Ubuntu Wiki

19:06 < Flannel> Alright, welcome everyone to tonight's meeting. You can view our agenda tonight here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/09October04 We'll start out with a few announcements, and then discuss our jam. If anyone has anything to add to the agenda (that's quick, or urgent) feel free to do so at any time throughout the meeting
19:06 < Flannel> Anyone have anything right now?
19:06 < Yasumoto_> hiya
19:07 < Flannel> Yasumoto_: nice announcement :P
19:07 < Yasumoto> :)
19:07 < Flannel> Alright, so, in case you haven't already heard, the rescheduled loco meeting was a week and a half ago, and we are now an approved LoCo team.
19:08 < rww> \o/
19:08 < jbermudes> yay!
19:08 < Grantbow_> Congratulations everyone, great work.
19:08 < seidos> huzzah!
19:08 < MarkDude> we made it
19:08 < nhaines> Being an approved team means we've been doing good work, and now we just have to keep it up.
19:09 < Flannel> Approval of course, isn't an endpoint... yeah, what nhaines said.
19:09 < Flannel> But we do all deserve to pat ourselves on the back.
19:09 < Grantbow_> +1
19:10 < Flannel> Next, I believe rww is going to tell us all about the monthly team reports,
19:10 *** Flannel nudges rww.
19:10 < rww> Every month, Ubuntu teams provide short monthly reports of what they've been working on, and they're all compiled into one big report through wiki magic at the end of the month (e.g. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports/September2009 ).
19:10 *** rww steals Flannel's ending comma
19:11 < rww> Our shiny new report homepage is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/TeamReports . Right now, it's showing the September report, because that's the one in progress (it's due to be finished today, actually).
19:11 < Flannel> rww: Today? or the 22nd?
19:12 < rww> Flannel: I thought the 22nd, but I just read "the first Sunday after the end of the month" a few minutes ago.
19:12 < seidos> reports, i love reports!
19:12 < Flannel> rww: Interesting. Where was that? There's obviously a conflict of the TR docs
19:12 < MarkDude> no conflicts - please <:)
19:13 < rww> Flannel: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BuildingCommunity/TeamReporting has the 22nd, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BuildingCommunity/TeamReporting/HowTo says sunday
19:13 < Grantbow_> it would be nice to link to the instructions from our page
19:13 < rww> I figured it means "get it done by the 22nd, but they're actually due by the Sunday"
19:13 < rww> Grantbow_: yeah, the page right now is copypasted from the setup guide, it could do with some edits (having two titles is also not ideal)
19:13 < Flannel> rww: that makes more sense. Otherwise stuff you do at the end of the month gets lost.
19:14 *** rww nods
19:14 *** Grantbow_ nods
19:14 < rww> So yeah, the process for making a new page is actually pretty simple:
19:14 < rww> 1. Create https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports/09/MONTHNAMEGOESHERE
19:14 < rww> 2. Edit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/TeamReports/Current to
19:14 < rww> point to the new page (this will update the index page).
19:14 < rww> 3. Everyone can then edit the month's page as the month goes on.
19:15 < rww> (and obviously, once 2010 hits, the /09/ turns into /10/. We're screwed in 2100, though.)
19:15 < MarkDude> rww: like y2k
19:15 < seidos> that's a problem for the next generation...
19:16 < seidos> pepsi drinkers
19:16 < MarkDude> hello Larry
19:16 < rww> As far as style goes, I read somewhere that bullet points and not huge long paragraphs are good, so pretty much like the September one is right now.
19:16 < rww> Anyone have any questions about it?
19:16 *** lcafiero sneaks into the back of the room and sits down
19:16 < Flannel> Yeah, try and keep it one sentence or so. If they want more info, they can click and read the page.
19:17 < Flannel> lcafiero: Don't eat the cookies until the end.
19:17 < Flannel> (they being readers)
19:17 < nhaines> lcafiero: yeah, that's when we pass out the antidote.
19:17 < rww> Yeah, linking to project pages is also good. It'll be even better if/when the project pages get upgraded with summaries and pictures, but still ;)
19:18 < MarkDude> who approve project pages? are they 'moderated'?
19:18 < lcafiero> heh
19:18 < seidos> have a question, why are we doing it?
19:19 < Flannel> seidos: Every team does it, so people can find out about all the neat stuff we do.
19:19 < Flannel> every team should do it, anyway.
19:19 < rww> seidos: it's one of those things that Ubuntu teams are supposed to do, so it's one of those "now we're approved, this really needs to start getting done" things.
19:20 < seidos> ah, to log the team's work?
19:20 < Flannel> MarkDude: No, project pages are just the pages we make on the wiki for stuff.
19:21 < MarkDude> flannel: thanks
19:21 < Flannel> seidos: Log, but more importantly to share.
19:21 < Grantbow_> rww has been a meeting summary rock star so it's relatively easy work for us, though I am sure he would appreicate people helping out.
19:21 < seidos> makes sense
19:21 < rww> MarkDude: The only sort of access control for them is that we list them as "Proposed" under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects until discussion and planning takes place.
19:21 < seidos> thanks
19:22 < Flannel> rww: I think he was asking about the project pages themselves, not the "projects" page
19:22 < rww> oic
19:22 < Flannel> Anyone else have questions?
19:23 < rww> Yeah, as far as the Team Reports (and the Meeting summaries, for that matter) go, everyone feel free to work on them, they are by no means an rww monopoly ;P
19:23 < Grantbow_> +1
19:23 < seidos> why did my ravioli just boil over?
19:24 < Flannel> seidos: Because you weren't watching them
19:24 < Flannel> Alright, so our next item is to discuss our global jams yesterday. This is a chance for us to talk about what we've done well, what we did not-so-well, and what we'd like to see happen better/change next time.
19:24 < seidos> :)
19:25 < Flannel> Lets start with the Berkeley one, since that's chronological, I guess.
19:25 < Flannel> Oh also, summary of what happened, etc.
19:25 *** rww is interested in how many people attended, also
19:25 < Grantbow_> It was pretty quiet - Three of us attended - Jack, myself and Eric who I have talked to at LUG meetings.
19:26 < Grantbow_> One thing we will definately do better next time is posting signs.
19:26 < Grantbow_> We talked mostly about marketing for Karmic, some video, some discussion about other ways to contribute like bug reports, testing, etc.
19:27 < Grantbow_> Then Jack who was hosting the meeting had to meet his family for the UC Berkeley vs. USC football game.
19:27 < Flannel> You talked about some video? or watched some video? or what?
19:27 < MarkDude> sexycatsinhats: hello chris
19:27 < Grantbow_> We did watch the Florida video being streamed live, but mostly talked about the state of video and our experiences creating and using video on Ubuntu.
19:27 *** sexycatsinhats runs away from MarkDude
19:28 < Grantbow_> I guess Eric and Jack didn't make it into IRC today - I'll upload a few pictures and Jack has a couple.
19:28 < Grantbow_> any other questions?
19:28 < zareason> hi, this is Christian Einfeldt
19:29 < nhaines> einfeldt: welcome to our meeting, in progress.
19:29 < Grantbow_> on to the Chapman event?
19:29 < einfeldt> hi, this is my first meeting, so I will need to lurk to learn the rules
19:30 < einfeldt> nhaines, thx!
19:30 < Flannel> I suppose I'll summarize Chapman's jam.
19:31 < Flannel> We had eight people show up in total, and wound up going from around 2ish until around 9 or so.
19:32 < Grantbow_> I heard on IRC the door was locked for awhile
19:32 < nhaines> Grantbow_: we broke for dinner.
19:32 < Flannel> We discusesd a few things, power supplies (totally non-ubuntu related, by the way), had a recurring discussion on marketing, had a tutorial about inkscape, talked about Campcaster, and programming.
19:32 < Flannel> Hmm, I think there was one more thing I'm missing.
19:33 < nhaines> Flannel: Lebonese food?
19:33 < jbermudes> some of us played with karmic
19:33 < Flannel> nhaines: I suppose yeah.
19:33 < nhaines> Also I know "lebanese" is spelled with an a!
19:34 < Flannel> nhaines: Although, it certainly wasn't a "college student" budget as advertised.
19:34 < Flannel> seidos: You want to chime in on wht you liked/didn't/etc?
19:34 < seidos> Flannel: where's the spreadsheet?
19:34 < nhaines> Flannel: too true.
19:34 < Flannel> seidos: Uh, it's around somewhere. nhaines will have to replay his video and snag the URL.
19:34 < seidos> here's a link to the spreadsheet: http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tuJFso7DXGT7lCe3Lwc63gw&output=html
19:34 < seidos> I think it looked better on the whiteboard
19:35 < Flannel> seidos: I wasn't sure if sheet1 was complete, so I retyped stuff on sheet2 as well, don't know if you saw that.
19:35 < seidos> loved the inkscape tutorial
19:35 < seidos> it's going to be directly useful to me
19:36 < rww> Didn't end up doing any sort of video-recording streamy web things in SoCal, did you?
19:36 < seidos> oh, and the stickers
19:36 < Flannel> rww: We recorded, but didn't stream
19:36 < Flannel> rww: high def and everything!
19:36 < seidos> also gave a 9.04 cd away to a windows "power user"
19:36 < rww> Flannel: ah. Going to make yourselves Youtube-famous?
19:36 < Flannel> rww: I hope not
19:36 < rww> :(
19:36 < Flannel> rww: perhaps ubuntu-wiki famous though or something.
19:37 < Flannel> Oh, people who attended are fccf, DarkwingDuck, Spartan7, nhaines, Yasumoto, jbermudes, and myself.
19:37 < Flannel> is that eight? yeah.
19:37 < Flannel> Anyone have anything they think could've been improved?
19:38 < rww> Flannel: that's 7
19:38 < Flannel> rww: Hmm, seidos.
19:39 < Flannel> Alright, well, if you attended, are reading these meeting logs, and have things to recommend, feel free to continue to do so.
19:39 < seidos> Flannel: so yeah, appreciated the professional looking ubuntu cd's, first time seeing them
19:39 < Flannel> seidos: The pressed canonical CDs?
19:40 < MarkDude> can we get to the moderation thing yet?
19:40 < Flannel> The chapman event would up having a bit of an unconference feel, which I don't know if I like yet or not.
19:40 < seidos> Flannel: that's what they're called? yes
19:40 < Flannel> seidos: Yeah, those CDs came from shipit.
19:41 < MarkDude> pressed cds: +1
19:41 < sexycatsinhats> pressed cds +1 - best things since sliced bread
19:41 < seidos> Flannel: I liked your cd's, but I couldn't have given that to a professional
19:42 < seidos> Flannel: especially since I don't have any
19:42 < Flannel> seidos: heh
19:42 < Flannel> alright, we seem to have exhausted the jam wrapup for tonight, lets move on to Karmic release stuffs.
19:44 < dragon> we have a loco meeting tonight?
19:44 < nhaines> dragon: you're interrupting it. :)
19:44 < MarkDude> dragon:+1
19:44 < nhaines> dragon: but welcome! :D https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/09October04
19:44 < sexycatsinhats> +1 for meeting
19:45 < dragon> nhaines: lol thanks :)
19:45 < Grantbow_> My last communication with Jesse asking for more details was about a week ago. We should be able to have it at Caffeine like before but the owner has been out of town.
19:45 < Grantbow_> That will be the San Francisco event
19:45 < nhaines> Okay, so for the Karmic release parties, I think we've gotten a pretty good feel for release parties.
19:45 < Grantbow_> lcaffiero can speak about the Felton schedule
19:45 < Grantbow_> Berkeley and Walnut Creek will be smaller events
19:45 < Grantbow_> err, lcafiero
19:46 < Flannel> For the southern california event, some of us were considering doing a joint food-then-installfest thing like we did a few releases ago.
19:47 < Flannel> Last time we did dinner, but I'm wondering if lunch would be better, so we can have the installfest in the afternoon.
19:47 < Grantbow_> Can you call for ideas on the mail list where more people can participate?
19:48 < nhaines> Lunch might be nice after all.
19:48 < rww> Flannel: lunch tends to conflict more often with work or school or whatever, though
19:48 < Flannel> rww: It'd be on a weekend
19:48 < nhaines> rww: we tend to have installfests on weekends.
19:48 < Flannel> or, traditionally
19:48 < rww> some of us work on weekends :(
19:48 < nhaines> rww: :(
19:49 < seidos> Flannel: is the release party going to last as long as the GlobalJam, generally?
19:49 < Grantbow_> I'll ping Eric Hammond about a Santa Monica event
19:49 < Grantbow_> unless someone else would like to
19:49 < Flannel> seidos: I can't imagine it lasting seven hours. Probably two for food, then three or four.
19:49 < lcafiero> oh, sorry
19:49 < Flannel> seidos: I guess that's almost seven hours.
19:50 < lcafiero> Felton: First Saturday of each month
19:50 < seidos> Flannel: i'm just thinking that if it's just long, lunch does seem a better idea
19:50 < Flannel> seidos: But, you're always free to come for one or the other or whatever. Or we could just do a party or an installfest.
19:50 < MarkDude> 4 hours then party
19:50 < lcafiero> So November or December.
19:50 < seidos> Flannel: especially if we can bring the food back with us, and munch while we work
19:50 < seidos> Flannel: *as
19:50 < Flannel> MarkDude: That's an interesting thought. Installfest then dinner.
19:51 < Flannel> Would stop the munching while eating, of course.
19:51 < Grantbow_> lcafiero: great
19:51 < Yasumoto> MarkDude: now we're talking :)
19:51 < abhejit> hi, don't mean to intrude. but i was wondering if we were going to talk about issue/problem resolution procedures
19:51 < MarkDude> walnut creek we'll go out & party in wc
19:51 < MarkDude> abhejit:+1
19:51 < seidos> Flannel: munching while eating?
19:52 < MarkDude> flannel: yes they are similar
19:52 < Flannel> abhejit: I'm not sure we'll have enough time to get through it adequately. But we'll see how long the shirts thing takes.
19:52 < MarkDude> <:)
19:53 < abhejit> k cool, thanks
19:53 < Flannel> Lets move the planning to the ML, since there's some people here from SoCal who aren't here and would probably like to contribute.
19:53 < MarkDude> moderation: +1
19:53 < Grantbow_> shirts thing can stay on the mail list and take no time since Ernest isn't here I don't think.
19:54 < dragon> I agree.
19:54 < Flannel> Shirts doesn't need Ernest actually.
19:54 < Flannel> but if we want to delay that discussion we can do that. People just seemed excited about it on the ML.
19:55 < MarkDude> shirts rock- lets move on to moderation
19:55 *** seidos needs to get on the mailing list
19:55 < MarkDude> flannel: im trying to save you from yourself
19:57 < MarkDude> there are some people calling for te leader to be removed -1 for me at this point
19:57 < nhaines> MarkDude: Do you think it's wise to try to resolve that in the next 3 minutes?
19:57 < MarkDude> they do need the chance to speak though
19:58 < MarkDude> so it' censored then
19:58 < Flannel> We're actually currently talking with other third parties about the issue.
19:58 < Flannel> And I don't want to undermine those discussions by having this discussion here and now.
19:58 < rww> We could always go past 8pm. It's not like the world would explode :\
19:58 < Grantbow_> Flannel: who?
19:58 < Flannel> rww: I agree, the hour limit is silly.
19:58 < Flannel> Grantbow_: What?
19:58 *** rww thinks we need a meeting to decide meeting lengths :P
19:58 < Grantbow_> third parties
19:58 < dragon> Who's staying past 8pm?
19:58 < nhaines> Flannel: he means with whom?
19:58 < MarkDude> rww+1
19:59 < Flannel> Grantbow_: Jono for one.
19:59 < MarkDude> im here till its solved
19:59 < seidos> centralized organization is efficient
19:59 < Flannel> Grantbow_: I'm not sure it's relevant.
19:59 < dragon> Who isn't staying?
19:59 < Flannel> I think rww was suggesting we remove the "1 hour" portion of the meeting entirely.
19:59 < MarkDude> flannel is fine - we just need some regional issues left to regions
20:00 < dragon> I get it. No one's leaving until we're done.
20:00 < Flannel> Grantbow_: If you're not going to support the table, we can just hash it out here, but as I said, I don't think that would be the best course of action.
20:01 < seidos> we should be able to be flexible with meeting times in order to arrive at conclusions
20:01 < Grantbow_> which agenda item are we on? we skipped one? I support tabling #7 if I know who's involved.
20:02 < Flannel> I think #6 is intrinsically linked, I'm not sure we should discuss one without the other.
20:02 < Grantbow_> they are different email threads on the list
20:02 < dragon> Let's start with #6.
20:02 < Flannel> Grantbow_: but, we were skipping 6, because everyone wanted to discuss "moderation", although I'm not sure which agenda item that is.
20:02 < Grantbow_> quite different in my mind
20:03 < Flannel> Grantbow_: I don't feel comfortable discussing 6 without 7. Again, because the discussion in 6 is too easy to veer into 7 accidentally.
20:04 < Grantbow_> Flannel: your answers previously were vague. Are any third parties other than Jono involved so far other than the loco-contacts mail list for #7?
20:05 < Flannel> Grantbow_: What?
20:05 < Flannel> Grantbow_: Yes, there are. I don't think it's necessary to rattle off people who have discussed stuff at this point in time.
20:06 < Flannel> Nor do I see how it's relevant to whether we table.
20:07 < MarkDude> this isn't a vote of 'no confidence' to remove the prime minister - but this is too see if that vote should be discussed, down the road-- my main concern -- "moderated" is the wrong word the term is actually censorship --- flat o
20:08 < MarkDude> ooops -- flat out - i meant
20:08 < Grantbow_> If you don't want to talk about these things then don't.
20:09 < Flannel> Grantbow_: Alright. Since you previously said you'd support the tabling, we'll table it. I'm not sure why you won't do so publically.
20:09 < Grantbow_> If there are no other agenda items...
20:10 < seidos> what item are we currently discussing?
20:10 < dragon> seidos: 6 and 7.
20:10 < MarkDude> censorship
20:10 < Grantbow_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/09October04
20:10 < nhaines> Okay, so if 7 is a dependancy of 6, and we're tabling 7....
20:11 < Grantbow_> 6. Team organization and dispute resolution
20:11 < nhaines> Then I guess we're out of agenda items.
20:11 < Grantbow_> 7. LoCo Contact Forwards
20:11 < Grantbow_> separate items in my mind
20:11 < MarkDude> actually censorship read the logs folks. Sorry flannel
20:12 < Grantbow_> Each of 6 and 7 link to mail list threads
20:12 < seidos> can someone provide an overview of how they're related?
20:12 < Flannel> MarkDude: There's no censorship involved. But again, I don't feel comfortable discussing this with the other things going on.
20:12 < Grantbow_> seidos: good question
20:13 < seidos> censorship?!
20:13 < MarkDude> seidos: yes - limiting of others speech - by definition
20:13 < Flannel> seidos: A discussion of conflict resolution will lead into the handling of recent conflicts.
20:14 < Grantbow_> Flannel: I think that's artificially polarizing it
20:14 < Grantbow_> 6 is about the team structure
20:14 < MarkDude> it can't be a 2 person issue - if only 1 has power
20:15 < seidos> MarkDude: is it okay to yell fire in a theater?
20:15 < Grantbow_> 7 is about particular actions regarding the mail list
20:15 < nhaines> seidos: the 1-minutes summary is that we asked Grant to stop automatically forwarding emails from -loco-contacts a year ago, and attempts to discuss it with him have been ignored. So we're simply moderating -loco-contact forwards. We're sending allowing everything else.
20:15 < MarkDude> until me
20:15 < MarkDude> That's not how it works. Any step you take to improve the diversity of your project will work to increase the developer pool overall.
20:16 < seidos> MarkDude: who are you talking to?
20:16 < nhaines> s/sending//
20:16 < MarkDude> We're not far enough along in our plans for world domination that we can afford to turn anyone away. - quote from skud
20:16 < MarkDude> the whole group
20:16 < seidos> world domination?!
20:16 < Flannel> Alright, we've covered everything, so lets wrap this up. Our next meeting will be in two weeks, October 18th, at 7pm.
20:16 < MarkDude> -1
20:16 < dragon> Done already?
20:17 < Grantbow_> thanks for coming everyone
20:17 < Flannel> Thank you all for coming, I know the next meeting will be exciting.

Ubuntu Wiki

09October04

Sunday, October 4th, 2009, 7:00pm (1900) PDT

Summary

Original Agenda