20071003
Log
UTC
06:04 heno welcome all to the first Ubuntu QA IRC meeting 06:05 bdmurray \o/ 06:05 heno (at least I think so) 06:05 pedro_ yay! 06:05 heno We have an agenda here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam 06:06 heno the QA devel sprint was very productive IMO: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings/OsloSprint 06:06 heno lots to do for the Hardy cycle and to discuss at UDS 06:07 heno bdmurray: has sent me some ideas for UDS topics. more input is welcome 06:08 heno (though that's next topic) 06:10 liw I obviously agree that it was a productive meeting (since I was there), and I don't really have anything to add right now that isn't on the OsloSprint page 06:10 heno any questions/comments on the sprint topics? === jsgotangco [n=JSG@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:10 pedro_ yep, can be add the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Stats to be discussed there also? 06:11 heno ok, so Action: heno to distill UDS discussion topics from the sprint notes and propose them for scheduling 06:12 liw pedro_, I think that looks like a perfect thing to include in the "Bug statistics" topic at UDS 06:12 heno agreed 06:12 pedro_ liw, ok great 06:12 stgraber About the bug stats part, do we still agree that moving them inside the QA-Website/Tracker would be the way to go to avoid having them hosted on people.u.c, then fetched by qa.ubuntu.com and then shown (as we have python cron scripts for qa.stgraber.org anyway) ? 06:13 bdmurray Part of the reason reports are run on p.u.c is the queries run much faster there 06:13 heno stgraber: I think you, bdmurray and others should discuss this in detail at UDS 06:14 heno bdmurray: but we'll move the qa tracker to the DC *real soon now* 06:14 stgraber bdmurray: hmm, should be the same once we have qa.stgraber.org moved to qa.ubuntu.com and inside Canonical DC no ? 06:14 heno the plan is this week 06:14 bdmurray Ah, I did not know this. So many loops to stay in. === davmor2 [n=davmor2@82-47-39-199.cable.ubr04.wolv.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:15 heno hi davmor2! 06:15 bdmurray Well, that'd be cool. 06:15 stgraber davmor2: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam 06:15 davmor2 Hi 06:16 heno sorry, this first meeting has been poorly announced 06:16 zul oh helllo 06:16 heno davmor2: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam 06:16 davmor2 :) 06:18 davmor2 where we up to? 06:18 heno wrapping up point two; 06:19 heno if anyone has suggestions for UDS topics, please email them to me by tomorrow 06:19 stgraber heno: IIRC I started a spec about the Tracker a while ago and even proposed it for Boston, maybe you'd like to have a look at it to update or delete it (if too much out of date) 06:19 heno (there will also be the opportunity to suggest topics at UDS but these are not guaranteed a slot) 06:20 heno stgraber: will do, I'm sure it can be adjusted to suit where we are at now 06:21 davmor2 will the topics selected be made available any where? 06:22 heno davmor2: Matt, Colin and Scott will have a manual scheduling session on monday in London and will post the results of that 06:23 davmor2 okay cool 06:23 heno (using sticky notes and lots of floor space I suspect) 06:23 heno Topic #3 RC bugs 06:23 heno https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-7.10-rc 06:23 heno is the link 06:24 bdmurray I hate the format of that list 06:24 heno the release team is on top of this I believe, but we may/should have some input 06:24 heno yeah 06:25 heno bdmurray: anything come up in your study of iso-testing bugs? 06:25 bdmurray No, nothing new other than that printing bug that Till is on top of 06:26 heno Ok, I'll start working through the list as well as one of my next items 06:27 heno we should look at the completely untriaged bugs there especially 06:27 bdmurray I believe the kernel freeze is tomorrow so I'll be focusing on those 06:27 heno some have no priority setting === ian_brasil is now known as ian_brasil_lunch 06:27 heno ok, cool 06:28 heno should we try to test for recently fixed bugs during next weeks ISO testing? 06:29 heno what's an easy way to produce a list of the previously milestoned, now fixed bugs? 06:29 bdmurray Yeah, that is what I was trying to say in one of my e-mails. 06:29 heno the list may quickly become too long for manual testing 06:30 bdmurray Or similar to what I was mentioning, I'll see if I can whip a query 06:30 bdmurray whip up even 06:31 davmor2 one way maybe to have the manual testers select bugs in a similar fashion as the y do iso's 06:32 heno I guess these things should be folded into the test cases, but we don't really want to change those at every milestone either 06:32 bdmurray Maybe test cases for specific bug numbers? 06:32 heno could we pick out top 10 such bugs perhaps? 06:33 bdmurray That can be added and removed to the general cases 06:33 heno you shouldn't need to confirm that it's fixed on every single ISO though 06:33 heno like your LiveCD hibernate example 06:34 heno testing it on one should be enough 06:34 bdmurray True === ytojack [n=ytojack@218.16.186.45] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] 06:35 heno we could make it a separate 'test case' 06:35 heno or a wiki page with a table to check off 06:35 heno (going low-tech again) 06:35 davmor2 could the list not become interactive? ie the ability to tick box for pass fail? 06:36 heno I agree, though it's probably too late for Gutsy for that 06:37 heno I suggest we add this to a Hardy spec, and perhaps make an informal effort for Gutsy 06:37 davmor2 heno if that is the case then could we not use the irc channel for it? 06:38 heno bdmurray, pedro_: can you propose a few bug #s we should verify? 06:38 pedro_ heno, sure will do it 06:38 heno davmor2: combined with a list somewhere, sure 06:38 bdmurray sure, where shall we put them? in the Testing name space? 06:39 heno Testing/FixesToVerify ? 06:40 davmor2 heno: where ever it is make sure it is announced other wise it won't get used 06:41 bdmurray heno: That works for me 06:41 heno good point. let's add a few items and then ask the distro team to contribute more 06:41 pedro_ ok 06:42 heno Topic #4: QA team wiki pages 06:43 heno there is some name space confusion between the ubuntu-qa LP team and the more general bugsquad+testing = QA team 06:43 heno is that a problem? 06:43 liw as a newbie I'll testify that I'm confused :) === stgraber is back on-line, was having dinner 06:43 davmor2 what's the difference between ubuntu-qa and qa team? 06:44 heno ubuntu-qa is a restricted Launchpad team, bugsquad with some extra powers 06:44 heno mainly setting the priority of bugs 06:45 heno but at the same time we want to build and active team around general QA in Ubuntu 06:45 heno and the name sort of gives itself 06:45 bdmurray Right, just because you can not set the priority does not mean you are not part of the QA effort 06:45 heno should ubuntu-qa be changed to bugsquad++ ? :) 06:46 davmor2 it may be better for the lp team to lose the qa title then as it has no really reference to QA as it will undoubtedly be a smaller team than testing+bug squuad 06:46 heno or should testing and other QA work be a natural way to apply for the ubuntu-qa LP team? 06:47 bdmurray I'd agree that the ubuntu qa team could use a renaming to avoid confusion but I don't have a good idea of to what 06:47 heno how diruptive is changing the name of that well-established LP team though? 06:48 davmor2 heno how big is the team? 06:48 liw I'd assume it'd be less disruptive than continually having to explain things, since it's a one-time change 06:48 heno hm, yeah 06:48 heno davmor2: 50-60? 06:48 bdmurray I think there is a lot of documentation that talks about the QA name though 06:49 heno but it also has core-dev and motu as indirect members 06:49 liw bdmurray, true, but it should mostly be in the wiki and searchable, surely? 06:49 davmor2 heno how big is testing + bug squad? 06:49 heno not sure if that causes a problem 06:50 bdmurray liw: right for the most part. I think kiko's recent bug status write-up mentioned the QA name specifically though 06:50 heno bugsquad is 837 :) === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ian_brasil_lunch is now known as ian_brasil 06:50 bdmurray I still think it is a good idea though 06:51 heno we probably need to raise this for discussion on the bugsquad and devel-discuss lists 06:51 davmor2 how are you going to umbrella the qa team? If it will be QA testing QA bug squad then could the lp team not just be added to the bug squad side of things? 06:53 davmor2 That wat everything would fall under the QATeam umbrella 06:53 heno the current ubuntu-qa LP team is restricted with good reason 06:53 heno so that would need to be maintained 06:53 heno however we do it 06:53 davmor2 but it would still remain restricted 06:54 heno currently we don't have an Ubuntu QA Team LP team 06:54 heno we may not need one either 06:55 heno anyway let's leave the wiki pages as they are for now and raise this on the lists 06:56 heno I'm sure many people will want to have a say in this :) 06:56 bdmurray I think we should have a suggestion for an alternative name before opening the discussion 06:56 bdmurray The name for the team that sets bug priority 06:56 heno that would help, I agree 06:56 davmor2 I'm with bdmurray 06:57 heno ubuntu-triage, ubuntu-bugexperts ... === j_ack [n=j_ack@80.141.137.45] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 06:57 liw BugSetters? BugPriors? 06:57 davmor2 ubuntu-bugcontrol 06:57 bdmurray Setting the priority almost seems like project management 06:58 liw ubuntu-bugcontrol sounds good to me, actually 06:58 davmor2 heno not triage it would clash with bug squad I think 07:00 heno what is similar but higher level than 'squad', troop, legion ... ? 07:00 pedro_ ubuntu-bugpriory is cool but probably not good 07:00 pedro_ like the priory of sion 07:00 davmor2 battalion 07:00 liw general? captain? 07:00 bdmurray come on now 07:00 heno buglords (like time lords) 07:01 liw ubuntu-bugtweakers? 07:01 bdmurray A squad is group of troops, a smaller group than a squad would be a fireteam 07:01 bdmurray A larger group would be a platoon 07:01 davmor2 army :D 07:01 heno that's getting to martial though 07:01 pedro_ bdmurray: haha that sounds funny is spanish :-P 07:01 heno but it *is* smaller 07:02 bdmurray fuego what? 07:02 liw we might want to avoid giving it a "glamorous" name, lest people get jealous and want to join just for the name 07:02 pedro_ bdmurray, the platoon 07:05 liw the suggestions have dried up 07:07 heno shall we start with an email to the bugsquad list? 07:07 davmor2 indeed :) 07:07 pedro_ yes please 07:07 liw that sounds good to me, but I am new and confused 07:07 heno volunteers to write that? 07:08 heno I think I have nearly every other action item so far :) 07:09 liw it's unsporting of me, but since I'm confused about what's what, I'd like to dodge this one 07:09 heno pedro_: ? 07:09 pedro_ i'll do it 07:10 heno thanks! 07:10 heno Topic #5: Agree upon a method for communicating high profile or well known bug reports amongst each other. It should be something that developers can add bug reports that they are working on too. 07:10 heno bdmurray: would a tag work for this? 07:10 bdmurray I brought that up because I spent a fair bit of time tracking down a printing issue I had only to discover that it was bug that was _known_ 07:10 bdmurray and being worked on === asac [n=asac@debian/developer/asac] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:11 heno perhaps combine it with a bughelper query placed on some page 07:11 heno just know as a bug or known as a very common issue? 07:11 bdmurray I think it will overlap with the milestoned bugs list a fair bit 07:12 heno affecting lots of printers or just one model? 07:12 bdmurray I think all hps 07:13 heno it should have a lower threshold and be less time-related than milestones though 07:13 davmor2 I think that the bugsquad tagging is useful 07:13 heno would tags be abused eventually? 07:13 davmor2 Why? 07:13 heno if it gets known as the tag to use to get your bug looked at 07:14 davmor2 heno: how is the tag added then? 07:14 stgraber is there a way to know who set a tag ? 07:14 heno anyone can add one 07:14 heno not sure 07:14 bdmurray I don't like that tagging idea as it requires people to do work 07:15 bdmurray Reading e-mail seems like less work than searching launchpad 07:15 bdmurray So mailing the bugsquad - "Hey I'm working on bug 12345 and it is important" seems the most useful to me 07:15 ubotu Launchpad bug 12345 in isdnutils "isdn does not work, fritz avm (pnp?)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/12345 07:15 heno right but tagging seems a good way to ID them 07:15 bdmurray Then bugsquad readers, or us, could tag and add them to a wiki page 07:16 heno we could then set up a bughelper script to send a digest of all bugs where that tag was added this week 07:17 bdmurray Then once those bugs were fixed they might move to the ISO test watching bugs 07:17 heno bdmurray: who would send those emails, developers? 07:19 bdmurray I'm not following regarding who 07:19 heno the "Hey I'm working on bug 12345 and it is important" emails would be sent by developers working on a fix? 07:19 ubotu Launchpad bug 12345 in isdnutils "isdn does not work, fritz avm (pnp?)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/12345 07:20 heno is that what you mean by _known_ basically? 07:20 bdmurray What I mean by known is one that has already been reported and is large enough in scope that multiple people will encounter it 07:21 heno perhaps a bot should listen for bugs being discussed in #ubuntu-devel 07:21 heno bdmurray: but isn't that potentially a very large number? 07:21 heno (of bugs) 07:22 bdmurray Perhaps 07:22 heno what about suggestion devs use 'In progress' for this? 07:23 pedro_ already sent the mail to the bugsquad list [https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-bugsquad/2007-October/000636.html] 07:24 heno bdmurray: you you think that setting a tag is more work than sending the email? 07:24 heno with tags, we could collect the bugs in a digest 07:24 bdmurray No, I think finding tagged bugs is more work 07:24 heno be we can improve that for a specific tag 07:25 heno with a web page and/or email digest generated 07:25 heno *but we can === rexy_ [n=rexy@s5591754c.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-meeting 07:26 bdmurray Added the tag is probably the least amount of work so maybe we should start off with that and see what we have 07:26 bdmurray s/Added/Adding 07:26 heno ok, sounds good 07:27 heno suggestions for a tag name? 07:28 heno none yet, ok 07:28 bdmurray I wonder if the existing meta-bug tag includes what we are atlking about 07:29 heno meta-bug tag? 07:29 bdmurray Well, it is metabug 07:29 bdmurray Currently used for bugs with a high probability of duplicates 07:30 heno oic === ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:ubotu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 05 Oct 20:00 UTC: MOTU | 06 Oct 17:00 UTC: Xubuntu Developers | 10 Oct 12:00 UTC: Forum Council | 10 Oct 16:00 UTC: QA Team | 11 Oct 15:00 UTC: Community Development Team | 16 Oct 16:00 UTC: Kernel Team 07:31 heno right lrt's look at what's in there already, and perhaps promote its use more 07:31 heno let's wrap up this meeting now though, we've been 1.5 hrs 07:32 heno thanks everyone for attending!
MeetingLogs/QATeam/20071003 (last edited 2008-08-06 17:01:43 by localhost)