highvoltage, jonathan this is a good idea. 02:36 highvoltage there are some options, such as, should it be an ubuntu loco with an educational focus, or should people be allowed to create an edubuntu specific loco 02:36 olive Hello. Is there a schedule for conference packs of Dapper ? 02:36 highvoltage i have views on both, but i suppose it's a CC decision? how does the rest of the edubuntu community feel about it? 02:37 kjcole highvoltage, I recall that CC meeting is at an impossible hour for me, but would like to voice support for it. 02:37 highvoltage kjcole: sure, i could forward it for you, if you like 02:37 ogra olive, this is a meeting channel, a meeting is going on 02:37 olive sorry, bad channel. 02:37 ogra :) 02:37 olive :s 02:38 highvoltage seems not :) 02:38 highvoltage the Ubuntu CC meeting is on 3 April 02:38 highvoltage at 9:00 UTC 02:39 highvoltage that's the loco team issue. 02:39 ogra eek, middle of the night 02:39 pips1 highvoltage, Bluekaja is from Italy... is there already a Italian LoCo? I assume so... highvoltage, what are your views on having an edubuntu LoCo? 02:39 flint highvoltage, your option proposition may need to be considered by the CC eh? === licio [n=licio@ubuntu/member/licio] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 02:39 highvoltage pips1: yes, there's an italian loco. i think that an additional edubuntu loco would be useful, since the italian loco might already have its goals. 02:39 highvoltage flint: yes. 02:40 highvoltage JaneW/ogra: do you have any strong feeling either way? 02:40 pips1 hmm... so you mean the goals might not overlap enough? 02:41 JaneW highvoltage: I don;t have strong feelings 02:41 kjcole highvoltage, sure forward my support. When advertising our loco I describe it as one with an educational focus, as I think that is sufficient, but if there was more specific swag and/or official literature for a more specific kind of LoCo that would be great! 02:41 flint pips1, the goals of an ubuntu loco and edubuntu loco are clearly different. you have a point. 02:41 JaneW but we must be careful not to fragment our group too much 02:41 highvoltage pips1: there'll probably be *some* overlap, perhaps with some cases, there might be a lot of overlap, and then they could merge 02:41 JaneW results in duplication of effort and diluted support capacity 02:41 ogra i know the german ubuntuforums.de has a edubuntu section ... 02:41 highvoltage in some cases, it might be better to have the edubuntu loco as part of the bigger loco 02:42 highvoltage but i think it's important to have some guidelines set in place 02:42 flint ogra, the germans are known to be organized :^) 02:42 ogra heh, true 02:42 highvoltage otherwise people start all kinds of locos all over the place and effort gets wasted 02:42 flint ogra, comparing italians and germans... 02:42 flint :^) 02:42 highvoltage i'll post about this to the list too, and we could get some wider feedback there too, before going to CC 02:42 highvoltage then there's some other community stuffies... 02:43 ogra the french community also does its own thing since a while 02:43 flint ogra, ....but those not the kind of clutural differences we need to dwell upon, the difference between hackers and educators is the nub of this one... 02:43 highvoltage i've reeled bluekaja in to help us with our launchpad groups too, there's quite a bunch now and they're not very organised :/ 02:43 highvoltage here's a list of them: 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu: (24 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Advocacy: (2 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Artwork: (12 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubunut Brasil: (8 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Cookbook Cooks: (11 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Documentation: (11 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Testers: (2 members) 02:43 highvoltage Edubuntu Website: (9 members) 02:44 highvoltage Edubuntu Chile: (8 members) 02:44 highvoltage Edubuntu Study Content: (7 members) 02:44 ogra we have a testers team ? 02:44 ogra why dont i know about that 02:44 highvoltage brasil and chile are okay, because they are self managed. website is also ok, because pips and i will get the community involved when drupal is set up. 02:44 highvoltage ogra: we don't really have a testers team yet 02:44 ogra 2 members 02:45 pips1 I also agree that overly fragmenting might not be that good... especially if the community is small. on the other hand, being able to make your own decisions will help volunteers to thrive on their enthusiasm :-) 02:45 flint highvoltage, I wanna be on the testers team can i, can i? 02:45 highvoltage ogra: yes, bluekaja and I are starting a testers team, i told you about that earlier in this meeting? 02:45 highvoltage flint: of course 02:45 flint highvoltage, thanks! 02:45 ogra highvoltage, 3 members 02:45 highvoltage bluekaja will help organise these groups, bit by bit 02:46 highvoltage we're planning to start rallying for testers in about two weeks, although we won't stop it from happening earlier, if it does happen to happen or if someone else wants to step up 02:46 highvoltage what's perhaps a bit more important right now, is sorting out some of our existing groups, such as documentation, edubuntu (main), etc. 02:46 flint highvoltage, testers need to be busy testing... 02:47 pips1 it would be helpfull to have a edubuntu-specific testing plan... 02:47 highvoltage perhaps we need to get the members of Edubuntu in the subgroups they're interested in, and subscribe those groups to Edubuntu instead. 02:47 highvoltage pips1: yep 02:47 flint pips1, yes it would... and that is another good idea that came out of this meeting... 02:47 ogra you can just flllow the standard ubuntu plan ... 02:47 ogra apart from testing ltsp ... 02:47 highvoltage ogra: does that include some ltsp... 02:47 highvoltage oh. 02:47 flint ogra, you got a url for this test plan? 02:48 ogra its on the wiki somewhere 02:48 flint ogra, lol... 02:48 highvoltage i think we can make some additional tests for things we know are edubuntu specific, like testing for gcompris gremlins, that schooltool runs nicely, etc, etc 02:48 pips1 Testing/Long and Testing/Short 02:49 flint i propose that the first thing the edubuntu test group do is to find the silly ubuntu test plan eh? 02:49 highvoltage flint: good idea. noted. 02:49 highvoltage so that's some plans in the edubuntu community, i think we can expand on that at next week's meeting, this one is running out a bit. 02:50 ogra yep 02:50 pips1 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Short 02:50 highvoltage on the edubuntu drupal website, pip1 and i have been experimenting with some off-line modules 02:50 pips1 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Long === flint smells the coffee and can no longer resist... 02:50 highvoltage we're having a 'sprint' to get a lot of the work done over the weekend, by monday a very large part of the website will be done 02:51 highvoltage from there it should mostly be fine-tuning until we go live. 02:51 ogra note that we should only have the basic stuff for ltsp testing required ... 02:51 flint pips1, excellent you are something else! how do you do this? the king of bookmarks!!! 02:51 highvoltage ogra: noted 02:51 pips1 hehe 02:51 ogra i.e. enabling sound requires a lts.conf, do we want to bother rthe user with that ? 02:52 highvoltage ogra: we can mark it as an optional test 02:52 ogra yep 02:52 highvoltage i think testing functions in lts.conf is very important 02:52 highvoltage we could make that a test of its own. 02:52 ogra the default should only require editing /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf, restarting dhcpd and testing if clients boot and let you in 02:52 highvoltage i'm sure people like jelkner, flint, etc, wouldn't mind providing feedback on something that's a bit technical 02:53 pips1 what about testing the education apps? list it too? 02:53 ogra sure 02:53 highvoltage i think we should put a lot of focus on everything that's edubuntu specific 02:53 ogra yep 02:53 flint highvoltage, testing from a plan is so organized it is practically Teutonic! :^) 02:53 highvoltage the rest of the ubuntu stuff should be safe to assume OK, but users could of course test other things too, nothing wrong with being thorrow with testing 02:54 highvoltage flint: we'll put in a field called "Other:" 02:54 highvoltage :) 02:54 ogra put in a field called Flint: 02:54 ogra ;) 02:54 flint highvoltage, do not count on elkner as a tester in this sense. he tests at another level... 02:55 highvoltage hehe 02:55 flint ogra, be careful what you wish for he he 02:55 ogra heh 02:56 flint this is very good. the only downer is i went and got a job at a local php house... i needed the money. so my time will be a little limited. 02:56 highvoltage ogra: i just wanted to say, i didn't purposely exclude you from any testing team, i just created the team on launchpad when i had the idea the other night, and bluekaja just happened to find it and join it 02:57 pips1 ogra, I feel those two testing guidelines in the wiki (cf. above) are good for "average" Desktop users... do you know of additional, more "technical" testing guidelines? what about testing hardware compatability, server stuff, etc.? 02:57 ogra highvoltage, i dont feel left out, dont worry :) 02:57 flint highvoltage, properly and with deverence to Oliver, he needs to be excluded. but that is his option... 02:58 ogra pips1, if the tests from the wiki work , your HW will be working fine ... 02:58 pips1 right 02:58 ogra i dont theink we need special testing for that 02:59 flint the real fun comes when you automate the testing... any ideas on that Olli? 02:59 ogra apart from schooltool and ltsp ... 02:59 highvoltage is schoolbell still seperate from schooltool? 02:59 ogra flint, nope, but someone works on that, it was a BOF and spec 02:59 ogra highvoltage, yep 02:59 flint ogra, interesting... 02:59 flint highvoltage, both schoolbell and schooltool are zope3 thingies... 02:59 ogra i think diziet === highvoltage > #edubuntu 03:00 ogra so any other business ? 03:01 ogra JaneW, ? 03:01 flint i am not gonna ask pips1 to dig up the auto testing spec, as my cup runneth over with the effort he has already made... 03:01 ogra wanna tell us about CDs ? 03:02 pips1 I believe the "schooltool 2006" major release has been delayed, the update that went into dapper is a minor update. for those interested in schooltool development status, seehttp://lists.schooltool.org/pipermail/schooltool/2006-March/001910.html 03:02 ogra pips1, its not *minor* :) 03:02 ogra they switched to zope3 03:02 ogra its pretty major ... 03:02 pips1 oh, so that change made it to dapper! 03:02 ogra and i guess that bound their ressources === flint flint, amazed at pips1 capability, staggers off to get coffee. 03:03 ogra there is noting changed apart from zope3 being the base ... 03:03 ogra no new features etc 03:04 ogra so seems JaneW is gone and we are done ... 03:04 ogra adjourned ? 03:04 kjcole Ogra +1 === nomed [firstname.lastname@example.org] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 03:05 JaneW sorry I am here 03:05 ogra ok, lets all move back to #edubuntu, thanks for attending 03:05 JaneW had some lag for a while 03:05 ogra ah 03:05 JaneW thanks all