This is the 19th meeting of the ServerTeam, starting at 21:01 UTC and finishing at 22:01 UTC
Items we will be discussing:
- Review ACTION points from previous meeting.
Reporting / role of the meeting - MathiasGug
Mentoring program - MathiasGug
- Bacula ? - ivoks
- Server Survey - nijaba
Review each section of the ServerTeam/Roadmap.
- Agree on next meeting date and time.
Reporting / role of the irc meeting
mathiaz noticed that the weekly irc meetings were lasting more than one hour in the last few weeks. Status reporting was identified as being the most time consuming part of the meetings. mathiaz added that the reason he was asking for these reports was to prepare the monthly team report and keep track of new features implemented by the ServerTeam.
A new proposal for status reporting has been put forward: the Agenda wiki page will be modified to include sections for each task on the Roadmap. Each section should be filled by the assignee before the meeting. The Agenda will be mailed as part of the meeting announcement.
ACTION: mathiaz to coordinate status reporting via a wiki page.
mathiaz refined his idea about the mentoring program. He'd like to have a lightweight program that would just help users to do their first contribution to Ubuntu - more a guidance than a mentoring program. He asked how this program could be named.
ACTION: mathiaz to send a proposal to ubuntu-server about the mentoring program.
ivoks removed a lot of the universe dependencies from the bacula package. The remaining one is sqlite/sqlite3, which should be moved to main soon. mathiaz suggested to ask the MOTU release team for a FF exception or at least review the changes made in order to make sure that the bacula upload to universe isn't against FF.
ACTION: ivoks will get in touch with the MOTU release team to get an FF exception before uploading bacula to universe.
nijaba and faulkes- have been working on defining a survey for Ubuntu Server users. nijaba explained that he has a test setup of LimeSurvey . He is looking for testers. Anyone interested in helping out can contact him by email .
He is also in discussion with newz2000 to find where and how the survey web application can be deployed in production.
faulkes- added a sticky post  to the Server forum.
Ubuntu Server Guide on default install
nijaba and sommer raised the question of installing the server guide by default on a server install. The main issue is that there isn't a seed specific to ubuntu-server. Thus installing the server guide would require the creation of new seed, which is technically feasible but needs to be thought through.
zul said that ebox is in a much better packaging state and is getting closer to being uploaded to universe.
Ubuntu Developer Week
mathiaz reminded that this week is the Ubuntu Developer Week . soren gave a great overview of virtualization in hardy. There are more sessions scheduled until friday.
Agree on next meeting date and time
Next meeting will be on Wednesday, February 27th at 21:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting.
- before its mention
Started logging meeting in #ubuntu-meeting [21:01:28] * nealmcb waves [21:01:42] * nijaba waves [21:01:43] <mathiaz> Today's agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting [21:02:08] * ogra_cmpc lurks a bit [21:02:42] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Review ACTION points from previous meeting. [21:02:56] <mathiaz> Previous meeting logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/20080213 [21:03:47] <mathiaz> I think most of the actions listed have been done or will discussed later in the meeting. [21:04:48] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Reporting / role of the meeting [21:05:16] <mathiaz> I've noticed that the last two meetings were long [21:05:24] <mathiaz> more than 1 hour. [21:05:37] <mathiaz> I'd like to keep the meeting under an hour. [21:05:49] <zul> agreed [21:05:58] <mathiaz> Looking through the logs, I think we're spending a lot of time giving status reports [21:06:27] <mathiaz> The reason why I'm leading the meeting in that direction is to get reports from everyone [21:06:39] <mathiaz> to know what's been done in the server team [21:06:58] <mathiaz> so that we have something to put in the monthly report [21:07:22] <mathiaz> It's also a way to keep track of which features have been implemented so that we can put them in the release notes. [21:08:10] <mathiaz> IIRC the IRC meeting of ubuntu-dev ran into the same problem once the team started to grow. [21:08:35] <mathiaz> so I'd like to change how we keep track of what we're doing. [21:09:46] <mathiaz> I'm thinking about sending the agenda whith the reminder of the meeting [21:10:26] <soren> You usually send that out on Tuesdays, right? [21:10:30] <mathiaz> whith a list of points requiring a status report [21:10:36] <mathiaz> soren: yes - one day before the meeting [21:10:44] <sommer> I was just thinking that maybe instead of doing reports at the meeting we could reply to your meetings notes email when action items are complete/updated [21:11:26] <sommer> or meeting minutes email rather [21:11:34] <ivoks> we should do that before the meeting, cause issues could arise that would need more heads [21:11:49] <nealmcb> the monthly reports show up at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports [21:12:43] <mathiaz> sommer: right - but I'd rather take a more proactive approache and ask people about what they're doing. [21:12:54] <nijaba> I think we could start the meeting with a quick post of the completed action, and see why the ones outstanding are still there... [21:13:13] <sommer> mathiaz: sure, just my thought [21:13:17] <mathiaz> ivoks: agreed. I think that having the agenda in the meeting announcement would help. [21:14:12] <ivoks> but only reports [21:14:23] <mathiaz> Another option is to ask people to put their status report in the agenda wiki page before the meeting [21:14:33] <ivoks> and if someone want to disscuss it, reply to the mail with a request for disscussion [21:14:44] <mathiaz> this is how the ubuntu dev team was doing [21:14:53] <ivoks> it would be bad if mailing list turns into the meeting [21:15:22] <mathiaz> ivoks: correct. [21:15:28] <ivoks> mathiaz: i think that would be much better approach [21:15:33] <ivoks> with the wiki [21:15:49] <sommer> yep, wiki is a better idea :) [21:16:02] <mathiaz> ivoks: that's what the ubuntu dev team used for some time (until it didn't scale any more) [21:16:22] <nijaba> not there yet, I guess... [21:16:34] <mathiaz> nijaba: for the server team, not there. [21:16:57] <soren> ubuntu-dev managed until we reached about 30.. [21:17:15] <soren> So some day, maybe :) [21:17:27] <mathiaz> nijaba: but we've already reach the point where doing a round table for status report during a meeting isn't practicle anymore [21:17:43] <nijaba> mathiaz: agreed [21:17:55] <nijaba> and +1 for the wiki proposal [21:18:12] <mathiaz> So - I'll change the meeting annoucement asking people to update a wiki page with the status of their task [21:18:42] <nijaba> we just need to find a volunteer to update the wiki with actions from the previous week [21:19:14] <mathiaz> I'll take care of updating the wiki page and nagging people to give a status update. [21:19:26] <mathiaz> s/updating/coordinating/ [21:19:32] <nijaba> mathiaz: \o/ [21:20:17] <mathiaz> ACTION: mathiaz to coordinate status reporting via a wiki page. [21:20:28] <mathiaz> [ACTION] mathiaz to coordinate status reporting via a wiki page. [21:20:33] * soren hugs mathiaz [21:20:40] <soren> Awesome! [21:20:42] * nijaba hugs mathiaz too [21:20:48] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Mentoring program [21:21:04] <mathiaz> So I've been thinking about the mentoring program again. [21:21:30] <mathiaz> I've got another proposal - I'd like a really lightweight program. [21:21:57] <mathiaz> To restate, the target population is people that want to contribute to ubuntu but don't know how. [21:22:26] <nealmcb> or don't know how much fun it is :-) [21:22:26] <mathiaz> So I'm throwing the idea of having a guidance counselor rather than having a real mentoring program [21:23:18] <mathiaz> the idea being that potential contributor would get in touch with a member of the ubuntu-server team, they'd figure out how he could help the server team [21:23:47] <mathiaz> according to the user's interests, a simple task would be assigned [21:24:20] <nealmcb> how about sending ambassadors/recruiters to the loco team meetings on irc? [21:24:27] <mathiaz> and once the task has been completed the prospectiv user is out of the guidance program. [21:24:48] <mathiaz> nealmcb: sure - that's another approach. [21:24:58] <mathiaz> nealmcb: I'd put that in the recruiting effort task. [21:25:09] <soren> nealmcb: There's a *lot* of LoCo's. [21:25:15] <mathiaz> nealmcb: but I'd rather setup a program to help them getting on board. [21:25:17] <nealmcb> yup - it precedes what you're sketching out [21:26:06] <ivoks> ok, so... one simple task with guidance [21:26:16] <mathiaz> nealmcb: precedes in terms of workflow, but follows in terms of building the program [21:26:20] <ivoks> and after that? [21:26:36] <mathiaz> ivoks: well - it's up to the user to keep contributing. [21:26:55] <mathiaz> ivoks: by the end of the task he should have been in contact with the rest of the team [21:27:15] <nealmcb> mathiaz: yes - having a structure to help new recruits should precede getting recruits. soren: yeah. we could start with locos we have some connections with. E.g. I've made the pitch at my loco [21:27:27] <nealmcb> mathiaz: yes [21:27:27] <mathiaz> ivoks: and should know where to asks questions. [21:27:36] <ivoks> i see your point [21:28:07] <mathiaz> So any thought on this ? [21:28:16] <mathiaz> What could be a good name for the program ? [21:28:21] <soren> nealmcb: I guess that works. [21:28:32] <ivoks> 'Make your self at home' [21:28:46] <soren> 'Make yourself@home' :( [21:28:52] <nealmcb> ivoks: yes - a sense of connection and comfort about asking questions is very helpful [21:29:04] <ivoks> soren: make [21:29:05] <mathiaz> I thought of Guidance Counselor [21:29:15] <nealmcb> soren: it that the singularity approaching nearer? [21:29:17] <soren> ivoks: :) [21:29:55] <nijaba> mathiaz: sounds like Woopy role in Star Treck TNG [21:29:57] <soren> nealmcb: :S [21:30:06] <soren> nijaba: Haha! [21:30:11] <sommer> mathiaz: shouldn't "server" be in there somewhere? [21:30:17] <mathiaz> ok. So I'll send an email to ubuntu-server with this new proposal to get some feedback. [21:30:32] <nealmcb> soren: looks like an alien/evolved smile to me.... [21:30:32] <mathiaz> sommer: yes. [21:30:51] <sommer> server woopy? [21:31:02] <mathiaz> [ACTION] mathiaz to send a proposal to ubuntu-server about the mentoring program [21:31:30] <mathiaz> ok - that's all from me about the way the server team works and could grow :) [21:31:42] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] bacula status [21:31:48] <ivoks> eh... [21:31:51] * ivoks steps out, in front of the crew, with tears in his eyes... [21:31:57] <soren> nealmcb: That's what I was trying to do, so great! :) [21:32:14] <ivoks> i'm sorry, it took to long, i had to work on some other things in life [21:32:29] <mathiaz> ivoks: are you still working on it ? [21:32:29] <nijaba> ivoks: we know you did your best [21:32:43] <ivoks> but big part is done and i promise new bacula will be uploaded in 3-4 days [21:32:48] <mathiaz> ivoks: we could always to get FF exception [21:32:52] <ivoks> let's say 99% is done [21:33:08] <ivoks> i just wanted to clear this sqlite dilema [21:33:26] <nealmcb> ivoks: you've earned some slack many times over :-) [21:33:33] <soren> I forget... What's the sqlite problem? [21:33:52] <nijaba> ivoks: that should not be a pb for much longer [21:33:58] <ivoks> soren: sqlite binary isn't in main, and -sqlite version depends on it [21:34:23] <zul> uh..fun [21:34:30] <nijaba> soren: but I have been talking with doko about it [21:34:38] <nijaba> and it should not be a real pb [21:34:54] <mathiaz> ivoks: before uploading a new bacula in universe, you may wanna get in touch with the MOTU release team [21:34:54] <ivoks> i've stripped everything else, dbconfig, wxwidgets, qt, libjconv... [21:35:01] <soren> ivoks: What does bacula need anything but the library for? [21:35:03] <nijaba> since the only thing missing is the CLI [21:35:17] <mathiaz> ivoks: to make sure that the changes you're about to do are ok for FF or get a FF exception. [21:35:20] <ivoks> soren: it populates sqlite db with binary [21:35:30] <ivoks> mathiaz: ack [21:35:55] <soren> ivoks: Ah. [21:36:16] <ivoks> soren: or upgrades db [21:37:07] <ivoks> so, any plans to move sqlite to main? :) [21:37:07] <mathiaz> [ACTION] ivoks will get in touch with the MOTU release team to get an FF exception before uploading bacula to universe [21:37:19] <mathiaz> ivoks: it's already done. [21:37:31] <mathiaz> ivoks: or will be within a few days. [21:37:33] <ivoks> great [21:37:51] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Server Survey [21:37:54] <nijaba> mathiaz: well, should, once a good look has been given to it [21:38:06] <soren> The source is already in main, so it's usually not a problem to move the binary. [21:38:30] <mathiaz> nijaba: could give a quick update the server survey and this lemon thiggy ? [21:38:34] <nijaba> Ok, so Faulkes and I have been working on this survey [21:38:47] <nijaba> there is a first version running in LimeSurvey [21:38:58] <nijaba> I need volunteers to test it [21:39:08] <zul> remind me again whats LimeSurvey? [21:39:09] <mathiaz> nijaba: what is LimeSurver ? [21:39:23] <nijaba> I already found one bug in Limesurvey on some condition testing [21:39:28] <nijaba> limesurvey.org [21:39:43] <nijaba> a tool to produce and conduct survey [21:40:14] <nijaba> php based, won the Trophee du Libre this year, enterprise category [21:40:28] <mathiaz> nijaba: is this a web service ? [21:40:38] <nijaba> it is a web app [21:40:39] <mathiaz> nijaba: or an application you need a server to run on ? [21:40:58] <mathiaz> nijaba: where will you host the web app ? [21:41:12] <nijaba> it is on www.nijaba.info [21:41:25] <nijaba> but I do not want to open it to public there [21:41:37] <nijaba> so I have to issue accounts to volunteers [21:41:58] <mathiaz> nijaba: ok. So where will you host it when doing the "real" survey ? [21:42:18] <nijaba> discussing this with newz2000 ATM [21:42:22] <nealmcb> I'm a little unclear on the audience for the survey and what it is intended to accomplish [21:42:22] <mathiaz> nijaba: it may be interesting to use this tool in the Ubuntu community as a whole. [21:43:10] <nijaba> nealmcb: the goal is to gather as much feedback as possible from or user comunity in order to know what they are expecting from us [21:43:15] <nijaba> mathiaz: agreed [21:43:21] <nealmcb> and e.g. will the results be generally available, or just to the team, or what [21:43:59] <nijaba> nealmcb: I was thinking to follow the same path as alfresco did, but needs to be discussed a bit [21:44:14] <nijaba> nealmcb: not sure if all answers should be made public [21:44:17] <nealmcb> alfresco? [21:44:37] <nijaba> nealmcb: http://www.alfresco.com/community/barometer/ [21:45:00] <nealmcb> and how to get a good sampling of likely respondents [21:45:18] <nijaba> that will need some publicity... [21:45:32] <nijaba> I mean posting in forum, ml, etc... [21:45:42] <nealmcb> interesting link - thanks [21:45:49] <mathiaz> nijaba: right. [21:46:11] <nealmcb> e.g. covering both home/individual users, nonprofits, enterprises, etc [21:46:27] <mathiaz> So once you've setup a test instance you need to some volunteers to test the survey [21:46:38] <mathiaz> and the web app [21:46:39] <nijaba> it is already up [21:46:50] <nijaba> I am just waiting for 1 bug fix ATM [21:46:59] <mathiaz> nijaba: so you're just looking for volunteers ? [21:47:03] <nijaba> (actually trying to fix it myself) [21:47:11] <nijaba> mathiaz: pretty much [21:47:14] * sommer volunteers for survey testing [21:47:27] <mathiaz> nijaba: they should contact via email ? [21:47:36] <nijaba> that would be the best way [21:47:50] <mathiaz> nijaba: ok. [21:47:54] <mathiaz> Let's move on. [21:48:04] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Forums activity [21:48:14] <mathiaz> faulkes- is not available to join the meeting. [21:48:40] <mathiaz> He sent me an email stating that the sticky post in the Server Forum has been posted. [21:49:09] <mathiaz> And he is working with nijaba on the survey. [21:49:36] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Documentation [21:49:50] <mathiaz> sommer: I've seen some discussion on the server guide. [21:50:06] <nealmcb> http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=7 [21:50:22] <sommer> yep, mostly my misunderstanding about which directory we're developing in going forward [21:50:25] <mathiaz> I haven't answered on the thread, but it'd make sense to only have one branch to maintain the server guide [21:50:53] <nijaba> mathiaz: yes, it would. [21:50:56] <sommer> mathiaz: agreed [21:51:09] <nijaba> The MOTD feature request is surfacing again as well [21:51:41] <sommer> was there any decision on that? [21:52:05] <mathiaz> yes - The other problem is to install the serverguide on an ubuntu-server [21:52:11] <sommer> I think the instruction on viewing the docs from console is the right approach [21:52:21] <mathiaz> there isn't any ubuntu-server seed at the moment. [21:52:40] <mathiaz> sommer: agreed. but we need to install the serverguide on ubuntu-server [21:52:57] <sommer> mathiaz: sure, is it a size issue? [21:53:10] <mathiaz> sommer: more a seed issue I think. [21:53:10] <nijaba> so we should ask for a server-install and server-supported seeds [21:53:36] <nijaba> server-install for default install [21:54:05] <nijaba> server-supported to sort which package in supported are there because of server and supported for 5y [21:54:05] <mathiaz> nijaba: right - server-supported is server-ship I think. [21:54:26] <nijaba> mathiaz: not in cjwatson point of view, AFAIK [21:54:27] <mathiaz> the default install for ubuntu-server is the ubuntu-standard seed. [21:54:32] <nealmcb> Interesting sticky server post from last year about the ubuntu "mindset" for server security (vs the "windows mindset"), might inspire some documentation (or be worth improving on - I haven't read it yet): http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=510812 [21:55:17] <mathiaz> nijaba: it may worth to review the seed state then. I think he started to reorganize them. [21:55:35] <nijaba> mathiaz: I think so too [21:55:38] <sommer> nealmcb: cool, I'll take a look [21:56:36] <mathiaz> So to keep things moving - I won't do the Roadmap review. [21:56:45] <nealmcb> sommer: :-) [21:56:48] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Any Other Business [21:57:20] <sommer> ebox status? [21:57:23] <nealmcb> any more ebox updates? [21:57:24] <zul> just one eBox is looking better for Universe [21:57:24] <mathiaz> There is the Ubuntu Developer Week going on the whole week. [21:57:25] <nealmcb> :-) [21:57:50] <mathiaz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek [21:58:04] <nealmcb> zul: I.e. "only for universe"? or "nearly ready to push to universe"? [21:58:09] <nijaba> Great session by Soren yesterday [21:58:13] <soren> \o/ [21:58:31] * nealmcb missed it - oops! busy life.... [21:58:33] <zul> nealmcb: almost ready to push to universe have to get a second pair of eyes to look at it first [21:58:43] <nealmcb> zul: great - thanks! [21:59:00] <nijaba> zul: you'll have plenty of eyes next week I guess :) [21:59:15] <zul> oh I will, I can corner them as well :) [21:59:42] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Agree on next meeting date and time. [21:59:53] <mathiaz> same time, same place ? [22:00:01] <nijaba> o/ [22:00:07] <ivoks> ack [22:00:31] <sommer> o// [22:00:46] <ivoks> _o/ [22:00:57] * nijaba thinks that sommer tries to cheat [22:01:10] <mathiaz> Ok - granted. Thanks all for coming. [22:01:14] <sommer> it's my happy pose [22:01:19] <nijaba> :) [22:01:22] <ogra_cmpc> nijaba, he's clapping hands [22:01:30] <mathiaz> #endmeeting