2010-12-14

Actions from previous meeting

Actions from this meeting

Weekly Summary

  • Do remaining package rebuilds to optimize SVGs and PNGs; now they are as small as they can get (MartinPitt)

  • Finally landed aptdaemon and language-selector GTK3/pygi ports (MartinPitt)

  • Got OO.o to build again for Natty, to fix installability and reduce CD size by 10 MB (MartinPitt)

  • Fix remaining breakage of the Python 2.7 transition; CDs are now installable again
  • gobject-introspection caused brief breakage through a library rename, but all should be settled now (mterry)

  • nm-applet leaks now under control (MathieuTrudel)

  • dbusmenu, libindicate, appindicator updates landed fixing python and GIR issues, required rebuilding of all indicator related packages. (KenVanDine)

  • the GNOME3 updates continued in the ubuntu-desktop ppa
  • the new GTK3 breaks theming, it seems that it's not really possible to port murrine to GTK3 with the new way theming work, see the meeting log for details but it raises the question of what to do with GTK3 this cycle
  • debian is renaming the gir binaries gir1.2- to reflect the abi version, a similar transition will be done as well in natty

Unity

  • New unity release (bamf/nux/unity), add intellihide (not yet activated by default, you can find it in ccsm under autohide). Floating will be deprecated. We have an unity binary now to launch unity from a python script.

  • New compiz snapshot with abi breakage (transition done). Some fixes like session integration or gnome-panel pager applet support (new path)
  • Lot of changes in compiz default settings, like disabling ezoom scrool, add workarounds and snap by default

  • As gconf path changed and new Compiz settings, you should reset your unity configuration. unity --reset is taking care of that for you. Working on making the reset automatic for people right now.

  • gnome-session is now ready to handle the new fallback system and should be on your system. Testing plan of the unity detection module from next nux release (current one has some known segfault issues) for /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test set.

Software Center

  • Cool new feature: "Search Help" - alternate spelling suggestions are now displayed when no results are found for a search

  • Ratings and Reviews

    • Specification is now complete: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter/RatingsAndReviews

    • Ratings and Reviews alpha server deployment in progress, targeted to land next week
    • Client implementation being updated per new server and specification details at lp:~mvo/software-center/reviews

  • Further list view performance improvements

  • "Find it in the menu" disabled for Unity LP: #639701, new solution for finding newly installed apps under Unity currently being designed

  • Software Center 3.1.5 and 3.1.6 released includes search help feature mentioned above, bug fixes and other improvements

X.org

  • -fglrx and -nvidia are now auto-detected by X server and will boot up with no xorg.conf present.

  • Rebuilt wayland packages for Natty; retested installation on two systems (ATI and Intel). (BryceHarrington)

  • Investigated issue where USB drives fail to allow nvidia to install. Turns out when you set 'persistent storage' to max, it doesn't leave space to do kernel installs (initrd update fails). (BryceHarrington)

  • Tested USB and CD installs of alpha-1 on several graphics cards. (BryceHarrington)

  • Tested unity boots against several ATI cards and both -ati and -fglrx. Mostly worked. On ATI Evergreen cards, we need to update to git version of -ati to make it work. (BryceHarrington)

Tools and Processes

IRC log Western edition

17:33:26        pitti   [TOPIC] action review
17:33:34        pitti   first seems obsolete, second done
17:33:43        <--     shiyee (~Shiyee@h195.natout.aau.dk) hat den IRC verlassen (Quit: Ex-Chat)
17:33:45        pitti   [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-14
17:33:53        pitti   for this week's reports
17:34:12        pitti   any non-regular meeting topics from anyone?
17:34:17        seb128  what is obsolete and one?
17:34:19        seb128  done
17:34:29        pitti   seb128: the actions from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-07
17:34:32        -->     mterry (42571695@ubuntu/member/mterry) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:34:42        -->     chrisccoulson (~chr1s@ubuntu/member/chrisccoulson) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:34:46        pitti   jasoncwarner: here by chance? feeling better now?
17:34:47        seb128  pitti, oh ok, I was reading the next meeting agenda
17:34:52        seb128  oh, mterry and chrisccoulson ;-)
17:35:01        mterry  hihi
17:35:12        pitti   chrisccoulson, mterry: hello
17:35:13        chrisccoulson   breaking unity before desktop meeting = not good :)
17:35:31        pitti   so, nobody else had some news for last week? the weekly status is quite short this time
17:35:34        seb128  chrisccoulson, -before desktop meeting
17:35:43        ricotz  seb128, is it possible to get access to the gnome3 ppa?
17:35:45        chrisccoulson   ;)
17:36:05        pitti   [TOPIC] partner update
17:36:06        pitti   kenvandine: 
17:36:11        kenvandine      yup
17:36:13        seb128  pitti, nothing fancy, standard updates and bug cleaning...
17:36:25        seb128  ricotz, let's discuss that after the meeting
17:36:33        pitti   seb128: (I just feel bad about owning this section)
17:36:33        kenvandine      DX:
17:36:48        seb128  ricotz, but basically not easily right now the team gives access to ubuntu upload as well, but you can do merge requests we review them often
17:36:58        seb128  pitti, I will add some ;-)
17:37:08        kenvandine      dbusmenu, appindicator and libindicate fixes for GI and python are in which required a rebuild of the whole indicator stack
17:37:14        kenvandine      hopefully the fallout is over from that
17:37:20        -->     ia_ (~ia@89.169.161.244) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:37:22        kenvandine      the port to gdbus is stuck
17:37:27        pitti   kenvandine: is that the reason for all the crashes?
17:37:36        kenvandine      pitti, apparently :)
17:37:42        kenvandine      are they still happening?
17:37:49        pitti   (it still crashes for me, dist-upgrade from an hour ago)
17:37:55        kenvandine      humm
17:37:59        pitti   but anyway, off-meeting topic
17:38:05        kenvandine      ping me after please
17:38:09        pitti   kenvandine: stuck> anythign blocking from our side?
17:38:14        kenvandine      no...
17:38:18        kenvandine      tedg on vacation
17:38:26        kenvandine      dbusmenu and appindicator are ported
17:38:27        pitti   ah, holiday-stuck
17:38:28        kenvandine      and in a ppa
17:38:29        kenvandine      but
17:38:38        kenvandine      can't be used until appmenu-gtk is ported to gdbus
17:38:49        seb128  pitti, define crash
17:39:05        seb128  pitti, do you still run a gnome-panel and get applets crashing on login?
17:39:11        pitti   seb128: tons of "indicator-blah crashed [Reload] [Remove]" dialogs at session start
17:39:14        seb128  pitti, if that's the case that's a known compiz bug
17:39:26        seb128  compiz bug then
17:39:26        pitti   seb128: yes, I run g-p
17:39:40        seb128  smspillaz and didrocks know about it
17:39:47        <--     ejfneo (~sandre@LLagny-156-36-52-123.w217-128.abo.wanadoo.fr) hat den IRC verlassen (Quit: leaving)
17:39:49        pitti   kenvandine: sorry for keepign interrupting you
17:39:49        seb128  it's being worked but non trivial to fix it seems
17:39:55        seb128  yeah sorry kenvandine
17:39:59        pitti   seb128: thanks for heads-up
17:39:59        didrocks        compiz is agressive at reparenting
17:40:04        kenvandine      don't have much for U1, the have the control panel in NEW
17:40:11        kenvandine      that is all i have
17:40:24        seb128  didn't I new that last week?
17:40:25        pitti   kenvandine: thanks; can you please add some notes to teh report page, too? that was quite interesting
17:40:27        seb128  or is it binNEW now?
17:40:33        <--     coffeedude (~CoffeDude@71-12-192-77.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com) hat den IRC verlassen (Quit: Ex-Chat)
17:40:33        kenvandine      sure
17:40:43        kenvandine      i think sourceNEW
17:41:05        pitti   UNity and Software-Center reports are on the wiki page
17:41:10        kenvandine      i'll check and ping you
17:41:15        pitti   do you guys think we should paste them here again, or do you prefer reading it there?
17:41:38        didrocks        I'll just add once the lock is away " Working on making the reset automatic for people right now."
17:41:46        didrocks        otherwise, it's on the wiki :)
17:42:10        didrocks        kenvandine: you expired, can I paste?
17:42:16        kenvandine      didrocks, done
17:42:30        pitti   didrocks: that's just an issue for intra-natty upgrades, I suppose? (but nice to hear anyway)
17:42:55        didrocks        pitti: yeah, it's just intra natty
17:43:10        didrocks        in fact, doing that properly isn't easy with the gconf compiz backend
17:43:23        didrocks        still experimenting to get the easiest solution…
17:43:33        pitti   didrocks: temporary autostart .desktop?
17:43:43        didrocks        pitti: will be started after compiz
17:44:22        seb128  not if you put it in the init section?
17:44:23        didrocks        a script can have race issue and putting that in compiz.desktop to wrap compiz isn't nice for crasher and such
17:44:31        didrocks        I try setting a new gconf default key
17:44:51        seb128  didrocks, change the exec line to "unity --reset; compiz"?
17:44:53        didrocks        seb128: hum? in the init phase, yeah, hackish but will work
17:45:09        didrocks        (won't be unity --reset as it starts it, but yeah)
17:45:25        didrocks        seb128: yeah, that can work
17:45:31        -->     and471_ (~and471@host86-166-67-8.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:45:45        didrocks        wrapping is definitively not the solution and setting a default neither
17:45:49        <--     and471 (~and471@host86-166-67-8.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) hat den IRC verlassen (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
17:45:50        didrocks        will change the .desktop file then
17:46:03        pitti   aaanyway, OT for meeting again
17:46:07        pitti   (sorry)
17:46:25        pitti   tremolux: do you want to bring up anything extra for software-center?
17:46:46        tremolux        pitti: nope, not unless somebody has questions
17:47:21        tremolux        the new search help feature from mvo is cool  :)
17:47:22        pitti   @all: any questions or other meeting topics? otherwise we can call this done, and let didrocks and seb128 continue to discuss unity stuff :)
17:47:41        seb128  pitti, sort of meeting related but what did you make use gtk3 yet?
17:47:55        pitti   seb128: language-selector, aptdaemon, and apport
17:48:00        Riddell pitti: Kubuntu update?
17:48:08        pitti   they currently look ugly, apparently we recently dropped the GTK3 theme handling or so
17:48:16        pitti   Riddell: argh, sorry; I'll fix the meeting template
17:48:18        pitti   Riddell: please go ahead
17:48:29        Riddell  * KDE SC 4.6 Beta 2 all in, working well
17:48:29        Riddell  * Kontact 4.6 Beta 2 in PPA only, more testing to be done before decision is made (testing plan has been made with Kolabsys)
17:48:32        Riddell  * New Digikam and Kipi plugins in
17:48:35        Riddell  * Bugfixes to dbusmenu-qt
17:48:37        Riddell  * New phonon-backend-vlc in, still more buggy than gstreamer, which is more buggy than xine
17:48:40        Riddell  * ARM compiles going well, mostly caught up for KDE packages.  Fixing ongoing for KOffice, KTorrent, kdenetwork
17:48:59        pitti   Riddell: oh, the video backends seem to change every week now?
17:49:10        Riddell pitti: not it's still gstreamer
17:49:14        Riddell by default
17:49:21        Riddell we just have other options available too
17:49:27        pitti   indeed, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/natty_probs.html looks much better now, congrats for workign that out
17:49:27        Riddell s/not/no/
17:49:31        -->     dbarth (~dbarth@81-65-157-127.rev.numericable.fr) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:49:50        pitti   Riddell: btw, I remembered that beta2 was supposed to fix interactions with upower for suspend/hibernate; does that work now, or does this still require debugging?
17:50:21        Riddell hmm, good question, I still have hal installed, I need to check how it works with hal not installed
17:50:30        Riddell I'll test and get back to you
17:50:55        pitti   Riddell: cool, thanks
17:51:10        pitti   I think we stopped debugging that on the ubuntu side as it was said to be fixed upstream
17:51:18        pitti   any other business?
17:51:27        seb128  gtk3? ;-)
17:51:31        -->     gnomefreak (~gnomefrea@ubuntu/member/gnomefreak) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:51:39        seb128  sorry to bring that back, but upstream basically changed how gtk theming works
17:51:45        seb128  dropping the old gtk2 way
17:51:55        seb128  they use some css theming now
17:52:06        seb128  Cimi says it's not really possible to port murrine to that
17:52:17        kenvandine      ugh
17:52:22        seb128  there is no way to get a pointer on the widgets from the theme anymore
17:52:32        seb128  so basically we will need a new theme
17:52:46        pitti   seb128: doesn't upstream gnome have a reasonable GTK3ish theme?
17:52:54        seb128  since we have almost no gtk3 rdepends yet I'm wondering if we should stay put for now
17:53:03        seb128  pitti, they do
17:53:12        seb128  but we don't want gtk2 applications to look ubuntu
17:53:19        -->     ubot2 (~ubot2@unaffiliated/jpds/bot/ubot2) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:53:22        -->     Tm_Tr (tm_travolt@xob.kapsi.fi) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:53:23        <--     Tm_Tr (tm_travolt@xob.kapsi.fi) hat den IRC verlassen (Changing host)
17:53:23        -->     Tm_Tr (tm_travolt@ubuntu/member/kde.developer/jkekkonen) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:53:28        seb128  with gtk3 ones being totally different
17:54:04        -->     dbarth_ (~dbarth@81-65-157-127.rev.numericable.fr) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:54:06        didrocks        how many gtk3 app do we have for now?
17:54:10        seb128  well since it seems we will not go for GNOME3 by default
17:54:11        <--     dbarth (~dbarth@81-65-157-127.rev.numericable.fr) hat den IRC verlassen (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
17:54:12        didrocks        apport/jockey?
17:54:20        pitti   seb128: so does that mean you want me to revert to the pygtk2 versions? or want me to package a theme?
17:54:21        seb128  didrocks, I asked just before the kubuntu update
17:54:26        seb128  language-selector and apport basically
17:54:27        pitti   seb128: I just wonder why it still worked like a week ago
17:54:34        -->     c_korn (~korn@p57A6ADF9.dip.t-dialin.net) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:54:39        pitti   didrocks: jockey is still in a branch, blocked on appindicator
17:54:40        mterry  deja dup will be gtk3 :)
17:54:47        pitti   seb128: aptdaemon, too
17:54:50        seb128  pitti, it worked a week ago because the css theming landed in gtk .6
17:54:52        seb128  last week
17:54:54        pitti   ah
17:55:00        -->     gabaug1 (~gabaug@adsl-99-162-201-124.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:55:19        seb128  pitti, well as said before there is no theme to package
17:55:24        seb128  Cimi tried to port murrine
17:55:30        seb128  he says that's not possible
17:55:35        seb128  it will be easier to write a new theme
17:55:39        ricotz  the official adwaita theme for gtk3 is available in gnome-themes-standard
17:55:46        --      zyga-food ist nun als zyga-waiting-for bekannt
17:55:59        seb128  ricotz, thanks but we don't want to change our theme ;-)
17:56:06        seb128  we want something which is similar to what we have still
17:56:27        <--     gabaug (~gabaug@opensuse/member/gabrielburt) hat den IRC verlassen (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
17:56:31        -->     jpds (~jpds@ubuntu/member/jpds) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:56:33        seb128  pitti, I would suggest we sort that at the sprint
17:56:37        ricotz  yeah, but this could be a base for creating the ubuntu theme
17:56:43        seb128  but until now maybe stop adding extra gtk3 use in natty
17:57:07        seb128  ricotz, thanks, I think Cimi knows how to do a theme, it's just that he can't get one similar to our gtk2 one
17:57:32        seb128  the new theming way is limited compared to what murrine is doing for some things
17:57:40        pitti   seb128: ok
17:57:55        pitti   seb128: although I guess any theme will look better than the current state
17:57:57        <--     didrocks (~didrocks@lns-bzn-44-82-249-204-236.adsl.proxad.net) hat den IRC verlassen (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2)
17:57:58        seb128  in any case we will need an ubuntu theme on gtk3
17:58:02        seb128  would it be only for the GNOME3 ppa
17:58:07        pitti   seb128: we could even tweak it a bit to look more similar
17:58:24        -->     didrocks (~didrocks@lns-bzn-44-82-249-204-236.adsl.proxad.net) ist in den Channel #ubuntu-desktop gekommen
17:58:38        seb128  pitti, I can see people who will not take "similar" as an option
17:58:49        pitti   heh, yes
17:58:56        seb128  like people who care about each pixel and will want every application in our default desktop to look right
17:58:59        seb128  not "similar" ;-)
17:59:10        seb128  anyway we will not sort that today
17:59:17        seb128  I just wanted to raise it as an issue
17:59:26        pitti   thanks for bringing it up
17:59:28        pitti   at least I know the reason now
17:59:47        pitti   [TOPIC] AOB}
17:59:48        pitti   ?
17:59:55        seb128  thanks everybody ;-)
17:59:58        pitti   thanks everyone

IRC log Eastern edition

(08:33:39 AM) jasoncwarner: morning TheMuso: bryceh: 
(08:34:10 AM) TheMuso: Hey jasoncwarner.
(08:34:15 AM) jasoncwarner: robert_ancell might not be here for meeting
(08:34:18 AM) TheMuso: jasoncwarner: Sorry to hear that you aren't 100%.
(08:34:19 AM) jasoncwarner: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-14
(08:34:37 AM) cyphermox: jasoncwarner, feeling better now?
(08:34:41 AM) ara left the room (quit: Quit: Ex-Chat).
(08:35:15 AM) jasoncwarner: TheMuso: thanks...feeling a bit better now. hope to rest some more the rest of the day ....
(08:35:29 AM) jasoncwarner: cyphermox: getting there! slept more than usual, and that always helps :)
(08:35:37 AM) cyphermox: jasoncwarner, +1 on that
(08:35:55 AM) TheMuso: Hrm we do not have a RAOF.
(08:35:55 AM) cyphermox: gf wanted us to get up at 5 am to take the train to work :/
(08:36:07 AM) jasoncwarner: bryceh: TheMuso want to get started and see if RAOF joins us? 
(08:36:16 AM) TheMuso: Sure.
(08:36:16 AM) jasoncwarner: cyphermox: ugh! 
(08:36:29 AM) jasoncwarner: [TOPIC] X Update
(08:39:20 AM) jasoncwarner: bryceh: can you update on X (RAOF is on holiday)
(08:39:33 AM) bryceh: oh hey
(08:39:43 AM) bryceh: sorry was troubleshooting login problems with IS
(08:39:46 AM) TheMuso: ah make sense
(08:39:52 AM) bryceh: a few X items of note
(08:40:12 AM) bryceh: we've made xserver finally able to automatically configure -fglrx and -nvidia
(08:40:19 AM) TheMuso: Nice.
(08:40:22 AM) bryceh: so now if you have either driver installed you can boot with no xorg.conf
(08:41:00 AM) jasoncwarner: awesome. 
(08:41:00 AM) bryceh: we've been troubleshooting a bug with usb drives where if you set your persistent storage to maximum or near-max, it doesn't leave enough space on the drive to update initrd
(08:41:24 AM) bryceh: so that means if you try installing -nvidia or other kernel drivers, it'll make the drive unbootable or fail in other weird ways
(08:41:52 AM) bryceh: seems to be a usb-creator usability issue, or perhaps something jockey needs to detect better.
(08:42:49 AM) bryceh: beyond that I've been mostly doing testing of wayland and unity on various graphics cards, and doing bug work on X bugs reported against natty
(08:43:07 AM) bryceh: ( http://www.bryceharrington.org/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-natty-workqueue.svg )
(08:43:14 AM) jasoncwarner: ok...I'll grab you after this about something on wayland :)
(08:43:38 AM) bryceh: we're still finding it pretty effective to use this workqueue approach to stay on top of things
(08:43:49 AM) jasoncwarner: ok.. TheMuso, anything you wanted to comment on? 
(08:43:58 AM) mpt left the room (quit: Quit: Ex-Chat).
(08:44:47 AM) TheMuso: Not really, have hit a snag with unity and panel accessibiliity enablement, have asked DX for help, but haven't heard anything yet. I forgot to CC gary with my initial message, so will bounce him a copy of the email shortly.
(08:45:11 AM) jasoncwarner: ok
(08:45:16 AM) jasoncwarner: yeah, check with gary as well. 
(08:45:18 AM) bryceh: RAOF is off on vacation for the next few days btw and out of town so I don't anticipate him showing up online
(08:45:35 AM) jasoncwarner: bryceh: thanks
(08:45:50 AM) jasoncwarner: speaking of that, bryceh TheMuso are you guys here next week or are you on holiday? 
(08:46:02 AM) ***TheMuso is on holiday from tomorrow through to the end of the year.
(08:46:37 AM) bryceh: jasoncwarner, I'm here, although I have +1 unrequested holiday day I need to schedule
(08:47:04 AM) bryceh: also, I think I'm coming down with a cold (both wife and son have been sick the last few days, I think I'm succumbing) so might be out a day or two this week
(08:47:20 AM) ***bryceh takes some echinecea
(08:47:48 AM) jasoncwarner: bryceh: run!
(08:47:56 AM) jasoncwarner: I think I got mine b/c son is in new daycare in new country
(08:48:00 AM) jasoncwarner: stupid new germs
(08:48:13 AM) bryceh: yep, daycare seems to be a germ breeding ground
(08:48:45 AM) jasoncwarner: I'm not sure it makes sense to have a meeting next week, but I'll let everyone know. This might be last meeting of year. 
(08:48:56 AM) bryceh: I've got a few alpha-2/3 tasks I want to try to do while things are quiet next week, and also have a couple leftover tasks from my launchpad rotation I've been procrastinating that I'd like to finalize
(08:49:18 AM) bryceh: and beyond that just continue holding down the bugs fort and keep the graph flat :-)
(08:49:45 AM) bryceh: btw, speaking of bugs and unity...
(08:49:49 AM) jasoncwarner: :)
(08:50:13 AM) bryceh: is it worthwhile to report bugs I find, or should we wait until after the next code drop and/or next year?
(08:50:44 AM) bryceh: I think most of the issues I've seen must already be known
(08:51:02 AM) jasoncwarner: I would say check with didrocks, but he is without internet for a couple of days
(08:51:07 AM) jasoncwarner: check with seb, perhaps. 
(08:51:16 AM) bryceh: alright
(08:51:28 AM) jasoncwarner: I would error on telling someone so we know about the bu rather than not reporting it only b/c we don't want to be surprised later
(08:51:40 AM) ukev [~ukev@2001:638:204:10:21f:d0ff:fe8f:1319] entered the room.
(08:52:02 AM) ricotz left the room (quit: Quit: Ex-Chat).
(08:52:26 AM) jasoncwarner: Ok, sounds like we are done
(08:52:37 AM) jasoncwarner: anything else before I call it? 
(08:52:52 AM) bryceh: not from I
(08:52:59 AM) jasoncwarner: [END MEETING]

DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-14 (last edited 2010-12-15 07:14:40 by thewar5)