CC_2006-05-30
06:10 Seveas anyway: let's get started and not hold up the release team 06:10 mako yes, definitely 06:10 azeem mako: congrats 06:10 msikma What's first on the agenda? 06:10 Seveas msikma's item is up first, about wiki licensing 06:11 msikma Aha, great. 06:11 Seveas I assume everyone has read the agenda 06:11 Kamion so, we had a brief discussion in the office about that (since we wanted to get Mark's opinion too) 06:12 msikma Yeah, about wiki licensing. Like mentioned, I've got some concerns about the content on the wiki. It's great that it is set to be released into the public domain, but I question how it would work for things put on there (code snippets, images, etc.) that the author doesn't want to or can't formally release into PD. 06:12 Kamion (we'd like to get mdke in too, but apparently he's not here) 06:12 Kamion I think we'd be OK with PD as a default with exceptions, if that's sanely implementable in the wiki 06:12 Seveas idle time close to 2.5 hours, he's likely not around === Yagisan isn't happy with PD 06:13 Kamion Yagisan: unfortunately there is nothing that makes everyone happy 06:13 msikma On Wikipedia, it's easy to simply put a different copyright notice in an image or other inclusion. 06:13 Kamion (I wanted MIT personally, but ...) 06:13 msikma This same system isn't currently in the wiki system we use and would have to be programmed in if this is a solution. 06:13 highvoltage heh, how relevant, we discussed this on #edubuntu today too. 06:13 Kamion do you have any idea how much code that would be? 06:13 msikma I personally don't have a clue, since I've never seen the source code for that wiki system. I'm also not really a PHP hacker. 06:14 Seveas it's python ;) (moinmoin) 06:14 msikma Aha === Yagisan was happy with the CC-BY-SA. Otherwise I'd never have contributed. It is exactly like asking me to re-license my GPL code to BSD 06:14 Seveas Yagisan, the license has been chosen - this discussion is NOT about which icense to use 06:14 Seveas please stay on topic 06:14 elmo Seveas: err, easy dude 06:15 Kamion Seveas: stop it, he's not advocating a particular licence, he's saying he doesn't like this choice - which is relevant 06:15 mhz regarding code...it shouldn't be that much...even just replacing one image fro another would work a patch solution 06:15 Seveas elmo: just trying not to go offtopic and keeping you from reease stuff too long 06:15 msikma The problem lies not in the license, but rather the fact that confusion may arise due to such things. At the very least, the license should read "all text in this wiki is released into the PD" rather than "all content". === gregraubie [n=greg@dsl-145-20-05.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:15 Kamion Seveas: we'll be faster if we don't have to have meta-arguments 06:15 mako PD is problematic 06:15 mako because the concept of public domain is not easily internationable 06:15 jsgotangco true 06:16 mako which is why the creative commons public domain dedication is the one license that is *not* part of hte icommons translations and internationalizations 06:16 msikma Maybe include a "if this is not legally possible, the authors waive all rights", mako? 06:16 Kamion mako: we did discuss that, btw - see WikiLicensing === mako nods 06:16 Kamion or for that matter the e-mail that went out 06:16 Yagisan Seveas: thanks. I was on topic, but that settles it. license revoked of all my work then as this happens far to often. The cange is a step back that can't be enforced. 06:16 Kamion Yagisan: please ignore Seveas 06:16 msikma In any case: if, for example, all wikicode were licensed as PD, there would likely not be a problem since that way you can still include images in pages with a different copyright. 06:17 Kamion Yagisan: this is not settled 06:17 msikma You'd only be releasing the text of the link into the PD rather than the image. 06:17 msikma But that's something a legal expert should confirm! 06:17 mako ok.. the wikimedia text looks nice 06:18 msikma All the PD images on Wikipedia, for example, also say "In case PD is not legally possible, all rights are waived." 06:18 msikma (Paraphrased.) 06:18 Kamion (the problem with CC-BY-SA, and most copylefts, FWIW, was licence compatibility and incorporation into documentation in the distro and stuff) === zul [n=chuck@ubuntu/member/zul] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:19 mako right, a more permissiable license, BSD style for example, would solve that 06:19 mako even the CC-BY license would solve that 06:19 mako because it allows sublicensing 06:19 msikma http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:PD-self 06:19 Kamion mako: I'm with you, but I'm not keen on going over it again and again, particularly since we did do this in a previous meeting and we don't have mdke here 06:19 eyequeue point of clarification: is this discussion about default licensure? there is still an option for the author to "unless specified as ___" correct? [y/n] (rather than waiving) 06:19 Kamion I think you were in the previous meeting too :) 06:19 msikma Quoting: "I grant any entity the right to use this work for any purpose, without any conditions, unless such conditions are required by law." 06:20 msikma eyequeue: yeah, that's the discussion. 06:20 msikma We should prevent license confusion. 06:20 Kamion in any event: I think we (FSVO we, Mark said he would be happy with this anyway) are happy for individuals to pick a different licence from the default as long as it's clearly marked so that people know what they're doing when they're borrowing wiki content for documentation 06:21 msikma The thing is, it's difficult to enforce people to do that. 06:21 mako Kamion: i'm not really thrilled with that 06:21 msikma Will they have to copypaste something whenever they want to release something in CC-BY-NC, for example? 06:21 mako i mean, it would be fine as long as we set some default limit or base set of expectations 06:21 msikma There are no templates in the wiki system we're using (unless I've simply never FOUND them before). 06:21 Kamion mako: it does make things more complicated but I cannot see that any single option is going to keep even the majority of contributors happy 06:21 mako Kamion: that's fine.. but we should ensure a base line 06:21 Kamion oh, yeah, limiting to "free-ish" licences obviously ... 06:21 mako Kamion: so you can waive or not waive attribution, but you shouldn't block commericial use 06:21 msikma A system like on Wikipedia works very well, but it would take time to program this in. 06:22 Yagisan Kamion: do you have a link (perhaps after meeting) on why CC-BY-SA isn't suitable 06:22 highvoltage blocking commercial use would make it a non-free license, yes. 06:22 mako Kamion: also, that is not part of the proposal AFAICT 06:23 msikma In any case, regardless of the license we'll use, we need to find some (easy) way to ensure people won't accidentally release their works into the public domain. 06:23 msikma I believe that not licensing images by default and stating that all content is PD "unless otherwise stated" is the key to doing this. 06:23 Kamion Yagisan: as I understand it, it's neither GPL-compatible nor GFDL-compatible 06:23 gnomefreak is this gonna change the way wikis are handled in making or contributing to wikis? === blakcheez [n=blakchee@adsl-70-239-1-103.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:24 msikma What is this discussion about? The license we'll use or legal rights confusion? The latter is on the agenda. 06:24 Kamion mako: not at the moment, but the proposal clearly needs some work based on the objections received at community-council@ IMO 06:24 mako the GFDL/CC-BY-SA compatibility situation might change 06:24 msikma mako: that will affect later versions of the CC licenses, not the ones there are now. 06:24 mako as in, folks are both sides are interested in solving that problem and working on it 06:24 mako msikma: that's correct === jojoman02 [n=khan@cbl-sd-51-27.aster.com.do] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:24 mako but almost all works, and concievably these too, would be under an "or any later version" clause 06:25 Yagisan msikma: there is confusion with PD. it isn't recognised in all countries. something like a CC license is (TTBOMK). 06:25 Kamion that's not something we would be wise to rely on IMO 06:25 msikma In any case, I don't think we should be discussing which license we're going to use. 06:25 msikma That's a different discussion. 06:25 msikma I would be fine with many different free licenses. 06:25 msikma My point is that it's not always useful to license everything into one specific license since this isn't always possible. 06:25 Kamion --> any possible licence we might choose will have objectors <-- 06:26 mako Kamion: that's right, and there's no timescale 06:26 mako msikma: and not everyone is happy contributing in a wiki at all, which is why we have multiple sources of documentation 06:26 mako and even multiple wikis! 06:26 msikma As far as I know, we're not discussing licenses, but rather we're discussing how we can prevent people from accidentally releasing things into the PD that they shouldn't. 06:27 Kamion the wikilicensing proposal already requires displaying a prominent notice 06:27 msikma But this would mean that, for example, you can't post GPL code snippets in the wiki, or post screenshots of themes or icon sets that are non-PD licensed. 06:27 Kamion https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WikiLicensing 06:27 Yagisan mako: ah, according to the email I got, May 10 (1 month after I recived it) all the wiki goes PD 06:27 Kamion Yagisan: *under discussion* === jojoman02 [n=khan@cbl-sd-51-27.aster.com.do] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] 06:27 Kamion ok, let me have a minute to type this 06:28 msikma Kamion: but isn't it so that if I were to post an image on the Wiki of a CC-licensed background, I would be attempting to release it into the PD? 06:28 msikma Which is, of course, impossible. 06:29 ompaul You can split the document and licence each part different, all you need to be is very clear about what you are posting. 06:29 mako i apologize for not being more actively involved in this discussion recently 06:29 msikma ompaul: explain. You mean post the image in a separate wikipage? 06:29 Kamion PROPOSAL: amend WikiLicensing to require implementation of some kind of licence markers in moin for individual pieces of content, and come up with a list of acceptable "free-ish" licences for wiki content from which people can choose; default remains as in the proposal (PD but with the wikimedia text to attempt to deal with internationalisation problems) === Klaidas [n=klaidas@unaffiliated/klaidas] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] 06:30 Kamion msikma: ^-- 06:30 Kamion licence markers would need to be selectable on posting 06:30 msikma Hmm 06:30 msikma Before I respond to that, let me make a second proposal. 06:31 mhz .oO(hmm, my only concern with licensing is that people do not use my contributions for commercial purposes unless they check with me first :) ) 06:31 Yagisan Kamion: I like the idea, but as msikma points out, code, images etc may need a different license 06:31 mako Kamion: i'm still a little worried about going down that path because i think we're going to get a sort of highest common denominotor any any given article 06:31 Kamion mhz: that's kind of highly dubious for us since Canonical is a commercial concern 06:32 Kamion mhz: I think it's a little unreasonable to say that Canonical can't use wiki.ubuntu.com 06:32 mhz yeah, but we all get 'profit' from it :D 06:32 Kamion it's still commercial 06:32 mako Kamion: if one person makes a series of simple changes to many articles and puts them under a more restrictive license, the PD thing becomes moot 06:32 msikma PROPOSAL: amend WikiLicensing to mention how all wikicode is released into the PD, which means that images are excluded (and targets of links posted in the wikicode, of course), and that this is not so in case another license is mentioned for specific pieces of content (such as code snippets and images). 06:32 msikma Of course, it should not be possible to license a normal wiki contribution into one of the non-PD licenses. 06:32 mako Kamion: but if we go that route, i'm happy to help propose a set of licenses that i'm more happy with 06:32 msikma It should be an exception only for code snippets and images, since those are usually already licensed. 06:33 Kamion msikma: there are people who find PD for their text equally unacceptable 06:33 Kamion e.g. Yagisan 06:33 Kamion (we've had other objections too) 06:33 msikma But then you'll have a potpourri of licenses that aren't compatible. 06:33 Kamion well, that's what we have now ... 06:33 msikma I believe that this exception should only and exclusively go for works that are already licensed. 06:34 msikma Your wikicontributions will be PD, but a GPL code that someone has written can only remain GPL. 06:34 msikma That's what I believe will cause the least confusion. 06:34 Kamion I think we'll have a number of valuable contributors say "well, screw you then" 06:34 msikma If some people disagree with the PD, then this should be brought up in a separate discussion. 06:34 Yagisan msikma: well then thanks for unilaterally relicensing my work 06:35 msikma Yagisan: I'd be fine with GFDL as well. I'd also be fine with licensing everything "after June 1" or something similar. 06:35 Yagisan msikma: there is a happy compromise. trhat is choice 06:35 mhz what if people NOT happy with current results of licensing have the chance to wipe out his contribs. from wiki? 06:35 msikma This isn't the license that I'm discussing, but rather the legal confusion that might arise. 06:35 Kamion msikma: many people who write a lot of documentation don't recognise that their work should be treated differently from code 06:36 msikma Kamion: again, I'd be fine with GFDL. 06:36 msikma I don't care about which free license is used. 06:36 ompaul Let us be very clear, PD means that if someone alters something then they can claim ownership and restrict access to that version. That means that someone could come to the page remove lots of the text there declare it immutable then where are you. 06:36 msikma I only care about the fact that there might be legal confusion if we try to license everything on the wiki. 06:36 msikma ompaul: that's not what this discussion is about. I understand the concerns, but let's address them in a separate discussion. 06:37 Yagisan msikma: the wiki was already licensed. It was a CC-BY-SA 06:37 msikma Then let's keep it that way. === Yagisan has the edubuntu wiki in mind 06:37 msikma But I doubt that it's a good idea to relicense everything under that license that's posted on the wiki. 06:37 msikma Especially for artwork discussions. 06:38 jenda It's not legally possible to relicense everything. 06:38 Yagisan msikma: as you say, some things like code, and images may need different licenses 06:38 mako msikma: i'd like to see a strong argument for artwork on the wiki being treated differently === pygi [n=pygi@83-131-227-219.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:38 Mithrandir let content dragged in from elsewhere (and with a source reference) to have a diverging licence, then? 06:38 mako msikma: not here 06:38 mako msikma: or now, but in writing 06:38 mako msikma: if one exists, please point me to it 06:38 msikma jenda: you can say that everything after a certain date is licensed differently, if that license is compatible with the old one. 06:38 mako msikma: otherwise, point me to it when it does 06:39 msikma mako: thing is, some people license their artwork under a license incompatible with BY-SA. Such as BY-SA-NC. You cannot relicense such works, even though the license notifier would imply such a thing if you were to post the image. 06:39 msikma The concern is the same with, for example, GFDL content or GPL code. 06:40 msikma I really wish that I could stay around longer, but my work stopped over half an hour ago and we're closing down the studio. 06:40 msikma I'm glad that I could voice my concerns and I hope that they'll be considered. 06:41 msikma I personally am fine with contributing under any free license. 06:41 jenda Exactly - but that would be solved by saying that all is licenced under license X unless stated otherwise. 06:41 msikma All I want is to avoid legal difficulties or confusion. 06:41 elmo umm, JOOI, how much GPL code do we have in the ubuntu wiki that isn't covered by fairuse? 06:41 msikma jenda: yes, but it would also need to be easy to mention a different license. 06:41 elmo I can understand the image/attachment concern, but embedding GPL code seems like a fairly, err, esoteric use case 06:41 jenda elmo: fairuse doesn't allow you to claim a different license 06:42 mako jenda: i don' think that is what he meant 06:42 msikma I'll talk to you later. Thanks for listening, and bye. 06:42 elmo jenda: fair use, in this context, means it's small enough to not be covered by the GPL 06:42 Yagisan elmo: what about embedding scripts ? 06:44 jenda Yes, but posting it in a wiki (which claims all content is PD or other) is violating the GPL, albeit on a tiny level. Anyway, I did'nt want to press the issue further. I think it would be solved if posters simply mentioned that the following snippet is GPL and the wiki only claimed PD 'when not otherwise'. 06:44 Yagisan I'm not sure if all counties have the same idea if fairuse either 06:45 mako alright 06:45 mako this discussion seems to have lost steam 06:45 jsgotangco Yagisan: i agree === McNutella [n=ooboonto@cpc3-bahd2-0-0-cust749.renf.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:46 Kamion jenda: no matter what, I think "if not otherwise stated" is a sane approach 06:46 jenda I agree. 06:47 Yagisan I'm concerned. Is the mass-relicense to still go ahead ? 06:47 jenda And a reminder somewhere to mention external licences. 06:48 mako so, what's the protocal/plan for moving forward? 06:48 Kamion Yagisan: AIUI some mass change will still go ahead, but not steamrollering those who object (i.e. objections will be taken into account in some form, whether it be by choosing a different approach to mass-relicensing, or by creating individual exceptions, or by letting people create their own individual exceptions for bits of content) 06:49 mhz Kamion: +1 ! === McNutella [n=ooboonto@cpc3-bahd2-0-0-cust749.renf.cable.ntl.com] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["OOT"] === j_ack [n=nico@p508D959F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:52 thierryn ok, so is it all the arguments for this point? === Yagisan is happy with the ability to select an appropriate "free" license(s) depending on content. I understand canaonical may wish to use any documentation I've contributed, the existing license should allow that. === mhz is happy for Yagisan 06:53 mhz :) 06:53 jenda It seems everyone is happy, except for the Ubuntu IRC team... 06:54 mhz LOL 06:54 mako alright 06:54 mako lets move on 06:54 thierryn k 06:54 mako so 06:54 mako a number of IRC ops want a list to coordinate IRC related matters 06:55 jenda ping Seveas ompaul 06:55 ompaul that is correct 06:55 mako would it be open? 06:55 Seveas yes 06:55 gnomefreak yep 06:55 ompaul it has to be 06:55 mako well, it doesn't *have* to be 06:55 mako i mean, i think it should be :) 06:55 Seveas it would be for things-to-discuss-in-non-realtime 06:55 ompaul mako, point 06:55 mako open to posting and to subscription? 06:56 Seveas I'd prefer that 06:56 eyequeue (and archives?) 06:56 Seveas completely open, like any other community list 06:57 gnomefreak only thing about open is spamming how do we prevent it? 06:57 Kamion (sorry, I was away; we'll talk to mdke about the output of the previous discussion and try to get something concrete organised) 06:57 Seveas gnomefreak, subscription required 06:57 Kamion gnomefreak: same as any other ubuntu lists 06:57 gnomefreak ok 06:57 mako Kamion: yes, that sounds right 06:58 Kamion I've got no problem with an ubuntu-irc list; elmo? 06:59 Kamion d'oh, elmo just walked out of the office 06:59 Seveas heh 07:00 elmo what's the policy on it? === silbs [n=jane@217.205.109.249] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:00 elmo open subscription, open archives, etc.? 07:00 Seveas elmo, as open as possible 07:00 elmo ok, then no problem 07:01 mako that sounds fine then 07:01 eyequeue can anyone raise reason for objections? and is this for all #ubuntu-* channels on freenode? (scope) 07:01 Seveas eyequeue, twice yes 07:02 eyequeue i have no objections :) was wondering if others could think of any :) 07:03 elmo ok, next? 07:04 Seveas pschulz01 is next 07:04 Seveas (member candidate) === pschulz01 is here 07:04 Seveas pschulz01, your 3-liner please 07:04 pschulz01 Please refer to my Wikipage, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PaulSchulz 07:04 pschulz01 but in summary. 07:04 pschulz01 Ubuntu Highlights: Handing out CD's at conference (sponsored by Linux 07:04 pschulz01 Australia). Bug submissions to Dapper. Various Wikipages addition's edits. 07:04 pschulz01 Working towards Ubuntu community tools/resourses for Australians. 07:04 pschulz01 Linux Highlights: Involvement in LCA2004 (organiser). Small (trivial) 07:04 pschulz01 patch accepted into Linux kernel. 07:05 pschulz01 (Is that what you're after?) 07:05 Seveas sort of 07:06 Seveas reading wikipage now 07:07 Kamion heh, about half of the VmWare page just became obsolete 07:07 elmo any other .au team guys around/awake? === pschulz01 pokes #ubuntu-au 07:07 shenki hello :) 07:08 elmo shenki: can you bouche for pschulz? 07:09 elmo vouch too 07:09 shenki vouch? yes 07:09 shenki he's been getting in touch wiht the education department in the state where we live in, with intentions of getting ed(ubuntu) in local schools here 07:09 elmo pschulz01: how long have you been involved in Ubuntu? 07:10 pschulz01 Since breezy.. 07:10 pschulz01 distributing, and promoting locally. 07:11 mako there's not a lot of documentation on the wiki === Kamping_Kaiser [n=kgoetz@ppp100-144.static.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:11 mako which, if your contributions are mostly working with the loco teams, makes sense 07:11 pschulz01 Spoke with Smurf about starting a Loco when he was in Canberra in 2005 for LCA. 07:12 pschulz01 It has only recently taken off. 07:12 Kamping_Kaiser i got asked to come and vouch, sorry i missed the first half 07:12 jsgotangco its good the see team AU awake at this time! 07:12 Seveas @now adelaid 07:12 Seveas @now adelaide 07:12 Ubugtu Current time in Australia/Adelaide: May 31 2006, 02:42:49 - Current meeting: Community Council 07:12 shenki oh? i thought we were boucheing... making the notch cut in the top (dexter) corner of a shield, to rest the lance when jousting 07:13 pschulz01 I put together soem CD artwork for TheOpenCD 3.0.. which was used to distribute locally. 07:14 mako pschulz01: in terms of direct contribution to ubuntu, you only have 3 wiki pages on the wiki 07:14 mako and not a lot of visible activity on LP === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:15 mako if your contributions are primarily through the loco, it would be good to have more people from the loco here to vouch for the work that you've been doing 07:15 mako they can be in writing, on the page === jenda mutters about 2 o'clock in the morning 07:15 mako maybe you can do that in the next couple weeks? 07:15 Kamping_Kaiser mako, its between 3.15 and 1am here 07:15 Kamping_Kaiser (depending on state) 07:15 mako Kamping_Kaiser: right, that's why i'm suggesting waiting until next meeting 07:15 Yagisan it's actually 3:30am here 07:16 mako next meeting will be earlier 07:16 pschulz01 Happy to wait... 07:16 shenki mako, as someone who would be intrested in membership myself, what are you looking for? the wiki mentions 'contributions to the community', in what ways are you looking for? 07:16 mako shenki: wiki pages are fine, but i'd like to see more than three of them 07:17 mako shenki: high karma and a bunch of visible contributions to the bts work 07:17 mako lots of participation on mailing lists 07:17 mako patches, maintained packages 07:17 mako testimonials from events planned and executed 07:17 mako etc etc 07:17 shenki okay. do ubunutforums.com count? 07:17 mako shenki: yes 07:17 mako definitely 07:17 shenki cheers 07:17 Kamping_Kaiser mako, so 'easily trackable' community stuff? 07:17 mako Kamping_Kaiser: if you can make the not easily trackable stuff also visible, that's fine too 07:18 mako we don't require easily trackable things 07:18 mako we just require documentation 07:18 jenda (but "I pray for Ubuntu every night" not good enough?) 07:18 Kamping_Kaiser ok. thats fair. === shenki notes to take photos of beer drinking at launch party thurs 07:18 mako jenda: that's right 07:18 Yagisan mako: (after meeting if more appropriate) what about ubuntu based research projects ? eg sec work 07:19 mako Yagisan: that's fine, as long as its visible and directly benefits the community 07:19 mako and constitutes work on ubuntu 07:19 Yagisan mako: yeah. been working on it since UDU 07:20 mako alright 07:20 mako we should move on 07:20 mako unless pschulz01 or the other CC members object 07:20 pschulz01 Please see top of my Wiki page for addition Wikipages that I have been working on.. 07:20 pschulz01 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PaulSchulz 07:20 mako pschulz01: it's not a rejection, but i'd personally feel more comfortable with a little more documentation and testimonials === seb128 [n=seb128@ubuntu/member/seb128] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:20 mako pschulz01: i'm looking at that page 07:21 pschulz01 In particuler: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PaulSchulz/ConnectingUp06 === mako nods 07:22 mako that's great :) === pschulz01 leaves membership in the hands of the CC. 07:24 mhz well, gotta go. Sorry. Bye all! Good luck to those 'waiting-to-become-approved' === mhz [n=mhz@moinmoin/fan/mhz] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] 07:25 thierryn any other points for pschulz01? === wold [n=wold@ev-217-129-81-225.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:26 shenki just a point i'd like to make: he's one of the people un ubuntu-au taking lead 07:27 shenki for example, in the 'meeting' tonight, it was mostly school age kids - nothing wrong with that - but it degraded into a chat about what tv tuner cards people used 07:27 mako listen, i don't doubt that 07:27 shenki he's one of the more ...responsible (the right words dont come to mind at 3am:) ones 07:27 mako but that is exactly what we should have a set of testimonials saying 07:28 mako shenki: i'm glad you're here and it helps 07:28 shenki ok 07:28 mako shenki: but i'd like to see that from a few more people in the community 07:28 mako and especially from existing members 07:28 shenki yeah, i guess that's an issue... the ubunut-au 'comminuty' seems to be a majority the work of paul, after the inital excitement died down (unubut-au is only a few months old) 07:29 pschulz01 I did send an email to jdub... 07:29 shenki but yeah, just thought those points needed to be made. see you at the next meeting :) 07:29 mako pschulz01: ok.. lets see if we can poke him 07:29 mako pschulz01: that would be very helpful 07:29 mako you can talk to me during the next couple weeks 07:29 pschulz01 Ok. 07:30 mako we've already had the conversation so it should be simple once we build up a little more documentation 07:30 mako alright 07:30 pschulz01 Thank you everyone for listening. 07:30 thierryn next pointt? 07:31 mako lets move on 07:31 Seveas next point is you thierryn 07:31 thierryn k 07:32 thierryn you can take a look at my wiki page : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThierryMoisan 07:32 mako we should try to pick up the pace 07:32 mako i need to leave soon 07:32 thierryn in general, I've been working with linux since around 2001. 07:32 Seveas how long have you been working on Ubuntu? 07:32 thierryn I'm using ubuntu since warty 07:33 Kamion any comments from MOTU/desktop folks on thierryn? 07:33 seb128 he's around for some time and has some good willing 07:33 thierryn by working you mean helping with bugs?... I think around 1 year or more 07:33 seb128 I've review mostly small patches like desktop files fixing 07:34 thierryn I'm not a very experienced programmer so I try to fix simple bugs so that advanced programmers can work on important stuff 07:34 thierryn I'm also french-canadian so I'm sometime work on the french traduction === Seveas has to leave, by all 07:34 thierryn I sometimes* 07:34 Seveas by* 07:35 Seveas bye* (damn, something's stuck under the keyboard) 07:35 thierryn anything else you want to know? 07:36 thierryn I also packaged libfxscintilla for dapper 07:36 mako great 07:37 mako any other testimonials for thierryn 07:37 mako ? 07:38 thierryn make : well I don't really have anyone on the french team... 07:38 thierryn mako : there was siretart who had advocated my package but he couldn't be there today 07:40 thierryn mako : I'm poking LaserJock to come... === mneptok [i=mneptok@mneptok.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bddebian [n=bdefrees@mail.ottens.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:42 thierryn LaserJock : hi 07:42 LaserJock hi thierryn 07:42 bddebian Awfully quiet in here for a meeting. :-) 07:42 thierryn LaserJock : if you could say some words about me I would be grateful 07:42 LaserJock now? 07:42 thierryn yeah 07:43 thierryn mako is waiting to get testimonials about me and my work for ubuntu 07:43 LaserJock ok === Gloubiboulga [n=gauvain@ubuntu/member/gloubiboulga] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:43 LaserJock I've known thierryn for quite some time now 07:44 bddebian Are you SURE mako is here? :-) 07:44 jenda yes ;) 07:44 LaserJock he has helped out around -motu and has done quite a bit of work on the .desktop charge 07:45 mako yes, i'm here 07:45 LaserJock he seems to have a slow and steady approach to Ubuntu and I think he has been a pretty solid contributor to Universe === teolemon [n=famille@car75-5-82-234-128-149.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:46 mako alright 07:46 bddebian I have seen some of Thierry's desktop work as well 07:46 mako there's a decent amount of contributions over a long period of time 07:46 mako i'm happy with membership 07:46 mako elmo, Kamion: ? 07:47 Kamion yep, fine by me (sorry for inactivity, I'm busy with release testing here) 07:47 mako i need to run === eyequeue is here ... what now? 07:48 thierryn mako, kamion : thanks :D === Lurker [n=Rob@wnpgmb09dc1-74-82.dynamic.mts.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:48 Kamion eyequeue missed out last time too, I think === teolemon [n=famille@car75-5-82-234-128-149.fbx.proxad.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] 07:48 eyequeue Kamion, indeed 07:49 mako eyequeue: i've looked at your page 07:49 Kamion aha, but we can get sabdfl in 07:49 eyequeue mako, thanks 07:49 mako eyequeue: i see 3 bugs reported and not a lot of other things === sabdfl [n=mark@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:50 mako your link to the forum didn't work 07:50 sabdfl hi all 07:50 elmo (thierryn is fine by me too) 07:50 Kamion thierryn: could you visit https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntumembers/+join pleasse? 07:50 eyequeue mako, those links there doesn't whow what they did when written? :( 07:50 Kamion please 07:50 bddebian Hello sabdfl 07:50 mako eyequeue: also, it seems a little irregular to have your real name set to Eye Queue on your key 07:50 eyequeue well, here's the 3line, though not sure how it helps 07:50 eyequeue Evangelical installs, Varied generalized support since January 2005 (irc/forums/wiki/telephone/offline), bug reports, overall attempts to honour Code of Conduct (even apart from Ubuntu-related matters) health permitting 07:50 sabdfl i'm tag-teaming mako, apparently :-) 07:50 mako unless that is, in fact, your legal name 07:51 mako sabdfl: yes, someone is delivering books cases to my home in half an hour, i should probalby be there 07:51 eyequeue mako, at this point in my life, i'm too vulnerable to former stalkers, can't open that up publically (though open to suggestions) 07:52 mako well, that's an interesting question 07:52 eyequeue mako, so basically i should just give up them? i'm not a coder/artist/writer, i'm mostly bed-bound these days, so not sure how to document much 07:52 mako eyequeue: that's fine.. there are lots of ways to contribute 07:53 mako none of us here see very much of each other :) 07:53 eyequeue mostly it's been "hand-holding" if you know the term 07:53 mako that's fine, but we still documentation of that 07:53 mako through testimonials, etc 07:53 mako but i really need to run 07:53 thierryn Kamion : k, I went to the ubuntumembers join web page now I'm waiting approval 07:53 sabdfl eyequeue: the criteria for membership are deliberately defined in very broad terms to encourage varied kinds of contribution and participation 07:54 mako i'll leave this to sabdfl, Kamion, and elmo and trust them to make any decision 07:54 mako see you all! 07:54 bddebian Later mako 07:54 sabdfl eyequeue: we're pretty open to stories of how that contribution has been made, it just needs to be sustained and substantial 07:54 eyequeue i don't have any testimonials,. unless i start asking $ubuntu, which i've never seen there so would be weird i think 07:54 ompaul good luck mako 07:54 sabdfl cheers mako, see you in Paris 07:54 gnomefreak bye mako good luck 07:55 sabdfl eyequeue: in that case perhaps the best plan is to keep doing what you are doing, but keep a record of bits you contribute on your wiki page 07:55 sabdfl over time, that will turn into a sort of testimonial 07:55 eyequeue sabdfl, "helped foo today; helped bar today"? 07:55 sabdfl and in five to eight weeks, knock here again 07:55 jenda eyequeue: IRC logs, more like... 07:56 sabdfl sure, especially if you do so in public forums and can point to logs or co-contributors 07:56 eyequeue lol, i don't have the 8 weeks, but thanks 07:56 sabdfl eyequeue: it's not a race, ubuntu will be here forever, we hope ;-) 07:56 gnomefreak eyequeue: im always around if you need help with anything 07:57 eyequeue thanks for the offer gnomefreak 07:57 gnomefreak yw 07:57 eyequeue sabdfl, i hope it will too, and here's my chance for a public thank you for all you've done :) 07:57 sabdfl you are most welcome - thanks for your energy and contribution so far 08:00 sabdfl what's next? === jeang [n=jeang@dsl-145-16-77.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 08:01 eyequeue i think that's the end of the meeting (per agenda at least) === Lurker [n=Rob@wnpgmb09dc1-74-82.dynamic.mts.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === pschulz01 [n=paul@150.101.6.36] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] 08:02 gnomefreak i think most of the CC is tied up with release testing 08:02 sabdfl ok thanks all 08:03 sabdfl hold firm - release shortly
MeetingLogs/CC_2006-05-30 (last edited 2008-08-06 16:18:39 by localhost)