10:00 Ubugtu         Current time in Etc/UTC: July 11 2006, 20:00:08 - Current meeting: Community Council in 0 minute
   10:00 Seveas         Kamion, ping
   === elmo [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:00 Seveas         hi elmo
   10:01 elmo           hi
   10:03 nixternal      JoeyStanford how is everything?
   10:03 Kamion         yeah, I'm here
   10:03 JoeyStanford   Hi Nix!  Good thanks
   10:03 JoeyStanford   I figured I'd uncloak for the meeting :-)
   10:03 Seveas         Kamion, will we see sabdfl or mako too?
   10:04 Kamion         sabdfl is on holiday
   10:04 elmo           mako said he'd make it
   === mako [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:05 Seveas         hi mako
   10:05 mako           greetings
   10:06 elmo           ok, we've got quorum, shall we get started?
   10:06 Seveas         mdz, are you around?
   10:07 Sp4rKy         i'm back
   10:07 Seveas         wb
   10:08 elmo           seveas: "Two Ubuntu members have also become Freenode staff" - who are they?
   10:08 Seveas         elmo, rob and nalioth
   10:08 Seveas         actually, there are 3 now: hedgemage too
   10:08 elmo           ok
   10:08 mdz            Seveas: I am; am I needed?
   10:09 Seveas         mdz, you've put the first item on the agenda
   === mako is getting up to speed.. i'm coming straight out of another irc meeting
   10:09 mdz            I put that on the agenda before the previous meeting, after talking with mako
   10:09 mdz            I assumed it had already been discussed since comments were added to the wiki
   10:09 Seveas         at the previous meeting it was moved to this one
   === cbx33 [n=pete@ubuntu/member/cbx33] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:10 mdz            as you pointed out, this is a rather old proposal
   10:10 mdz            but I think the issues it raises are still valid
   10:10 mdz            mako was in agreement when we spoke about it
   === mako nods
   10:11 mako           i'm reading the things posted to the spec
   10:11 mdz            I acknowledge that some members of the community are working well with the FreeNode staff
   10:11 mdz            but I think that's equally possible elsewhere
   === j_baer__ [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:12 mdz            essentially all of the non-Ubuntu project channels I follow have moved to OFTC
   10:12 mako           that's been true for me as well
   10:12 Seveas         and why should we follow?
   10:13 mako           there are a series of reasons on and alluded to on the specification
   10:13 elmo           Seveas: I regularly see the must register to send messages damage hurt users, f.e.
   10:13 Seveas         elmo, that is a measure against spam
   10:13 Sp4rKy         please, when does the CC start  ?
   10:13 mako           Sp4rKy: it's going on now
   10:13 Seveas         Sp4rKy, 13 minutes ago
   10:14 gnomefreak     Sp4rKy: started
   10:14 sharms2        I would say from a users point of view it's very hard to find a irc admin to get help from
   10:14 gnomefreak     who has this spec page handy?
   10:14 elmo           Seveas: I know what it is, but it regularly bites new users trying to contact others
   10:14 mako           Seveas: that's fine, but it seems to be handled different and less inconveniently for users on other networks, including OFTC
   10:14 Seveas         "Freenode is technically and politically erratic" is a bunch of FUD instead of concrete arguments
   === andyp [n=andydpar@] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:14 jenda          Does OFTC require registration to send messages? (Sorry for ignorance)?
   10:14 elmo           jenda: no
   10:14 Seveas         mako, there's a big difference in size between oftc and freenode
   10:14 jenda          thx
   10:14 mdz            gnomefreak: it's on the agenda
   10:14 Seveas         freenode is much larger and thus a more attractive target
   10:14 elmo           Seveas: OFTC recently took on Debian - they can handle us
   10:15 gnomefreak     mdz: ty
   10:15 mako           Seveas: nobody disagreeing with that, but that is something that we can take advantage of as well
   10:15 mdz            gnomefreak:
   10:15 gnomefreak     ty
   10:15 sivang         I'm also bitten by this, everytime my client disconnects and reconnects, and I send PMs to folks not even noticing they don't receive it.
   10:15 Sp4rKy         mako, Seveas gnomefreak k, so what should i do when i'm added to Member candidates for consideration
   10:15 Seveas         Sp4rKy, just wait.
   10:15 Kamion         Sp4rKy: wait until the proper point in the meeting
   10:15 gnomefreak     Sp4rKy: wait till Seveas calls you
   10:15 Sp4rKy         k
   10:15 Sp4rKy         thx
   10:15 mdz            I'm happy with how Debian has turned out on  OFTC
   10:15 elmo           bye
   === dinda [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:16 Seveas         I'm happy with how Ubuntu turned out on Freenode
   10:16 Seveas         It's settled and working very nice
   10:16 elmo           Debian's OFTC migration even provides us with a working example of how to do it
   10:16 Seveas         moving would disrupt that a lot
   === nixternal agrees with Seveas as there seems to be a lot of people settled in
   10:17 gnomefreak     maybe just me but i have seen alot of people from OTFC spamming in #ubuntu for the last few weeks  is this something we have to look foward to if we move?
   10:17 elmo           Seveas: that's your opinion, and it's great, but you're blithely ignoring problems like the must register stuff which are real problems and I see effect different people every week
   10:17 jenda          I'll second that. Imagine the confusion of moving the thousands of people.
   10:17 mdz            gnomefreak: "people from OFTC"?
   10:17 elmo           jenda: it's not  hard, as I said, Debian did it
   10:17 Kamion         gnomefreak: could you elaborate on that statement please?
   10:17 mdz            jenda: Debian moved more people than we did
   10:17 Seveas         elmo, I'm not ignoring that, I'm just seeing that differently
   10:17 jenda          Freenode doesn't require registration - #ubuntu does.
   10:17 jenda          OK
   10:17 Seveas         jenda, no, freenode does - for pm's
   10:18 mako           Seveas: at the conference we had people unable to connect for msot of hte first day
   10:18 sivang         we could also provide shipped IRC clients with config for OFTC for that matter
   10:18 mako           Seveas: eventually, i got ahold of lilo and eventually he was able to fix it
   === JoeyStanford notices that OFTC appears to be more community oriented and might fit better simply on that basis with Ubuntu than Freenode. Noting of course he has not experienced any problems with Freenode.
   10:18 nixternal      which i like the registration, as it stops people from ghosting nicknames as well
   === jenda mumbles about +6
   10:18 mdz            Seveas: that happens pretty much every time we have a conference
   === sryan [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:18 erdalronahi    shipped IRC clients are a good idea
   10:18 mako           nixternal: there are registered nicks on oftc as well
   10:18 Seveas         mako, why do you think limiting connections is a bad idea?
   10:18 Kamion         yeah, it's been happening since Oxford in mid-2004
   10:18 nixternal      mako: thank you for the clarification... ;)
   10:18 mako           Seveas: it's not that i think it's a bad idea
   10:18 Seveas         mdz, for paris that was handled because someone (me) actually poked freenode staff in time
   10:19 mako           Seveas: but when we have to spend half a day being blocked as a result, it's a major inconveience
   10:19 gnomefreak     mdz: yes there have beena  few bot bombs (i guess is what the name for them is) is has OFTC before it shows the user name and in purple comming in the channel and just saying things like f ubuntu bleh bleh bleh
   === Amaranth [n=amaranth@ubuntu/member/amaranth] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:19 elmo           Seveas: and for all your claims of close ties, it still takes at least half a day to sort out ... each time...
   10:19 Kamion         gnomefreak: your inference that it's "people from OFTC" seems weak at best
   10:19 mdz            gnomefreak: I don't think you can take that as an indication that those people represent OFTC
   10:19 Seveas         elmo, for paris it took 5 minutes.
   10:19 Amaranth       this wasn't on the calendar :/
   10:20 Seveas         for other conferences: no one took the trouble to poke freenode staff
   10:20 mako           Seveas: it took 6 hours from the time i first messaged the only staff member online
   10:20 Seveas         IN TIME
   10:20 elmo           Seveas: dude.  your reality does not match our reality
   10:20 mako           Seveas: there were apparently some technical problem that kept the fix from taking hold
   10:21 Seveas         elmo, my reality is that freenode works really well for #ubuntu and related channels and that none of the active community want to move
   === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:21 elmo           Seveas: sigh.  look, I'm talking about a very specific example.   you're claiming that freenode was working for UDSP "on time".  we were there.  it wasn't.
   === Admiral_proFTW [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:22 mdz            Seveas: I think some of the people participating in this meeting qualify as active community ;-)
   10:22 Seveas         mdz, I mean #ubuntu community
   10:22 Kamion         I think #ubuntu-devel matters too
   10:22 mako           oftc is run by a democratically elected board, they have a great track record for technical reliability and responsiveness, they have recently started hosting debian which is both similar in size and overlap.. they also seem to be a less annoying/confusing to new users in regards to msgs
   10:22 mdz            Seveas: I expect many of them neither know nor care which IRC network they use
   10:22 Kamion         I don't particularly want to turn this into a fight between #ubuntu and #ubuntu-devel though
   10:22 Seveas         elmo, it may have failed later (heard that from lilo), but he was working on that. It worked immediately after I asked him though
   10:23 nixternal      brief opinion if i may do so....if there are issues with freenode, why not take them up the staff and see if they can fix the issues to supply ubuntu with what it needs..just like a new user with ubuntu, we want to know their issues, instead of them just leaving for something else
   10:23 mako           freenode is not oppressively bad.. but i think there's a fair use that oftc might be a better match
   10:23 nixternal      and if it doesn't get fixed/resolved, then look at moving elsewhere (oftc) if warranted?
   10:23 mako           mdz: except perhaps, when their private msgs don't work :)
   === nixternal is keeping an open mind, as it does't matter where i hang out, as long as it is Ubuntu!!! ;)
   10:24 sivang         mako: is there some protection against someone else taking your nick ? do they support any sort of registration ?
   10:24 mako           sivang: of course
   10:24 elmo           sivang: yes, they have services
   10:24 mdz            sivang: it works exactly the same way
   10:24 mako           sivang: it would be indistinguishable
   10:24 sivang         mdz, elmo, mako : I'm sold :-)
   10:25 Seveas         mako, freenode is increasingly good to us. In case of channel problems we have close ties to active staff. For OFTC that may eventually work too, but don't fix if it ain't broken
   10:25 JoeyStanford   Are there any assurances that OFTC will be around for the long haul?
   10:25 Seveas         JoeyStanford, yes
   10:25 mako           Seveas: you also need to recognize that there is now a history of strange behavior in relation to canonical channels by the (undemocratically elected) freenode staff
   10:25 Seveas         mako, I do, but #canonical != #ubuntu
   10:25 mdz            mako: that's not a CC issue though
   10:26 Amaranth       debian had it easy, they have
   10:26 mako           a history of erratic behavior by the people running the network is something working keeping in mind
   10:27 Seveas         mako, lilo will in the short term be much less visible on the network if you're concerned about that
   10:27 Kamion         Amaranth: (that's something we can and should introduce)
   10:27 mako           i really don't have a grudge against lilo.. he's been very helpful to me every time i've talked to him
   10:27 gnomefreak     i like that idea alot
   10:27 mdz            Amaranth: and we have
   10:27 Amaranth       Kamion: But by default people have been getting connected to "", no?
   === uniq [n=frode@ubuntu/member/frode] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:27 mdz            Amaranth: by default (at least in xchat) they use "Ubuntu Servers"
   10:28 JoeyStanford   FWIW: We always state that "Debian is the rock that Ubuntu is built on."  If the Debian community found OFTC good enough to move, OFTC operates in a similar manner as Ubuntu does, and many other groups have already migrated, it would seem to me that there is sufficient justifcation for us to move as well.
   10:28 LaserJock      mdz: which is, no?
   10:28 mdz            LaserJock: yes, but easily changed
   10:28 LaserJock      of course, just wondered
   10:28 mdz            it's separate from the FreeNode server profile
   10:29 LaserJock      right
   10:29 Amaranth       mdz: but warty, hoary, breezy, and dapper users are still connecting to
   10:29 Seveas         as they should be...
   10:29 Amaranth       mdz: so you'd have to manually tell them to move
   10:29 mdz            Amaranth: warty is EOL, and the others can be changed via -updates
   10:30 Amaranth       hmm, i thought that stuff got copied into ~/.xchat2/ if you changed something
   10:30 Kamion         it's also easy to put "channel has moved" notices up
   10:30 juantao_       pardon, might I speak?
   10:30 Kamion         as elmo said, Debian have been through all this
   10:30 Seveas         juantao_, sure
   10:30 juantao_       the meeting is 30 minutes old and my lunch break is half over, any chance we can move along to other items?
   10:30 Amaranth       Kamion: hehe, freenode will close the channel
   10:30 Seveas         juantao_, not before this is resolved
   10:30 Kamion         Amaranth: *shrug* lasts long enough
   10:30 juantao_       k
   === diaz [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:31 mdz            I don't think that concerns about the transition should be a consideration here; as stated, Debian made this transition without much trouble at all
   === mako nods
   10:31 Amaranth       ok, forget that part for now
   10:31 Kamion         it seems entirely political, not technical
   10:32 Seveas         mdz, apart from the /msg-needs-registration and lilo-annoyance, are there any reasons to move?
   10:32 Kamion         (as far as implementation goes)
   10:32 sharms2        lack of help from ops for regular users
   10:32 mako           Kamion: well, the problem we have now is political, the reasons to move are both
   10:32 mdz            Seveas: yes, another concrete reason already raised was the repeated problems we have at conferences
   10:32 Amaranth       sharms2: How does moving to another network fix that?
   10:32 Kamion         mako: right, I realised that after speaking and tried to clarify in the parenthesis
   10:32 elmo           Seveas: and the behaviour of staff in #canonical
   10:32 Seveas         mdz, and I already stated the solution to that too
   10:33 Seveas         elmo, #canonical != #ubuntu
   === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:33 Kamion         that doesn't stop it mattering
   10:33 elmo           Seveas: dude, seriously are you reading what people write?
   10:33 mdz            Seveas: you haven't acknowledged that the "solution" you proposed is exactly what we did in Paris, and it *didn't work*
   10:33 elmo           seveas: as mako already pointed out, it doesn't matter that #canonical != #ubuntu, it demonstrates a problem with how the staff behave, and how they behave affects _all_ channels including #ubuntu
   10:33 Amaranth       Interesting, I didn't know a private, password protected channel was allowed on freenode.
   10:33 mdz            it seriously disrupted the event (again)
   10:33 Seveas         mdz, due to technical problems as has been said - do you think OFTC will be problem free>
   10:34 Seveas         elmo, I've never seen staff misbehave in any ubuntu channel so far
   10:34 mdz            Seveas: no, but in my experience it has fewer problems
   10:34 mdz            mako's point about governance is also valid
   10:34 Seveas         mdz, that's just a matter of size...
   10:34 elmo           Seveas: ... so are you saying we're making it up, or do our experiences just not count or what?
   10:34 mako           Seveas: i've been on both networks simultaneously for 3 years now
   10:34 sryan          Why not move to EFnet? :)
   10:35 Seveas         mdz, that'll change - HedgeMage is working on getting people from projects on the board
   10:35 mako           Seveas: and my experience has been that things have been easier and more quickly fixed on oftc
   10:35 mdz            my experience is similar to mako's
   10:36 mdz            and additionally I'm tired of having to keep track of two networks ;-)
   10:36 Seveas         OFTC has also had less bot attacks and other annoying losers trying to keep staff over-busy
   10:36 jenda          mdz: BTW, the move would bring that burden upon many of us.
   10:36 Kamion         Amaranth: it is; but we've had problems with staff not respecting privacy
   10:36 mako           i have never attempted to move a project from OFTC to freenode
   10:36 mako           but i've seen a very steady stream of project move
   10:36 mako           culminating with debian recently
   10:36 Amaranth       mdz: I'm already in 3 networks, I really don't want a 4th.
   10:36 mako           it's basically only GNU projects and Ubuntu that are left here that i've involved with
   10:37 mako           Amaranth: i'm on 4, we learn to deal :)
   10:37 Seveas         mako: gentoo, php, django - to name a few that are here...
   10:37 Amaranth       everyone is on freenode ;)
   10:37 mdz            mako: is freenode a matter of GNU policy, or just status quo?
   10:37 mako           mdz: not sure
   10:37 elmo           Seveas: yeah, because we have so much cross pollination with gentoo, compared to, err, Debian
   10:38 mdz            yes, Debian alone is a pretty compelling reason
   10:38 Seveas         elmo, as a matter of fact #ubuntu and #debian don't have that much overlap
   10:38 Amaranth       #python is on freenode too, although i think they have it on oftc too
   10:38 elmo           Seveas: argh, dude, Ubuntu is not just #ubuntu
   10:38 mako           Seveas: you should look at the governance information for oftc
   10:38 mako           Seveas: it's pretty compelling
   10:38 mjg59          Seveas: Little overlap between user channels is hardly surprising
   10:38 Seveas         elmo, no, but moving would be the hardest for #ubuntu with 800+ users
   10:38 elmo           Seveas: #ubuntu-devel is just as important a part of Ubuntu
   10:38 mako           Seveas: their entire staff/board is democratically election and dispute resolution goes through a democratic channel
   === JoeyStanford wonders about hosted by OFTC
   10:38 sivang         mako: similar to the CC sort of
   10:39 elmo           Seveas: no.  it would not be.  that is a straw man.  as you've been told multiple times.  Debian migrated larger channels and it was painless
   10:39 jenda          JoeyStanford: that would probably be a forward, just like irc.debian,org
   10:39 mako           sivang: it's better than us! :)
   10:39 Seveas         elmo, at the time #debian moved. #ubuntu already was bigger
   10:39 mako           Seveas: more or less the the same
   10:40 Seveas         ~100 users
   10:40 mako           Seveas: in any case, nobody is suggesting doing this if OFTC couldn't handle it
   10:40 jenda          Is that really that important?
   10:40 Kamion         ~100 users> that would be 12% then, basically statistical noise at that point
   10:40 Kamion         if you can migrate a 700-user channel, you can migrate an 800-user channel
   10:40 sivang         mako: heh
   === nalioth [i=nalioth@freenode/staff/ubuntu.member.nalioth] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:41 Amaranth       If you're going to do it it has to be all at once for basically everything but #ubuntu.
   10:41 Amaranth       Otherwise it gets confusing.
   10:41 elmo           please, let's not discuss migration strategies
   10:41 sivang         maybe we can have some folks go to talk to them, tell them we're interested, lay out what we require and see if it can be provided before doing the move?
   10:41 Amaranth       elmo: There is nothing else to discuss.
   10:41 mako           you can also look at the
   10:41 mako           it's great :)
   10:41 elmo           Amaranth: of course there is.  whether we should or not
   10:41 nixternal      i know when i was an op for ETG years ago, one of my channels was on 2 networks, and we utilized a bot to combine them until everyone moved over..the bot would link the 2 channels on the same network..this may also limit the issues with a transfer
   10:42 Amaranth       elmo: It's the same argument back and forth though, perhaps it's time for a vote?
   10:42 Amaranth       nixternal: #python had one of those too for talking to oftc users
   10:42 elmo           let's not have a vote, but I would like to hear from anyone other than Seveas who is -1 on this
   10:42 elmo           (I'm not discounting Seveas, it's just his vote is pretty damn obvious at this stage)
   10:43 Amaranth       Well, I think it's a waste of time.
   10:43 Seveas         elmo, you've seen last week when there were many more others present
   10:43 DBO            I dont think we should move
   10:43 mako           that's right, i'm not at all comfortable voting on this
   10:43 elmo           DBO: why?
   10:43 Amaranth       Other than that, whatever you decide.
   10:43 Seveas         everybody but the CC (who didn't say much then) was against
   10:43 DBO            I deal with needy users every day in #ubuntu, I put in maybe 60 hours a week during the non-summer months, and they are confused enough
   10:43 mjg59          DBO: How are they getting to #ubuntu?
   10:43 nixternal      what about creating a poll for members/teams/users to vote also, as i think their opinions on something this great should be looked at
   10:44 mako           Seveas: that's not true, some people asked questions and few people offered a strong opniion either way
   10:44 sharms2        if forwards to oftc, how would that confuse anyone?
   10:44 Seveas         mako, that's not what I saw last week...
   10:44 DBO            mjg59, most of them automatic, lots are using irssi, or whatever when their x server is broke
   10:44 elmo           Seveas: sorry, but my recollection matches makos
   10:44 Amaranth       confusing users is still a migration issue
   === jenda = -1 on moving
   10:44 mjg59          DBO: Right. So if the default config is to hit, then changing will change nothing for them
   10:44 elmo           Seveas: but we can go over the logs later
   10:44 elmo           jenda: again, why?
   10:44 elmo           sorry, let me be clearer
   10:44 mako           Seveas: you can't ask me to come up with an opinion based on what *you* saw last week
   10:44 elmo           let's not have a vote, but I would like to hear from anyone other than Seveas who is -1 on this _and why_
   10:45 mako           Seveas: i've read what you've put on the wiki and acknowledge your points
   === JoeyStanford = +1 on the move
   10:45 mako           i also acknowledge Amaranth's point that the vast majority of people simply won't care
   10:45 Kamion         I would also like us to consider moving Ubuntu development channels even if the user channels don't move
   10:45 DBO            The move strikes me as a short term solution to a long term issue.  Anywhere we go there will be server issues, botter issues, DCC idiots
   10:45 Kamion         because, honestly, I don't think it matters much for most ordinary users whether the development channels are on the same network
   10:45 uniq           from reading on is looks very ubuntuish. democratic and nice.
   10:46 elmo           Kamion: good point
   10:46 jenda          If it ain't broken don't fix it approach: I don't think we should move only for political reasons, and the technical ones seem overlookable.
   10:46 nixternal      i am +1/-1 on it, 50/50, as i believe getting information from current users of freenode in the #ubuntu related channels, should be able to voice an opinion for something this large of an ordeal
   10:46 DBO            Kamion, I agree with that
   10:46 mako           we know how to a transition, i suspect we could do it painlessly, without confusing, and withough the vast vast number of users even noticing
   10:46 jenda          OTOH, I'm not that far from 'not caring' either: except I'm afraid we might lose some people, who won't want to move.
   === j_ack [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   10:46 nixternal      truthfully, no matter where the servers are for me, i am still going to help Ubuntu...however my experience here has been very good, as I have had no problems with anybody or anyone
   10:46 sivang         mako: we just need to make sure we have cloaks, which I kind'of got used to, but probably they have nice rules about that as well.
   10:46 mako           jenda: there is already a small group in #ubuntu on OFTC
   10:47 JoeyStanford   Nixternal: Same here
   10:47 mako           jenda: i suspect a small group would stay onf reenode if we moved
   10:47 mjg59          mako: It's likely that the channel would be closed
   10:47 nalioth        apologies for my tardiness, but is there a reason for moving?
   10:47 mako           mjg59: ah
   10:47 jenda          Most probably true.
   10:47 mjg59          mako: Though that doesn't seem to have happened to #debian, so
   10:47 mako           nalioth: there is a relatively long series of reasons, please read the log
   10:47 nealmcb        I tend to agree with nixternal also.
   10:48 mako           sivang: there are cloaks and we could insure we had them on oftc
   10:48 nixternal      i can tell you this though, no matter where Ubuntu goes, I think the idiots who cause trouble on IRC servers, script kiddies mostly, i think will follow us because of how popular we are, and that is an easy way for them to express their jealousy
   10:48 sharms2        Just because something is ok now, doesn't mean you shouldnt plan for the future.
   10:48 mako           Seveas: here's what i'm kind of worried about
   10:48 mako           this debate sort of simmered in debian for years
   10:48 Seveas         nixternal, most bot attacks target freenode because of its size, not ubuntu because of its popularity
   10:48 jenda          Another thing is... aren't cloaks a tidbit elitist?
   10:48 Kamion         nixternal: I reiterate my suggestion of moving development channels regardless; the numbers there are far less and the people involved are much easier to inform
   10:49 ompaul         jenda, they protect users from ddos
   === jenda does like his cloak, though :)
   10:49 elmo           ok, I don't think we're getting very far with this, can I make a suggestion:
   10:49 sivang         mako: cool, that's good.
   10:49 nixternal      and i understand that, but it will happen no matter which server is used..thats what i was tyring to get at
   10:49 mako           and it was clear to me that there was a lot of compatibilty between philosophy, decision-making, power, quick responses, overlap, etc. but nobody really wanted to rock the boat so thing really happened
   10:49 jenda          ompaul: I meant exclusive member cloaks.
   10:49 elmo           (1) we defer this to the next meeting, sabdfl is going to want to have a say in this, so we can't make any final decisions today anyway.  AND
   10:49 nealmcb        Kamion: moving just some channels complicates the treatment of
   10:49 mako           elmo: that's right
   10:49 elmo           (2) both sides draw up pages on the wiki with their view of pros and cons
   10:50 Kamion         nealmcb: that's true, but developers can cope
   10:50 ogra           elmo, +1
   10:50 elmo           (3) and someone add the kamion-alternative to the wiki as a suggested fall back
   10:50 jenda          agreed
   10:50 nixternal      great point Kamion, but like i said, i am neither yay or nay on it, i just would like to see a larger community voice on the situation then what is currently being with Ubuntu no matter where it's at ;)
   10:50 ompaul         elmo on that point  +1
   10:50 mdz            elmo: (2) has already been done, though I suppose they could be expanded a bit
   10:50 gnomefreak     elmo: +1
   10:50 mako           sounds good :)
   10:51 elmo           mdz: the pro-move side could really be better documented, but yeah
   10:51 nixternal      elmo: +1
   10:51 jenda          50 minutes :D
   10:51 Kamion         elmo: a LOT better documented
   10:51 jenda          +1
   10:51 mdz            mako: most of your ideas are missing from the page; could you add them?
   10:51 Kamion         from the position of somebody who mostly has trouble caring but who probably leans marginally towards pro-moving, it's pretty weak
   10:51 nixternal      my biggest concern is the newer users of irc...if you can get them to autoconnect wonderful!!!
   === gnomefreak is mainly concered with how stable are thier servers
   === jenda still doesn't see the reasons, so it would be great if they were on the wiki.
   10:51 elmo           I'll also try and add to the pro one, once mako is done, FWIW
   10:51 mako           mdz: yes!
   10:52 mdz            thanks
   10:52 mako           great
   10:52 Kamion         can we sort out and default clients and stuff ASAP no matter what?
   10:52 elmo           we should also document the migration stuff, etc.
   10:52 elmo           Kamion: domain exists, I've filed a bug in LP on all clients
   10:52 mako           Seveas: thanks for your input though, and for being patient
   10:52 Kamion         that can and should be done independently of the outcome of this
   10:52 Kamion         elmo: cool, thanks
   10:52 mako           Seveas: lets try to move forward constructively
   10:52 Seveas         mako, (and others): likewise
   10:52 elmo           ok.  so.  let's move on?
   10:52 Seveas         let's move on for now
   10:53 mako           great
   10:53 mako           new IRC ops
   10:53 mako           DBO, who we have already met briefly
   10:53 DBO            =)
   10:53 mako           and imbrandon
   10:53 mako           DBO: want to do a quick introduction?
   10:53 Seveas         next is less discussion: DBO is a very active #ubuntu helper and imbrandon is already op in #kubuntu - I would like them to reinforce the team
   10:53 gnomefreak     +1 on both of them
   10:53 mako           Seveas: how are you doing in terms of active staff?
   10:54 Seveas         gnomefreak, you don't vote -- the CC does
   10:54 gnomefreak     oops
   10:54 nixternal      lol
   10:54 mako           Seveas: is there an op list online somewhere?
   10:54 Seveas         mako, those two would be useful additions, some of the ops have become less active
   10:54 Seveas         mako, on the wiki
   10:54 Seveas
   10:54 mako           ah, that's what i was looking for
   10:54 mako           thanks
   === nixternal lets it be known that i am always online here, and is available if needed in the future
   10:55 mako           Seveas: well, we if you want to ask some folks on that list to retire, that might be good
   10:55 mako           but in any case
   10:56 Amaranth       oop, i don't have a wiki page anymore
   10:56 mako           does anyone have anything testimonials, positive or negative (can be private if absolutely necessary) about either DBO or imbrandon?
   10:56 ompaul         mako, I'll vouch for DBO as very good, and very useful
   === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   === mako nods ompaul
   10:56 DBO            I did ask Madpilot to come today, but he was otherwise detained
   10:57 nixternal      imbrandon is a good op, as we work together quite a bit
   === Seveas gives both his +1
   10:57 uniq           mako: imbrandon is very helpfull and a good operator in #kubuntu.
   10:57 Seveas         err.. s#+1#\o/#
   10:57 nixternal      +1 uniq
   10:57 Seveas         DBO is very helpful in #ubuntu and entertaining in -offtopic - both are useful things
   10:58 nalioth        DBO and imbrandon will make fine ops
   10:58 gnomefreak     agreed
   10:58 Seveas         but most important: both DBO and imbrandon have a good dose of common sense
   10:58 FunnyLookinHat I found DBO to be very helpful as well.  He is extremely patient and works well to help users understand rather than just telling them what to do.
   === jenda nudges about signing the CoC...?
   10:59 Amaranth       While we're on this topic, are any of the developers in that list ever actually in #ubuntu anymore?
   11:00 gnomefreak     Amaranth: i see a few ive never seen dont know who they are either
   11:00 mako           Amaranth: i think its fair to say that most of the people from the first round are not active there
   11:02 mako           and most of the core-devs are from that group
   11:02 mako           in any case
   11:02 mako           i'm happy with both imbrandon and DBO on those recommendations on a quick review of their recent activity
   11:02 mako           Kamion, elmo: ?
   11:03 LaserJock      crimsun is often i n #ubuntu isn't he?
   11:03 Seveas         yes
   11:03 ompaul         LaserJock, yes
   11:03 nalioth        crimsun is everywhere
   11:03 nixternal      crimsun is everywhere
   11:03 nixternal      lol
   11:03 mako           heh
   11:03 sivang         and he also fires Molecules at other ones :)
   11:03 gnomefreak     LaserJock: yes
   11:03 Kamion         doesn't seem to be any opposition to those ops, so I'm happy to take the recommendations of those here
   11:04 elmo           wow, #ubuntu logs do bag things to galeon
   11:04 gnomefreak     thom i never see and fooishbar
   11:04 Kamion         DBO: what's your launchpad id?
   11:04 Seveas         gnomefreak, they're not in chanservs access list - I'll update the wikipage
   11:04 gnomefreak     ok
   11:04 Kamion         Daniel's more or less inactive Ubuntu-wise; Thom has been around more lately but I doubt he cares about #ubuntu ops any more
   11:05 jenda          elmo: tail does bad things to #ubuntu logs ;)
   11:05 DBO            Kamion, my current id is jasonsmith5, but due to a technical glitch (foobar gpg) been having issues with the CoC signing.  I will however sign as soon as I can fix that (or grab antoher person for help)
   11:05 gnomefreak     also havent seen carlk in ages
   11:05 ompaul         Kamion, I'll walk him though it
   11:05 DBO            Kamion, scratch that, I mean Jassmith
   11:05 Seveas         gnomefreak, I've seen him recently
   11:05 gnomefreak     k
   11:05 elmo           anyway, both fine by me
   11:06 Kamion         DBO: ok, thanks
   11:06 Kamion         ok, we have a lot of locoteams to cover
   11:06 Seveas         -ChanServ- [DBO]  has been added to the access list for #ubuntu with level [10]
   11:06 Seveas         -ChanServ- [imbrandon]  has been added to the access list for #ubuntu with level [10]
   11:07 Kamion         are any of the locoteam representatives here? I realise it's been a long haul so far
   11:07 Seveas         -ChanServ- [DBO]  has been added to the access list for #ubuntu-offtopic with level [10]
   11:07 mako           yikes!
   === JoeyStanford is here
   === sharms2 is here
   === nixternal is here
   === nixternal is Chicago
   11:07 mako           JoeyStanford: please go ahead and introduce your team and its activities
   11:07 nealmcb        Three of us are here from Colorado
   11:07 JoeyStanford   Greetings.
   11:07 JoeyStanford   Thank you for allowing us a few minutes of your time today.  My name is Joey Stanford and I would like to
   11:07 JoeyStanford   introduce the Colorado Local Community Team. Our wiki entry is:  (note the
   11:07 JoeyStanford   photos!!).
   === JoeyStanford appologizes for the format. He's at a client in California
   11:07 erdalronahi    erdalronahi is from ubuntu-ku and also here
   11:08 JoeyStanford   The Colorado Local Community Team (aka CoLoCo) advocates the use of Open Source software and Ubuntu Linux in the State
   11:08 JoeyStanford   of Colorado. This is done through CD Distribution, Team expansion, user-base support, and outreach programs.
   11:08 JoeyStanford   The Colorado
   11:08 JoeyStanford   Local Community Team is not meant to replace our local LUGS but rather enhance their overall experience by having a
   11:08 JoeyStanford   dedicated place to discuss, contribute, and gain support from local Ubuntu users.
   11:08 JoeyStanford   I am the current Team Leader and Neal McBurnett (who is here today) is the Deputy Team Leader.
   11:08 mako           if they have already, having something typed and up and prepared for pasting will make you friends :)
   === mako nods to nealmcb
   11:08 JoeyStanford   What We Do: 1) Educate the public about Ubuntu, 2) Supply Ubuntu (CDs & CD images), 3) Support Ubuntu Locally, 4)
   11:08 JoeyStanford   Conduct outreach programs via local schools
   11:08 JoeyStanford   Our membership, at last count, numbers 35 people although I must admit we
   11:08 JoeyStanford   have not yet been able to get all of them to register on launchpad or our mailing list.
   11:09 JoeyStanford   As part of our support program we have been actively participating in local LUG lists.
   11:09 JoeyStanford   We have IT professionals,
   11:09 JoeyStanford   hobbyists, teachers, and students in our ranks.
   11:09 JoeyStanford   In 2006 we are planning (and executing) to leverage the educational
   11:09 JoeyStanford   professionals to provide a level of outreach into our schools.
   11:09 JoeyStanford  
   11:09 JoeyStanford   One of our members, Paul Casey, has done a fantastic job at a local university.  He has converted the entire computer
   11:09 JoeyStanford   lab and to a large extent, the entire computer program, over to Ubuntu. Ubuntu is on every lab machine. Almost all
   11:09 JoeyStanford   courses are taught using Ubuntu including graphics design, publishing, programming, and basic computer skills.
   11:09 JoeyStanford  
   11:09 JoeyStanford   We've had some interesting events since we started. Our Dapper Release party was a great success and we signed up a few
   11:09 JoeyStanford   new members.  My laptop nearly melted due to the continued burning of ISOs. :-)
   11:09 JoeyStanford  
   11:09 JoeyStanford   Through the mailing list, irc channel, and our physical parties we've been able to provide both generalized and specific
   11:09 JoeyStanford   support of Ubuntu to our community. This has resulted in a suggestion for Matthew East:
   11:09 JoeyStanford
   11:09 Ubugtu         Malone bug 51382 in ubuntu-website "Suggestion: LoCo Teams to Free Support Page" [Untriaged,Confirmed]
   11:09 elmo           holy cow, longest intro EVAR
   11:09 JoeyStanford   We have some additional speaking engagements lined up as well as a big, more organized, team parties later this year. We
   11:09 JoeyStanford   were targeting the Sept/Oct time frame and may roll this into the Eft Release Party and/or the Free Software Day
   11:09 JoeyStanford   celebration.
   11:10 mako           yeah, a bit much perhaps :)
   11:10 JoeyStanford   All in all, we've been having a great time and wanted to share our excitement with the Council.  This concludes our
   11:10 JoeyStanford   formal presentation.  We would like to end with a formal solicitation to the council for recognizing our team as an
   11:10 JoeyStanford   official local team. We would very much welcome additional ideas on how to become even more successful as well as
   11:10 JoeyStanford   meeting any missed criteria for being an officially sanctioned Local Community Team. Thank you!!!!
   === JoeyStanford done!
   11:10 nealmcb        I'm Neal McBurnett: and
   === nixternal applauds
   11:10 nealmcb        He said it all
   11:11 mako           i think you guys should be able to definitely modify the colorado flag to include an ubuntu logo
   11:11 nealmcb        :-)
   11:11 mako           or at least two thirds of one
   === JoeyStanford already has a design concepty for Loco t-shirts :-)
   11:12 mako           great
   11:12 mako           well, you said a lot.. i have no questions.. thanks for your work so far and for showing up
   11:12 mako           it's pretty inspirational
   11:13 mako           JoeyStanford: welcome!
   11:13 mako           also nealmcb
   11:13 mako           sharms2?
   11:13 sharms2        I mistyped, I am later in agenda
   11:13 mako           ah, ok
   11:13 nealmcb        You all provide a great platform to rally around, with great community feel.
   11:14 mako           nixternal, chitown!
   11:14 elmo           yeah, what mako said
   11:14 nixternal      After a performance like that by JoeyStanford, there isn't much for me to add. Ubuntu Chicago is doing the same, just in the Chicago land are, and I have had the assistance of JoeyStanford with getting my team up and running.
   11:14 nixternal
   11:14 nixternal
   11:14 nixternal      my members aren't always on irc, and are currently busy
   11:14 mako           also a nice website
   11:15 nixternal      but, we have come to our first agenda which is our first meeting "The Taste of Ubuntu" in 2 weeks
   11:15 nixternal      thanks mako
   11:15 nixternal      we have 30+ already showing up for our first meeting, and we are planning "Chicago Days" where we will be spending a day downtown advocating and spreading ubuntu
   11:16 mako           nixternal: tell Vince Vierra he has a great name :)
   11:16 nixternal      we are currently trying to get a mailing list up and running and haven't had much success with that as the responses are null
   11:16 nixternal      will do mako
   11:16 nixternal      i got in touch with Ubuntu hosting,a nd we will be getting a small site via them next week
   11:16 nixternal      i am getting/trying to get all of the members to join launchpad and sign the CoC
   11:17 mako           nixternal: awesome :)
   11:17 nixternal      i have a great group of guys and gals, and their determination and dedication is endless
   11:17 DBO            mako, purging gpg got it to start making keys again, CoC is signed =)
   11:17 mako           DBO: great
   11:17 mako           awesome
   11:17 mako           nixternal: thanks for your hard work on that
   11:17 nixternal      we also have a couple of big timers who are providing us hardware for demos coming up
   11:18 JoeyStanford   Fantastic news Nix
   11:18 nixternal      i appreciate it mako, as we really enjoy doing it
   11:18 mako           you should feel free to keep places like sounder up to date on your actions
   11:18 nixternal      we even have a LUG that is interested in our work, and they happen to be on OFTC ;)
   11:18 nixternal      will do mako
   11:18 nixternal      that's about it for chicago
   11:19 mako           especially successful stuff you think might other groups might like to learn from or emulate
   11:19 nixternal      we are doing Ubuntu Chicago style as they all say ;)
   11:19 JoeyStanford   nix will post the dates for the Chigago Days festival? I'll try to fly in.
   11:19 nixternal      i can do that JoeyStanford when they become available
   11:19 JoeyStanford   thx
   11:19 nixternal      i will let everyone know
   11:19 nixternal      thanks to you all for the support, as we wouldn't be able to do this w/o the community
   11:20 nixternal      thanks to the CC for your time and consideration as well
   11:20 mako           the Ubuntu Chicago Manueal of Style
   11:20 LaserJock      lol
   11:20 nixternal      hehe
   === ompaul [n=ompaul@ubuntu/member/ompaul] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:21 mako           thanks guys!
   11:21 mako           alright
   11:21 nixternal      thank you mako
   11:22 mako           erdalronahi: you're up!
   11:22 erdalronahi    Hi,
   11:22 erdalronahi    We are a very small team trying to promote Linux in Kurdish. Ubuntu is the first Kurdish Linux, due to Rosetta. Rosetta made translation easy for us. But since we started from zero, there is still a long way to go.
   11:22 erdalronahi    We have produced a Kurdish Ubuntu-Live-CD, with all the langpacks on the CD.
   11:22 erdalronahi
   11:22 erdalronahi
   11:22 erdalronahi    We'd like to become an official team.
   11:22 mako           wow!
   === j_ack [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:23 erdalronahi    that's it, any questions?
   11:23 erdalronahi    :)
   11:23 nixternal      hehe
   11:23 mako           erdalronahi: maybe you can tell us a little about kurdish :)
   11:23 erdalronahi    We have not such an elaborate speech
   11:23 erdalronahi    Of course,
   11:23 jenda          Yes ;) Could there be an english wiki about the team?
   11:23 erdalronahi    yes,
   11:23 mako           was there an existing gnome translation before?
   11:23 erdalronahi    no
   11:23 erdalronahi    we did it
   11:24 jenda          BTW - which part of Kurdistan are you based in?
   11:24 erdalronahi    we started it,
   11:24 erdalronahi    mostly the north
   11:24 erdalronahi    that is Turkey
   11:24 erdalronahi    but I am in Europe
   11:24 jenda          I see.
   11:24 erdalronahi    one is from Iran
   11:24 jenda          Would that be freddyubuntu?
   11:24 nealmcb        very exciting - congrats, folks!
   11:24 erdalronahi    Kurdish is spoken by ~25 million people
   11:25 erdalronahi    but forbidden almost everywhere
   11:25 jenda          interesting.
   11:25 erdalronahi    just in Iraq it is changing now
   11:25 mako           erdalronahi: arent' central and southern kurdish very different?
   11:25 erdalronahi    but that's just a small fraction
   11:25 erdalronahi    yes
   11:25 erdalronahi    quite different
   11:25 jenda          So I heard. Any chance in Turkey?
   11:25 jenda          </OT> :)
   11:25 mako           erdalronahi: can one translation cover both?
   11:25 erdalronahi    well, ours should be understandable, but
   11:25 erdalronahi    no
   11:25 mako           erdalronahi: also, is kurdish written in non-latin scripts?
   11:26 erdalronahi    not really
   11:26 mako           erdalronahi: which kurdish are you translating into?
   11:26 erdalronahi    yes, especially central Kurdish in arabic script
   11:26 erdalronahi    northern
   11:26 erdalronahi    in latin
   11:26 erdalronahi    script
   11:26 erdalronahi    Windows will be translated into the other big dialect
   11:26 jenda          How many people are working on this?
   11:26 erdalronahi    Central Kurdish with arabic script
   11:27 mako           erdalronahi: can you do machine translation?
   11:27 erdalronahi    at the moment about half a dozen steadily
   11:27 erdalronahi    from one script to the other?
   11:27 erdalronahi    or from English, what do you mean?
   11:27 jenda          Which group (Central/Arabic vs. Northern/Latin) is more numerous?
   11:27 mako           erdalronahi: you might be interested in talking to danilo segan who helps maintain translations in both latin and cyrillic serbian
   11:27 erdalronahi    Northern
   11:27 jenda          half a dozen ;) Congrats. It's a lot of work.
   11:27 erdalronahi    but the problem is, because it's forbidden everywhere
   11:27 erdalronahi    there is no formal education,
   11:27 erdalronahi    no standardization
   11:27 jenda          OK
   11:28 erdalronahi    and people from different regions
   11:28 erdalronahi    yes, thanks
   === lilo [i=levin@freenode/staff/pdpc.levin] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:28 erdalronahi    what was that with machine translation?
   11:29 erdalronahi    It is possible to convert the alphabets into one another
   11:29 erdalronahi    mako, was that the question
   11:29 erdalronahi    ?
   11:29 nealmcb        do you have contacts in the central/arabic community?
   11:30 erdalronahi    little
   11:30 mako           elmo: yes
   11:30 erdalronahi    there is vrtually no existing free software project
   11:30 mako           sorry
   11:30 mako           erdalronahi: yes, that was the question
   11:30 erdalronahi    I have written scripts for that
   11:31 mako           great :)
   11:31 mako           erdalronahi: you might want to send a mail or talk on IRC with danilo
   11:31 erdalronahi    yes, thanks
   11:31 mako           erdalronahi: he has a lot of software to do similar things that people in other language have been using
   11:31 erdalronahi    we had similar issues on the wikipedia
   === mako nods
   11:31 mako           erdalronahi: well it's great to have you on board
   11:31 erdalronahi    to convert articles automatically
   11:31 erdalronahi    thanks a lot,
   === Bigtoe [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:32 erdalronahi    we especially like the attitude of Ubuntu
   11:32 mako           i'm thrilled you're going to make ubuntu the first kurdish language distribution :)
   11:32 erdalronahi    that makes it easy for weak groups like ours
   11:32 erdalronahi    it is already, it is usable
   11:32 erdalronahi    in Kurdish
   11:32 nealmcb        strong-hearted groups like yours!!
   11:32 mako           erdalronahi: do you have screenshots?
   11:32 erdalronahi    Ubuntu has Kurdish firefox before Mozilla has
   11:32 erdalronahi    :)
   11:32 jenda          wow ;)
   11:33 mako           erdalronahi: i have a few kurdish friends here, i'll show them :)
   11:33 erdalronahi
   11:33 mako           erdalronahi: they'll probably be impressed :)
   11:33 erdalronahi    screenshots
   11:33 jenda          amazing LoCo work, really. I'm saving this log for the Czech LoCo to see.
   11:33 erdalronahi    mako, where is "here"?
   11:35 nealmcb        General question: are you now considering these locos to be "official", whatever that really means?
   === j_ack [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:35 erdalronahi    yes, I have a question with that
   11:35 erdalronahi    we registered
   === bddebian [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:35 erdalronahi    later I was told that I shouldn't
   11:35 erdalronahi    the owner must be Canonical
   11:36 elmo           erdalronahi: how long have you guys been active?
   11:36 erdalronahi    since warty
   11:36 erdalronahi    breezy had a Kurdish locale, but no translations
   === Bigtoe [] has left #ubuntu-meeting []
   11:36 erdalronahi    Dapper has Keyboards and translations
   11:36 mako           erdalronahi: boston
   11:37 mako           awesome :)
   11:37 erdalronahi    probably from the south then? they are invited to help
   11:37 nixternal      mako: the salty dog?
   11:38 erdalronahi    We have a wish, too,
   11:38 erdalronahi    maybe not the place here,
   11:38 erdalronahi    but in Turkey and Iran there are lots of Winmodems around
   11:38 erdalronahi    I know that has been discussed,
   === mako nods
   11:38 mako           in the interest of time, we should really move on
   === GStubbs43 [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   11:38 elmo           yes ;)
   11:38 erdalronahi    yes,
   11:38 mako           but thanks erdalronahi for your work and for introducing it here
   11:39 mako           great stuff
   11:39 erdalronahi    thank you for your time
   11:39 mako           any other locos?
   11:39 mako           i am going to turn into a pumpkin in half an hour
   11:39 nealmcb        So are we official now?
   11:39 Seveas         nealmcb, yes
   11:39 nealmcb        :-)
   11:39 nixternal      thank you mako, thank you CC!!!
   === JoeyStanford points out that Colorado is the first Official USA LoCo Team
   11:39 mako           any other locos? going twice
   11:40 mako           JoeyStanford: no way :)
   === JoeyStanford lol
   === nixternal points to JoeyStanford that Chicago is still in the US!!!
   11:40 mako           JoeyStanford: detroit has had KICKING loco for a long time
   11:40 JoeyStanford   You're second buddy :-)
   11:40 nixternal      they haven't moved us yet
   11:40 jenda          break it up ;)
   11:40 JoeyStanford   lol yeah, the wiki needs to be updated
   11:40 nixternal      oh ya, Detroit had a huge release party as well!!
   11:40 mako           alright
   11:40 Toadstool      (/me whispers "hi everybody")
   11:40 mako           new member candidates
   === alenitchev is here
   11:41 sharms2        I am here.
   === nixternal is here
   11:41 mako           for the few and the strong that have survived this far
   === lfittl is here
   === JoeyStanford is here
   11:41 Seveas         JoeyStanford is the first
   === heno here
   11:41 Seveas         (whitesoft isn't around)
   11:41 mako           Seveas: ah, ok
   11:41 heno           I have to go in about 10 min though :(
   11:41 mako           JoeyStanford: ok.. we're already familiar with your work
   11:41 JoeyStanford   lol
   11:41 nixternal      nice
   11:41 JoeyStanford   I have a pitch but it's smaller than the loco
   === Sp4rKy is here
   11:41 Seveas         JoeyStanford, *pfew*
   11:41 JoeyStanford   Go or skip? :-)
   11:42 Seveas         go
   11:42 elmo           let's do heno quickly if he has to go?
   11:42 JoeyStanford   Greetings.
   11:42 JoeyStanford   Thank you for allowing me a few minutes of your time today. My wiki entry is:
   11:42 JoeyStanford    (note the TABS at the top of the page)
   11:42 nealmcb        joey can you do it in one long line?
   11:42 JoeyStanford   I am applying for Ubuntu Membership today. If you deem me not ready, I would very much like guidance on how/what to
   11:42 JoeyStanford   improve so I may reapply in the future.
   11:42 heno           elmo: thanks, after Joey
   11:42 JoeyStanford   About myself: I'm very passionate about Free/Open Software. I have been using GNU/Linux since the mid-1990s and have
   11:42 JoeyStanford   been using Ubuntu since Warty. I made the switch to using only Ubuntu in my personal life in 2004.
   11:42 JoeyStanford   I am active in a few
   11:42 JoeyStanford   non-Ubuntu F/OSS projects but I am most well known as an Project Lead.
   11:42 JoeyStanford  
   11:42 JoeyStanford   I founded both the OOo Esperanto L10N Team and the Esperanto Native Lang Team (yes, Esperanto has "de naska" (from
   11:42 JoeyStanford   birth) speakers!) and, in general, I help out a number of other (non-translation based) OOo projects.  Neal also speaks Esperanto btw
   11:42 JoeyStanford  
   11:43 JoeyStanford   My Ubuntu Activities: I am the founder and current Team Leader of the Colorado Local Community Team, the co-lead for the
   11:43 JoeyStanford   Ubuntu Esperanto Team, and a participant on the Marketing and Laptop Testing Teams. My Launchpad Karma is steadily
   11:43 JoeyStanford   growing too. :-)
   11:43 JoeyStanford   A mostly-complete list of my contributions to Ubuntu can be found on my wiki page.
   11:43 JoeyStanford  
   11:43 JoeyStanford   My Future Participation in Ubuntu: I will remain, for the foreseeable future, the team lead for the Colorado Team. I
   11:43 JoeyStanford   have great aspirations of continuing to grow the user base and outreach programs as well as helping local Ubuntu users.
   11:43 JoeyStanford   I've set the full goals to 'paper' on the Team's wiki entry:
   11:43 JoeyStanford  
   11:43 JoeyStanford   I also have a standing commitment to my Ubuntu Esperanto Teammate, Tim Morley, that I will continue to assist with
   11:43 JoeyStanford   translations, builds, organizational activities, and other activities.
   11:43 JoeyStanford   I am also eager to see how I can increase my
   11:43 JoeyStanford   participation in the Marketing Team via the team's projects (SpreadUbuntu, Ubuntu Magazine, etc.) as they deploy.
   11:43 Seveas         that
   11:43 JoeyStanford   A
   11:43 JoeyStanford   complete list of my aspirations and goals can be found on my wiki page.
   11:43 JoeyStanford  
   11:43 Seveas         isn't smaller
   11:43 JoeyStanford   I wish to thank you all again for your time today. I welcome any questions you may have.  This concludes my
   11:43 JoeyStanford   introduction.  Thank you.
   === JoeyStanford done
   === JoeyStanford lol
   11:43 Toadstool      pfew, at least it was shorter than the locoteam intro :P
   11:43 mako           c'mon man
   11:43 nixternal      haha
   11:44 JoeyStanford   I'm a project manager and I had material ready. :-)
   11:44 jenda          So, JoeyStanford, who did you say you were?
   === JoeyStanford laughs.
   11:44 nixternal      scroll up
   11:44 jenda          mako: JoeyStanford has also helped out bits and pieces, definitely noticeable, with the budding Marketing Team.
   11:44 mako           JoeyStanford: are you a native esperanto speaker?
   11:44 JoeyStanford   mako: not native.
   11:44 nealmcb        Again, I'm   I've worked with Joey for two years on various projects including Ubuntu and Linux.  Joey has an enormous amount of energy, and is experienced in a wide variety of fields: technical, project leadership, organizational, security.  He gives great Ubuntu talks for local Linux Users Groups.  He is very community-minded, and organizes people and activities well.  And he has a smile that simply radiates
   11:45 JoeyStanford   wow, thanks neal
   11:45 JoeyStanford   and Jenda
   11:45 nixternal      im also a +1 on Joey as I have worked with him with the Ubuntu Magazine, and he guided me with getting the Ubuntu Chicago LoCo up, we need more people like him in the community!!!
   11:45 mako           your LP page?
   11:46 Seveas
   11:46 nealmcb        but his esperanto accent needs a lot of work to recover from growing up in New York
   11:46 mako           thanks
   === JoeyStanford notes most people get confused with the tabs on his wiki entry
   === jenda was too
   11:47 mako           great :)
   11:47 mako           i'm happy with JoeyStanford as a member
   11:47 mako           elmo, Kamion?
   11:47 elmo           +1
   11:47 mako           who is the next person here?
   11:47 Kamion         how could I not, with such an intro ;-)
   11:48 JoeyStanford   lol
   11:48 mako           Kamion: i almost didn't BECAUSE of the intro
   11:48 mako           ;)
   === heno asks nicely to cut in the queue
   11:48 gnomefreak     heno: was next because he has to go?
   11:48 heno           :)
   11:48 juantao_       Jon Dowd
   11:48 jenda          Congratulations, JoeyStanford. Knew you could make it
   11:48 mako           heno: go ahead henrik
   11:48 Seveas         juantao_, please wait
   11:48 heno           Hi folks
   11:48 JoeyStanford   Thanks everyone.
   === cdeeeee [n=cdeeeee@] has left #ubuntu-meeting []
   11:48 juantao_       k
   11:48 heno           - I started TheOpenCD project in 2002, which is the upstream for the Ubuntu WinFOSS.
   11:48 heno           - I've been working on Ubuntu since August 2004. First with the WinFOSS selection, then as webmaster and now focusing on accessibility and non-software content
   11:48 heno           - I'm sort of an adopted member of the core development team, though I'm not a developer :)
   11:48 heno           - For this release I want to try to put some more weight behind our claim of having the best accessibility support available. I think we are just ahead of the other major distros now by a nose, but we should work to set a new standard.
   11:48 heno           - I like the phrase 'computing for everyone'
   11:49 mako           i can't beleive heno isn't a member already
   11:49 Seveas         likewise
   11:49 heno           sorry, left it a bit late ;-p
   11:49 elmo           I think this falls under the "obvious" category (c.f. gcc etc. commit rules)
   11:50 heno           wanted tomake sure I could show sustained effort ...
   11:50 mako           usually a like a little more smalltalk but i disappear in 15 minutes so :)
   11:50 mako           heno: you win on both counts
   11:50 mako           heno: well you've got my vote :)
   11:50 mako           Kamion: make it official?
   11:50 mako           juantao_: you're up!
   11:50 juantao_       worth the wait, this has been very educational and heart-warming.
   11:51 mako           heno: i think i'll risk welcoming you prematurely
   11:51 heno           cool, thanks!
   11:51 mako           heno: thanks for sticking through the meeting
   11:51 Kamion         yes, been working with heno for ages and obviously have no problem at all with him, huge sustained/significant contribution
   11:52 Seveas         juantao_, please introduce yourself
   11:52 juantao_       My name is Jon Dowd and I live in Ashland Oregon (USA). Support manager small (7,000 users) ISP, by day. Evenings are spent rebuilding computers donated to the prior Saturday with using Ubuntu exclusively.
   11:52 mako           heno: if every candidate was as commically overqualified for membership as you, our meetings would be of a more sane length
   11:52 heno           :)
   11:52 juantao_       In February I drove my little truck 5,000 miles to New Orleans donating computers to former Black Panther and founder of Common Ground Relief. I set up a small LAN in his garage to help assist coordination of their efforts (summer home to 2,000 student volunteers. Came home one week later and opened a center where we take in donated computers, install Ubuntu and prepare them for delivery this August.
   11:52 mako           juantao_: i love ashland :)
   11:52 juantao_       it IS paradise
   11:53 juantao_       These efforts will result in placing Ubuntu computers in several schools. Although I applaud the efforts many are making in Edubuntu, for our needs (older students) Ubuntu is better suited.
   11:53 mako           tjat
   11:53 mako           that's great
   11:54 mako           what are your contributions in the ubuntu community to date?
   11:54 juantao_       promoting Ubuntu to all and putting it on all the computers i touch
   === mako nods
   11:55 juantao_       (small compared to others here today)
   11:55 mako           juantao_: well, that's not necessary the case
   11:55 juantao_       but I touch 5 /10 computers a week - they all get Ubuntu!
   11:55 jenda          juantao_: you're a person who should definitely be in #ubuntu-marketing, on a side note ;)
   11:55 mako           juantao_: but we usually ask for documentation ad/or testimonials from the community
   11:55 mako           jenda: right, for example
   11:56 mako           i can imagine a number of other places in the community where you energy/effort could be integrated
   11:56 juantao_       sorry, i dont think i'm known
   11:56 juantao_       we are on the cusp of a really big thing here , aren't we?
   11:56 mako           with ubuntu?
   11:56 juantao_       yes
   11:56 mako           i think so :)
   11:56 juantao_       changing the world
   11:57 juantao_       as in what we pay for and defining free
   11:57 mako           juantao_: so ubuntu related advocacy work is a great way to qualify for membership
   11:57 juantao_       well i thuought so and showed up.
   11:58 juantao_       signed the contract
   11:58 mako           juantao_: but its easier for us to be able to recognize it with a bit more documentation and integration with the rest of the community
   11:58 mako           juantao_: well, that's the first step
   11:58 juantao_       sure.
   === bddebian wonders how he ever got in :-)
   11:58 juantao_       I can wait,
   11:58 Seveas         bddebian, you bribed ogra
   11:58 mako           juantao_: i would suggest you look at the marketing team or the doc team or any number of other parts of the community
   11:58 juantao_       sure
   11:58 bddebian       Seveas: Oh yeah, thx :-)
   11:58 mako           maybe in a monht or so pull together a few testimionials from other folks
   11:59 mako           juantao_: shouldn't be controverisla :)
   11:59 Toadstool      bddebian: you're a god, remember? ;)
   11:59 jenda          juantao_: you're always welcome in the marketing team ;)
   11:59 juantao_       i'll do it, and come back
   11:59 mako           juantao_: if you're alright with that, i'd just as soon proceed
   11:59 LaserJock      juantao_: edubuntu would also be probably interested in your experiecene with the schools
   11:59 mako           juantao_: great! thanks for showing up and for your work so far!
   11:59 mako           looking forward to great things in the future
   11:59 juantao_       thanks, I'll paste this in a memo - ya'll are GREAT !
   11:59 mako           crap, i have another meeting starting like now
   11:59 Seveas         mako, eep :/
   12:00 mako           who else is here
   12:00 sharms2        I am here
   12:00 lfittl         me
   === alenitchev here
   === nixternal is here
   12:00 Sp4rKy         me
   12:00 Seveas         Sp4rKy, nixternal alenitchev lfittl
   12:00 gnomefreak     Seveas: sharms2 also
   12:00 mako           alright
   12:00 mako           alenitchev: you're next in line
   12:00 alenitchev     Hello
   12:00 alenitchev     My name is Dmitri Alenitchev. I'm 19 years old and live in Moscow region, Russia. At present moment i work in small software company, "Digital Worlds J.S.C." at System Administrator position. In my work i use Free and Open Source software.
   12:01 alenitchev     Since 2000 year i use GNU/Linux as my primary OS. Also, i use FreeBSD and OpenBSD. My contribution to Open Source project was started from packaging and documentation works for Russian RPM-based Linux distribution - ALTLinux. I make some works for another RPM distribution - Fedora Core Linux. My first translations to Russian language i make for Fedora Core. Since summer, 2005 I'm official GNU Webmaster. Also, i make some works for various GNU
   12:01 alenitchev     projects.
   12:01 Seveas         mako, err, Sp4rKy was...
   12:01 alenitchev     Since 2005 year i become maintainer of `manpages-ru' package in Debian, included in Ubuntu. In this year i start making works for (documentation, translation and QA).
   12:01 Sp4rKy         I'm Maxence DUNNEWIND ( ) , actually i try to help a lot of people on IRC (mainly at #ubuntu-fr / #ubuntu-fr-testing) . I also start with packaging few weeks ago, and my first package (yerinia) has been accepted today in universe repositories. I hope i'll could  help many people with ubuntu or convert some of them from Windows to Ubuntu (i coach a Free software && Linux training in few d
   12:01 Sp4rKy         ays). I hope to create more package and maybe help new packagers and why not become a MOTU. I'm actually working on a enlightenment DR17 repository for Ubuntu.
   === juantao_ [] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"]
   12:01 alenitchev     My interests in Ubuntu is participating in works for better hardware support, packaging, translation in Russian language, documentation, QA. I think about 3-5 hours work for Ubuntu every day.
   12:01 mako           ergh. sorry
   12:01 bddebian       Ack my eyes
   12:01 Seveas         ah well, we now had both intros
   === nixternal faints
   12:02 mako           umm.. Sp4rKy lets go ahead with you since you were next in line
   12:02 Sp4rKy         k
   12:02 Sp4rKy         do you see my intro ?
   12:03 mako           yes
   12:03 mako           any testimonials?
   12:03 Toadstool      yep
   12:03 Sp4rKy         yes gloubiboulga at wiki
   12:03 Sp4rKy         toadstool
   12:03 Sp4rKy         and maybe bddebian
   12:03 jenda          I've seen Sp4rKy help out on IRC quite a bit.
   12:03 Toadstool      Sp4rKy is of great help on #ubuntu-fr and #ubuntu-fr-testing
   12:03 Toadstool      and he's started packaging a few weeks ago and he's doing a great job
   12:04 bddebian       Aye, Sp4rKy has bene working on packaging
   12:04 Sp4rKy         yep
   12:04 Sp4rKy         yersinia , my first package, was just accepted to Universe :)
   12:04 mako           i saw the two on the wiki
   12:05 mako           Sp4rKy: how long have you been active in ubuntu?
   12:05 mako           Sp4rKy: how long have you been doing packaging stuff?
   12:05 Sp4rKy         i'm active at IRC since about 2 years
   12:05 Sp4rKy         i've wrote my first french tutorial 1year ago
   12:05 Sp4rKy         and i've started packaging since about  2/3 month ago
   12:06 Sp4rKy         and actually works on some packages
   12:06 Sp4rKy         and an e17 repository
   12:06 mako           right
   12:07 mako           well, a little more documentation would be nice
   12:07 mako           but i'm happy approving Sp4rKy for membership
   === bimberi [n=bimberi@ubuntu/member/] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   12:07 mako           and i just got a call from the person i am standing up for a meeting right now
   12:08 mako           so i'm going to have to disappear
   12:08 mako           if Kamion or elmo can guide through the rest of this, i'm happy to put in my 2cents later
   12:08 mako           otherwise, we'll have to pick up later
   12:08 nixternal      take care mako, and thanks for listening!!!
   === mako apologizes
   === DBO [] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["I]
   12:08 elmo           mako: thanks
   12:08 Kamion         I'm happy with Sp4rKy too
   12:08 elmo           yeah, +1 from me
   12:08 mako           see you all next time guys
   12:08 mako           Sp4rKy: welcome! :)
   12:09 jenda          later
   12:09 mako           and goodbye :)
   12:09 gnomefreak     later mako
   12:09 Seveas         ciao mako
   12:09 elmo           who's left to do?
   12:09 elmo           (that's here)
   12:09 lfittl         me
   === nixternal is
   12:09 Toadstool      congratulations Sp4rKy !
   === alenitchev is here
   === sharms2 is here
   12:09 Sp4rKy         thanx mako Kamion elmo  !
   12:09 bddebian       Yeah Sp4rKy
   12:09 Sp4rKy         thanx CC
   12:09 Sp4rKy         thx bddebian Toadstool !!!
   12:09 bddebian       OK guys I have to run but:
   12:09 Sp4rKy         and gloubi of course
   12:09 bddebian       nixternal+
   12:09 nixternal      thx bddebian
   12:09 bddebian       sharms2+
   12:09 Sp4rKy         (and jenda too )
   12:09 jenda         
   12:09 jenda          let's move ;)
   12:09 elmo           ok, 4 more.  guys, you can either postpoone till next time, or we can talk to you now and have mako vote later after catching up on the logs
   12:10 nixternal      now ;)
   12:10 alenitchev     now
   12:10 lfittl         now would be better

   12:10 bddebian       Oh and lfittl+ ( I see his name all over :-) )
   12:10 Kamion         ok
   12:10 lfittl         bddebian: thanks :)
   12:10 sharms2        bddebian: thank you
   12:10 elmo           ok, alenitchev I think you're next on the list
   12:10 elmo           alenitchev: wanna do your intro?
   12:11 alenitchev     ok
   12:11 alenitchev     My name is Dmitri Alenitchev. I'm 19 years old and live in Moscow region, Russia. At present moment i work in small software company, "Digital Worlds J.S.C." at System Administrator position. In my work i use Free and Open Source software.
   12:11 alenitchev     Since 2000 year i use GNU/Linux as my primary OS. Also, i use FreeBSD and OpenBSD. My contribution to Open Source project was started from packaging and documentation works for Russian RPM-based Linux distribution - ALTLinux. I make some works for another RPM distribution - Fedora Core Linux. My first translations to Russian language i make for Fedora Core. Since summer, 2005 I'm official GNU Webmaster. Also, i make some works for various GNU
   12:11 alenitchev     projects.
   12:11 alenitchev     Since 2005 year i become maintainer of `manpages-ru' package in Debian, included in Ubuntu. In this year i start making works for (documentation, translation and QA).
   12:11 alenitchev     My interests in Ubuntu is participating in works for better hardware support, packaging, translation in Russian language, documentation, QA. I think about 3-5 hours work for Ubuntu every day.
   12:11 alenitchev     use Ubuntu since Warty
   12:11 alenitchev     since breezy my package (from Debian) in Ubuntu
   12:12 alenitchev     that is all ;)
   12:13 Kamion         that's a lot of teams (on launchpad); how many of those do you actively keep up with?
   12:13 alenitchev     many of them
   12:14 alenitchev     i'm in team, which interested for me
   === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   === sryan [] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"]
   12:15 Kamion         just seems like a hell of a lot to actively keep up with, that's all :)
   12:16 Kamion         no real problems though, you seem to have been making reasonable contributions for a while
   12:16 elmo           yeah, I agree
   12:16 alenitchev     thanks
   12:17 Kamion         maybe one day we'll get around to music-while-installing ;-)
   === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   12:17 alenitchev     that will be really nice! ;)
   12:17 Kamion         (though I expect it'll end up being Mark's flash demo or whatever)
   12:17 Kamion         (once the content actually exists and free software can play it without crashing and burning entertainingly)
   === jenda will turn up his stereo louder
   12:18 alenitchev     Kamion: yes, can
   12:18 Kamion         anyhow, +1 as far as I'm concerned; mako can catch up with you later on for final approval
   12:19 alenitchev     Kamion: thanks
   12:19 elmo           ok, who's next
   12:19 elmo           nixternal, I think?
   12:19 nixternal      im still here
   12:19 nixternal      hehe
   12:19 nixternal      go go go
   === nixternal is Rich Johnson, 32 years old, out of Chicago, IL US. I am a sys admin by trade, and getting ready to go back to school to brush up on programming!!!
   12:19 nixternal      Wiki:     |     launchpad:
   12:19 nixternal      Been using/abusing Linux since 1994 (on & off). Started playing with Ubuntu last year, and fell in love really starting with Kubuntu Dapper Flight 3.
   12:19 nixternal      I have been in and out of the IRC channel with many different nicks over the past year, however since April/May I have been 'nixternal' in #kubuntu offering support as much as possible.
   12:19 nixternal      I am also in the NewUserNetwork which runs a classroom for the new user and their Ubuntu Linux operating system. Starting in August we will be running actual classes for everyone to check out. I will be adding myself as a mentor/instructor for a couple of programs.
   12:20 nixternal      I have contributed a lot to many wiki pages, as I work on the WikiTeam. My main contributions have been in the CategoryCleanup area, cleaning up pages that aren't styled correctly, or the information is confusing. I have done over 100 pages so far, and there is still more then 300 left.
   12:20 nixternal      DocumentationTeam work consists of helping the team review documentation, as I am not a full fledged member just yet, and I am still learning the svn system as well as docbooks. However, I am working alongside jjesse and others on creating "Switching From Windows" documentation.
   12:20 nixternal      Marketing Team work right now is huge, as we are redesigning ourselves. I am currently working on Wiki redesign for all Marketing pages, as well as the Magazine project. I am also working on documentation/presentations for members to use for Marketing as well as for the LoCo Teams.
   12:20 nixternal      Laptop team work is currently pretty slow as we are waiting for the first Knot really to begin testing again. I have contributed a Kubuntu Dapper test for Flight 7 and the LTS. I will continue providing support in the IRC channel as well.
   12:20 Seveas         nixternal, ah, so the NuN/classroom is going somewhere, cool!
   12:20 nixternal      BugSquad work will definitely keep you busy. I have done triage, minor in aspect, as I haven't created a patch just yet, but I have done the general work by responding to the poster, asking for more information if needed, and confirming if possible.
   12:20 nixternal      Chicago Team is keeping me pretty busy as it is a very new team. We are officially holding our first meeting July 27. I will be giving a couple presentations as well as a few of our other members. Membership is continuing to grow daily, and we are planning an event downtown Chicago soon.
   12:20 jenda          Rich Johnson's contribution and support in the Marketing Team was invaluable. Added his involvement in the NUN, WikiTeam, DocTeam etc., but mainly the Chicago LoCo Team - he is an extremely valuable asset to the Ubuntu community, and if every LoCo had one of these, Ubuntu Marketing would probably be on a totally different level by now.
   12:20 nixternal      I am becoming more and more of a forums leach. I have supported a couple of things in both the Ubuntu and Kubuntu forums. I am trying to work my way up the proverbial "Cups of Java" ladder, of course without spamming to gain points ;)
   12:20 gnomefreak     Seveas: so far we hope to get it moving
   12:20 nixternal      My future plans are to continue supporting the Ubuntu community anyway possible. I am interested in future programming and packaging, as well as documentation, testing, reviewing, marketing, bug triaging, and everything else I am available to do.
   12:20 nixternal      Thank you, and now the floor is open to you!!!
   12:20 nixternal      yes Seveas
   12:21 nixternal      now that my lag is at 2s ;)
   12:22 nixternal      there is more that you will find me doing... i believe jjesse also emailed Seveas with support
   12:22 nixternal      i am in to many channgels to count, and when i can help i step up if possible
   12:22 bimberi        I've seen nixternal helping people in #kubuntu for quite a while (>>2 months).  Of other areas I'm involved with he's an active contributor to ubuntu-marketing, ubuntu-doc and it seeems he's a (the?) prime mover for the Chicago LoCoTeam.  Enthusiastic, Smart, a Do-er.  A real asset.
   12:23 nixternal      i figure that if Ubuntu is free to me, then I should help as much as possible to continue it
   12:23 Seveas         nixternal, dang
   12:23 Seveas         I will not be able to make it to the next meeting to pass on a word of recommendation for Rich but wanted to lend what support maybe.  He has been quite active on many channels including #kubuntu-devel and #ubuntu-doc adding interesting things to the converstation.  We are working together on creating a new document ( Switching From Windows for edgy and have had l
   12:23 Seveas         ots of discussion.  He has also been VERY VERY active on the Wiki doing a lot of cleanup and other thankless tasks.  A great candidate for becoming a Ubuntu Member.  I know how hard it is to become a member without support so I wanted to lend any help that I can.
   12:23 Seveas         ^-- jjesse sent that two weeks ago
   12:23 nixternal      hehe
   12:23 Seveas         completely forgot it this time
   12:23 nixternal      thx Seveas
   12:23 nixternal      thank god he CC'd me, otherwise i wouldn't have known
   12:23 gnomefreak     nixternal: is doing a great job with -marketing and -nun and i have seen him step up when hes around to help another user
   12:23 nixternal      also, im getting ready to help jsgotangco on a "Server Book" project he has coming up
   12:24 nixternal      i will be providing a review to the publisher
   12:24 Seveas         nixternal, /me too
   12:24 elmo           ok
   12:24 nixternal      im picking up packaging, as I read it to help out LaserJock with editing it
   12:25 elmo           thanks nixternal, that all seems pretty impressive
   12:25 nixternal      thank you
   12:25 elmo           +1 from me
   12:25 Kamion         (catching up, one sec)
   12:25 nixternal      hehe
   12:25 Seveas         who is doing lp today? Sp4rKy is not accepted yet on lp
   12:25 nixternal      CoC is signed, karma >10k
   12:25 nixternal      been here a few months
   12:26 nixternal      staying here for as long as you will keep me ;)
   12:26 Kamion         yup, having read that, no issues - +1
   12:27 Kamion         elmo: will you do lp or do you want me to?
   12:27 Seveas         nixternal, almost congratz then (make will read later)
   12:27 Seveas         sharms2, you're next
   12:27 nixternal mako
   12:27 nixternal      hahah
   12:27 elmo           Kamion: I can do it
   === sharms2 is here
   12:27 Kamion         ta
   12:27 nixternal      thanks everyone!!!
   12:27 sharms2        I am Steven Harms.  My wiki page (create to spec with the requirements listed :):, and I am applying for Ubuntu Membership.  I have been using Ubuntu since it first came out (in fact my forums user ID is < 600).
   12:27 sharms2        I frequently help users on #ubuntu, I have recently taken an active role in bug triage, and am looking to eventually join the MOTU.
   12:27 sharms2        I also act as a Ubuntu support / advocate on the campus of the university of michigan, and provide ubuntu cd's to students (I generally distribute ~30 a release)
   12:27 sharms2        I am looking to increase my roll in bug triage, because I feel it is one of the best ways to help ubuntu by filtering bugs which are not bugs, and confirming the ones that are bugs, so people directly involved may actually fix said bugs.
   12:28 sharms2        I thank you for taking the time to look over my wiki page and appreciate your time
   12:28 Seveas         sharms, what's your forum profilepage?
   12:29 sharms2        one sec
   12:29 sharms2
   12:30 sharms2        On a side note, for the freenode ofth discussion, I was previously known as mindwarp here until my nickname was stolen
   === ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Calendar: | Logs: | 12 Jul 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 13 Jul 07:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 13 Jul 19:00 UTC: Marketing Team | 17 Jul 13:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 18 Jul 20:00 UTC: Technical Board | 19 Jul 20:00 UTC: Edubuntu
   12:31 sharms2        Here is my mouse howto:
   12:31 sharms2        for those using the usb microsoft explorer mouse with forward and back buttons (firefox)
   12:33 elmo           hmm, did you have anyone vouching for you?
   12:33 sharms2        bddebian
   12:33 sharms2        he has seen me help people in #ubuntu
   12:33 sharms2        but mostly just that I bug triage right now, which doesnt have a ton of interaction over here
   12:33 elmo           ok
   12:34 nixternal      #ubuntu-bugs is where us bug sickos hang out!!
   12:34 sharms2        :)
   12:36 sharms2        Also I am hoping to take over the istanbul package eventaully
   12:36 sharms2        been working on it but I think gstreamer needs more polish at this point since certain pipes segfault here
   12:36 elmo           sharms: how long have you been doing bug triage and stuff?
   12:37 sharms2        Last few months I have started triaging very actively, previously due to an already reported launchpad bug I wasn't able to find how to properly triage bugs
   12:38 elmo           ok
   12:38 Kamion         ok, your page is a little light compared to some others tonight, but you do seem to have been doing a fairly respectable amount of bug work
   === popey [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   === pontifex [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   12:39 elmo           agreed, +1 from me
   12:39 sharms2        thank you very much
   12:39 elmo           ok, lfittl ?
   12:40 Kamion         I recommend continuing to work with the #ubuntu-bugs and #ubuntu-motu crowds
   12:40 Kamion         who can help you develop
   12:40 Kamion         but +1 from me for membership for the time being
   12:40 lfittl         My name is Lukas Fittl, I'm a student from Vienna, Austria.
   12:40 lfittl         I have started using Ubuntu with 5.04 / Hoary, and with the start of the dapper release cycle I got interested in packaging. At the moment I maintain 10 packages in universe, and for one package I am also part of upstream (libloki). For Dapper I fixed around 60 unmet dependencies in universe. If I find some free time I triage bugs in Malone, and I also review old bug reports that are still open to ensure they have the cor
   12:40 lfittl         rect status. Recently I added a new column to the packaging candidates page, to make tracking the debian status and existing packages easier.
   12:40 sharms2        I appreciate the advice thank you
   12:40 lfittl         More information can be found at my wiki page (
   12:40 Kamion         excuse me, I have a crying child to attend to
   12:40 lfittl         k
   === GStubbs43 [] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["I]
   === chuck_ [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   12:43 Kamion         right, sorry, back
   12:43 elmo           wow, impressive amount of packaging work
   12:43 lfittl         np
   12:44 lfittl         elmo: thanks, I also have some other packages on my todo list ;)
   12:44 Kamion         we seriously need to get uploads into the karma system
   12:45 lfittl         yep
   12:45 elmo           oh, good point, I'll file a bug on soyuz
   12:45 LaserJock      \o/
   12:45 lfittl         elmo: I think this is already planned somewhere in the wiki
   12:45 elmo           lfittl: bugs help reinforce planning ;)
   12:46 lfittl         elmo: thats right :)
   12:46 Kamion
   12:46 lfittl         :)
   12:46 elmo           any MOTUs still around and want to do their \o/ dance for lfittl?
   12:47 LaserJock      lfittl has been around -motu for some time
   12:47 ogra           dholbach sponsored a lot for lfittl and was always happy with the package quality as he often told me
   12:47 Kamion         cool, that spec proposes enormous karma for archive admins, rah
   12:47 Kamion         *ahem*
   12:47 LaserJock      I haven't sponsored any of lfittl's packages so I can't say much there
   12:47 ogra           seems he keeps our windowmaker community happy ;)
   === Flik [] has joined #ubuntu-meeting
   12:49 elmo           +1 from me
   12:49 lfittl         thank you :)
   12:51 Kamion         right, +1 for sheer packaging effort
   12:52 Kamion         I've seen your name going past for some time now
   12:52 lfittl         also, thanks :)
   12:53 lfittl         should I contact mako to get his opinion, or will he automatically catch up?
   12:54 alenitchev     yes, what about mako's opinion?
   12:54 elmo           we'll send him a a mail asking him to look at the logs for you 4 when he gets a chance
   12:54 lfittl         k
   12:54 elmo           if he has any concerns, we can deal with them, otherwise, you'll be approved when he's had a chance to do that
   12:55 elmo           we'll also have to schedule the next meeting out of band.  but mark should be back for the next one
   12:55 alenitchev     ok, thanks!
   12:55 lfittl         thanks for your time
   12:55 sharms         I really appreciate it guys also
   12:55 Kamion         ok, sorry this has been such a marathon meeting
   12:56 sharms         it shows dedication!
   12:56 Kamion         (not been any easier for us than for you guys)
   12:56 elmo           yeah, thanks everyone for your patience
   12:56 alenitchev     thanks for your time!
   12:56 elmo           meeting closed.  adjourned.  whatever.  thank you and good night.

MeetingLogs/CC_2006-07-11 (last edited 2008-08-06 16:15:12 by localhost)