2011-02-24

2011-02-24 Meeting Minutes

Old Business

  • Old business
    • Xubuntu marketing plans - carried forward
    • We need to start either a ML item or webpage item for marketing - Done
      • knome is working hard on this very topic, and his efforts are very much appreciated
      • We now have a wiki page going, even if the wiki is hard to work with at this time. It is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Marketing

  • ochosi and mr_pouit will change panel launchers to generic icons - Done
  • ochosi and knome will put together some logo designs to be discussed as the menu icon - carried forward
  • ask knome to do some drafts with a grey background and a black background - carried forward
  • knome is to set up a tele-conference of some type to discuss marketing - carried forward
  • we need someone to update the slideshows displayed during the installation, they are badly outdated (they were made for karmic or lucid) - carried forward

Team updates

Packaging & Development

  • More syncs from debian experimental
  • Fixed xfce4-indicator-plugin to work with nm-applet and transmission (might be worth adding it by default to the panel, feedback welcome).
  • Fixed xfce4-notes-plugin to allow smooth upgrades (it won't be removed from the panel when upgrading to 4.8).
  • Patched update-manager to be able to restart without gnome-session (https://launchpad.net/bugs/530161).

  • micahg packaged and uploaded gmusicbrowser 1.1.6. (had some help from quadrispro with gmusicbrowser)
  • [ACTION] add xfce4-indicator-plugin to panel
  • remove cpugraph

Bug Triage & Testing

  • we are testing starting tuesday for alpha3.
  • We need some testers and a new testing lead, if anyone is interested
  • We need to have some more people looking at Natty, so we can get the feedback to mr_pouit and ochosi in time for any changes needed.
  • We discussed bug reporting for Natty Narwhal. The number of bugs being reported seems to be quite low, compared to previous releases.

Website & Marketing

  • Suggestion from ochosi - it would be great if the first page would show the slideshow that is shown during installation.
  • canonical will be setting up a wordpress test install for us!
  • Added knome and pleia2 to the ~xubuntu-website team so we're all set to put a theme in there once we're ready (canonical will pull from bzr)
  • Give ochosi his own account on the drupal install so he can post news articles

Artwork

  • alpha3 will have all the artwork and theme changes

Discussion - Remote Desktop Viewer (Vinegrae)

  • It was decided that this could be dropped if space is needed on the CD. It is a nice addition to the menu for the users that do need it.

Discussion - PowerPC and Armel builds for Xubuntu

  • If no objections are received, PowerPC builds will be discontinued as of Natty Narwhal Alpha3.
    • Xubuntu has no PPC developers or testers, and requests have resulted in no responses.
  • micahg got the ok to ISO test arm

Any Other Business

  • We don't have the desktop switcher in natty
    • put workspace switcher back in the current configuration for natty
  • Next meeting is in one week, March 3, #ubuntu-meeting, at 19:00 UTC.
  • Meeting log

  • proposal we take up the strategy document starting in three weeks, a bit at a time, the meeting of March 10.

Action items for the 2011-02-24 meeting

  • add xfce4-indicator-plugin to panel
  • put workspace switcher back in the current configuration for natty

Carried Forward

Please see the previous log

Xubuntu Governance

The Xubuntu Council

  • The Council size should be 5 members, with one of them being the PL.
  • PL will have a vote in every voting in the Council, not just as a tie-breaker.
  • The 4 members in the Council in addition to the PL should be selected by the existing Xubuntu Contributors.
  • The appropriate Team Lead can be the tiebreaker in a vote, but only if PL is absent.
  • The council should *aim* to have balanced membership across the different aspects/teams of Xubuntu.
  • The council should be named/selected after every LTS release. Thus, every season lasts for 2 years.

2011-02-24 Meeting Log

Started logging meeting in #ubuntu-meeting

  • People Present:
    • micahg
    • charlie-tca
    • mr_pouit
    • beardygnome
    • pleia2
    • Sysi
    • knome
    • maco
    • ScottK

Started logging meeting in #ubuntu-meeting

[13:01:14] <micahg> o/

[13:01:16] <charlie-tca> wish I knew how to make that thing give me the correct times

[13:01:40] <charlie-tca> The full meeting agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings

[13:02:23] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Old Business

[13:02:31] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Xubuntu marketing plan

[13:02:55] <charlie-tca> knome is working hard on this very topic, and his efforts are very much appreciated

[13:03:35] <charlie-tca> We now have a wiki page going, even if the wiki is hard to work with at this time. It is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Marketing

[13:03:43] <charlie-tca> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Marketing

[13:05:39] <charlie-tca> Any comments on this subject?

[13:05:49] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] previous actions

[13:05:52] <charlie-tca> ochosi and mr_pouit will change panel launchers to generic icons

[13:06:08] <charlie-tca> This has taken place in Natty, and, to be honest, looks good!

[13:06:31] <charlie-tca> ochosi and knome will put together some logo designs to be discussed as the menu icon

[13:06:50] <charlie-tca> I don't seem to have either person here today, so this will be carried forward

[13:07:18] <charlie-tca> shimmer project to move items pertaining to Xubuntu to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu

[13:07:22] <charlie-tca> Action done

[13:07:40] <charlie-tca> and the rest, we did not do yet

[13:08:06] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Team updates

[13:08:17] <charlie-tca> Packaging & Development

[13:08:25] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: your turn

[13:08:31] <mr_pouit> okay

[13:08:40] <mr_pouit> * More syncs/merges from Debian experimental.

[13:08:47] <mr_pouit> * Fixed xfce4-indicator-plugin to work with nm-applet and transmission (might be worth adding it by default to the panel, feedback welcome).

[13:08:57] <mr_pouit> * Fixed xfce4-notes-plugin to allow smooth upgrades (it won't be removed from the panel when upgrading to 4.8).

[13:09:04] <mr_pouit> * Patched update-manager to be able to restart without gnome-session (Bug #530161, not uploaded yet).

[13:09:06] <ubottu> Launchpad bug 530161 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Restart is not supported if not using gnome session manager (affects XFCE & LXDE)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/530161

[13:09:16] <mr_pouit> * micahg packaged and uploaded gmusicbrowser 1.1.6. \o/

[13:09:37] <mr_pouit> That's all for this week.

[13:09:52] <micahg> well, had some help from quadrispro with gmusicbrowser

[13:11:15] <charlie-tca> Hey, that is a lot for this week

[13:11:24] <charlie-tca> Thank you very much for all your help

[13:11:54] <charlie-tca> and, yes, lest's discuss adding Xfce4-indicator-plugin to the panel

[13:12:21] <mr_pouit> yep, I think ochosi spoke with you about that

[13:12:36] <charlie-tca> As I understand it, it would use all the good things Ubuntu adds for indicators, and we still keep the systray for what ever does not use the indicators?

[13:12:44] <beardygnome> can someone give a quick overview of the plugin please?

[13:13:10] <mr_pouit> charlie-tca: that's it.

[13:13:12] <beardygnome> thanks charlie-tca

[13:14:05] <charlie-tca> The plugin, as I understand it, is similar to the indicator panel in Unity, it contains things like the volume control, easy way to get to mail, and that kind of thing.

[13:14:21] <mr_pouit> several applications we ship by default (pidgin, transmission&) don't show up in the systray anymore

[13:14:32] <mr_pouit> that makes them difficult to use

[13:14:40] <charlie-tca> It sits in the panel, next to the notification area, and allows us to more easily manage applications that are running

[13:15:13] <beardygnome> sounds like a no-brainer then

[13:15:22] <beardygnome> i take it this is 4.8 only?

[13:15:30] <charlie-tca> yes

[13:15:36] <charlie-tca> this is for natty only

[13:15:43] <mr_pouit> no, xfce4-indicator-plugin can work in 4.6 afaik

[13:15:50] <mr_pouit> but yeah, it's for natty only ;>

[13:16:10] <beardygnome> so i can't try it out on maverick?

[13:16:15] <charlie-tca> and, along with this, what about the cpu graph?

[13:16:36] <charlie-tca> yes, you can try it on maverick, by installing it your self

[13:16:36] <mr_pouit> and the good thing is that indicator-sound (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoundMenu) is able to call xfce4-mixer, and gmusicbrowser will be integrated in this menu also

[13:17:22] <mr_pouit> beardygnome: yes, the plugin is already available, not sure if it works fine (I submitted several patches recently)

[13:17:54] <beardygnome> mr_pouit: is it packaged for maverick, or do i need the source?

[13:17:59] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit has done a lot of work on the indicator applet, to get it to work right.

[13:18:12] <mr_pouit> charlie-tca: I think we can remove cpugraph also, as cody and you said a few weeks ago

[13:18:16] <mr_pouit> beardygnome: it is packaged

[13:18:46] * beardygnome fires up synaptic

[13:19:29] <charlie-tca> Okay, so we make the change and it becomes "panel + indicators - cpugraph"

[13:19:49] <charlie-tca> and if we really hate it, we can reverse it still, right?

[13:20:01] <mr_pouit> okay, I'll do that

[13:20:04] <mr_pouit> yes, of course

[13:20:17] <charlie-tca> heh, I haven't seen anything we really hated yet, though

[13:20:42] <charlie-tca> I just find the cpu graph disturbing, since it flashes lines up there on my panel

[13:21:16] <charlie-tca> [ACTION] add xfce4-indicator-plugin to panel

[13:21:27] <charlie-tca> Thanks, mr_pouit

[13:21:51] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Bug Triage & Testing

[13:22:02] <charlie-tca> a constant battle

[13:22:06] <mr_pouit> then don't do any cpu intensive task, and it won't display bars :P

[13:22:24] <charlie-tca> it does! it shows little lines that are hard to see

[13:22:49] <charlie-tca> hm, I guess I am whining now, huh Smile :-)

[13:23:15] <charlie-tca> We have hopes of keeping the bugs squashed down, and just keep working on them.

[13:23:31] <charlie-tca> As for testing, the images for natty are all broken today

[13:23:48] <charlie-tca> however, we are testing starting tuesday for alpha3!

[13:23:56] <charlie-tca> All help is appreciated

[13:24:08] <charlie-tca> We gang up in #ubuntu-testing for that

[13:24:26] <charlie-tca> any questions for bugs and testing?

[13:24:32] <mr_pouit> I didn't follow closely, but it seems to me that very few ne bugs are reported for xfce 4.8 in natty

[13:25:03] <mr_pouit> (or maybe they are all private by default so I won't get any notification unless I go directly on launchpad&)

[13:25:04] <charlie-tca> I have a done a bad job tracking them this cycle. I have to go look

[13:25:14] <mr_pouit> *few new

[13:25:28] <charlie-tca> I been hitting them pretty good, and not very many are valid more than a day or two

[13:26:03] <charlie-tca> It seems most issues get fixed fast this cycle

[13:26:34] <charlie-tca> and the ones that don't are the long term issues already reported

[13:26:50] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Website & Marketing

[13:27:03] <charlie-tca> Do we have pleia2 or knome?

[13:27:06] <mr_pouit> ok, thanks

[13:27:25] <pleia2> hey, real quick

[13:27:36] <pleia2> canonical will be setting up a wordpress test install for us!

[13:28:09] <pleia2> and vinnl added knome and I to the ~xubuntu-website team so we're all set to put a theme in there once we're ready (canonical will pull from bzr)

[13:28:28] <pleia2> hopefully that'll happen in the next few days Smile :)

[13:29:28] <charlie-tca> Yes!

[13:30:08] <charlie-tca> Suggestion from ochosi - it would be great if the first page would show the slideshow that is shown during installation.

[13:30:21] <charlie-tca> that would be for the website

[13:30:25] * pleia2 makes note

[13:30:42] <pleia2> once we have the demo site up we can experiment with this and other suggestions

[13:30:43] <charlie-tca> Of course, we need to update it first for Natty, which is not going all that great

[13:31:11] <charlie-tca> we also have: ask knome to do some drafts with a grey background and a black background

[13:32:05] <charlie-tca> I think that got forgot again, though

[13:32:14] <charlie-tca> We can carry it forward, too

[13:32:23] <pleia2> yeah

[13:32:31] <charlie-tca> The wordpress change is great, though!

[13:32:45] <pleia2> yes, very good progress, hooray for canonical sysadmins for their speedy replies! Smile :)

[13:33:00] <charlie-tca> Anything else for website and marketing?

[13:33:05] <mr_pouit> (another thing that got forgotten and needs to be carried forward: update the slideshows displayed during the installation Wink ;-)

[13:33:09] <pleia2> that's all I've got

[13:33:17] <charlie-tca> Thank you, pleia2.

[13:33:23] <charlie-tca> that is good progress!

[13:33:33] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: thanks for the reminder

[13:34:16] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Artwork

[13:35:11] <charlie-tca> Alpha3 will have everything but the new wallpaper

[13:35:51] <charlie-tca> ochosi wrote a news article about getting the artwork done. I will be forwarding to someone to publish, pleia2 ?

[13:36:03] <pleia2> charlie-tca: sounds good

[13:36:13] <charlie-tca> great!

[13:36:34] <charlie-tca> He also wants to write another one, about the great features of gmusicbrowser, which is now part of natty

[13:37:07] <charlie-tca> That, I think, covers artwork. Any questions/comments?

[13:37:35] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Discussion - Remote Desktop Viewer (Vinegrae)

[13:37:48] <charlie-tca> the question is: Why do include this in the menu?

[13:38:08] <charlie-tca> s/do/do we

[13:38:15] <beardygnome> where else would we put it?

[13:38:23] <charlie-tca> We wouldn't

[13:38:35] <charlie-tca> Do we need it as a default item?

[13:38:38] <beardygnome> we'd drop it as a default app?

[13:38:41] <pleia2> charlie-tca: sec, it looks like i can give ochosi his own account on the drupal install (I suspect wordpress will be an around natty release thing) so he can post himself

[13:38:43] <charlie-tca> yup

[13:39:19] <charlie-tca> pleia2: really? let's do that then

[13:39:31] <beardygnome> i use it quite a lot, but i guess it's a rather niche app

[13:40:00] <charlie-tca> I never used it, myself. I did not know it was even usable

[13:40:28] <beardygnome> yeah, works really well

[13:40:35] <charlie-tca> Is it better then to keep it, or to tell users to install it themselves.

[13:41:29] <beardygnome> if you're in a position where you need a remote desktop viewer, you're probably capable of finding and installing one

[13:41:59] <beardygnome> so i guess making it a default app is a waste of precious cd space

[13:42:35] <charlie-tca> We can afford it

[13:43:39] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: is "remote desktop viewer" something that we need to remove to free up space?

[13:44:57] <charlie-tca> I hope we ain t lost the devs again

[13:45:08] <charlie-tca> I need them for the next topic

[13:45:14] <mr_pouit> no, we can remove it if we want to, but it's not that big

[13:45:18] * micahg thought we were tight last time on the amd64 CD

[13:45:27] <charlie-tca> leave it if someone thinks it is useful

[13:45:41] <charlie-tca> hm, maybe we were

[13:45:54] <charlie-tca> we still have language packs though

[13:46:04] <mr_pouit> micahg: ah yeah, if we add the indicators, maybe we need to drop something else

[13:46:21] <charlie-tca> then we should remove the remote viewer.

[13:46:33] <mr_pouit> (I didn't exactly check the space remaining)

[13:46:47] <charlie-tca> heh, we might be oversize again

[13:47:25] <charlie-tca> desktop 64 is 683MB

[13:47:37] <charlie-tca> the rest got lots of space

[13:47:59] <micahg> well, won't we get some space back by dropping exaile?

[13:48:16] <micahg> gmusicbrowser seems a lot lighter

[13:48:18] <charlie-tca> yup, but we used it with gmusicbrowser

[13:48:28] <mr_pouit> yep, it will drop hal & co.

[13:48:31] <charlie-tca> so maybe we gain a bit again

[13:49:05] <charlie-tca> okay, so if we need to drop it, we do

[13:49:25] <charlie-tca> otherwise, we keep remote desktop viewer as a service to the users that do use it

[13:49:42] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] Discussion - PowerPC and Armel builds for Xubuntu

[13:49:44] <micahg> charlie-tca: also, with remote desktop viewer, in most cases, people will have internet access, so it's an easy install

[13:50:04] <charlie-tca> valid point

[13:50:47] <charlie-tca> PowerPC seems kind of dead for us, is it worth building daily images when we are not building the milestones?

[13:51:11] <mr_pouit> and the daily builds are either broken or oversized

[13:51:34] <micahg> well, I think powerpc has a lot of potential for xubuntu

[13:51:35] <charlie-tca> We keep it now because if someone decided to pick it up, it would be easier to fix then if it is not built daily.

[13:51:54] <micahg> apple abandoned them

[13:51:58] <charlie-tca> potential, but we have no developer for it, and no testing

[13:52:05] <charlie-tca> that is a liablility now

[13:52:33] <micahg> oh, hmm, well, I guess until it's fixed, it doesn't make sense to buidl the dailies

[13:52:51] <charlie-tca> We can't really tell anyone to use it, the way it is today

[13:53:10] <micahg> that's too bad

[13:54:06] <charlie-tca> Let's pick a timeframe, say by the time beta releases, we need someone actively on it or we stop it? Or do we stop now?

[13:54:58] <charlie-tca> I have asked in the ppc channels, on the mailing lists, and on ident.ca for help with it, and got no responses

[13:55:20] <Sysi> i think PPC generally lacks testers

[13:55:36] <knome> if someone provides me the hardware...

[13:55:39] <Sysi> for lucid i heard one kubuntu dev saying he's only tester

[13:55:55] <maco> probably harald or scottk

[13:56:08] <maco> oh wait, you mean lucid kubutnu on ppc?

[13:56:18] <knome> yes

[13:56:21] <maco> either nixternal or scottk is the only ppc user in kubuntu devel

[13:56:33] <maco> (one of the ssh's to the other's ppc box, i just forget which direction)

[13:56:34] <Sysi> TmT was earlier

[13:56:43] <ScottK> No. It's Tm_T

[13:56:48] <Sysi> (avoiding hilight)

[13:56:59] <ScottK> nixternal has a PPC box I sometimes use for build testing.

[13:57:03] <maco> ScottK: oooh

[13:57:32] <knome> charlie-tca, i need to go now, but just to get it in the logs: i'll get back to the voip-meeting planning before next meeting. we'll also provide the menu logo suggestions with ochosi before the next meeting.

[13:57:38] <knome> ta-ra! o/

[13:57:39] <knome> ->

[13:57:47] <charlie-tca> We had very sporadic testing during the maverick release cycle, and none during natty

[13:57:52] <charlie-tca> Thanks, Knightlust

[13:57:59] <charlie-tca> thanks, knome

[13:58:05] <charlie-tca> sorry, Knightlust

[13:59:43] <charlie-tca> I am thinking of it as a liablility, if we go through this cycle with daily builds, and no testing, at some point, a user is going to try to use it.

[14:00:43] <charlie-tca> We did put out the 10.04.2 images that way already. They seem to have been built, and are available for use.

[14:00:47] <Sysi> if somebody asks for it we could offer it to be tested

[14:01:31] <charlie-tca> We also have the question of building armel images for Xubuntu?

[14:01:59] <charlie-tca> I don't see it happening at this point, since we have to have committed testers

[14:02:03] * micahg got the ok to ISO test arm, just need to find out how

[14:02:55] <charlie-tca> Does that mean they will build a Xubuntu arm ISO, for testing?

[14:03:20] <micahg> charlie-tca: we can, I have the ok to take time to test it

[14:03:28] <beardygnome> i've got to go now, but will leave my client open so i can review the rest later.

[14:03:36] <beardygnome> no votes or anything coming up?

[14:03:38] <charlie-tca> thanks, beardygnome

[14:03:54] <charlie-tca> no votes, and the only announcement is the testing for alpha3 next week

[14:04:09] <beardygnome> thanks charlie-tca

[14:04:15] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: thoughts on stopping the ppc builds?

[14:04:16] <beardygnome> see you guys next week

[14:05:08] <mr_pouit> I don't have such hardware, and I receive everyday some "the daily is broken/oversized" mail :p

[14:05:10] <charlie-tca> for the record, I am for stopping that image

[14:05:59] <charlie-tca> okay, I will get the minutes out, and if no objections are received, I will stop them next week

[14:06:23] <charlie-tca> [TOPIC] any other business?

[14:06:30] <charlie-tca> open floor

[14:06:59] <mr_pouit> nothing! Smile :)

[14:07:15] <Sysi> i was AFK earlier, are we not gonna include desktop switcher to panel?

[14:07:43] <charlie-tca> There being no other business, we will have another meeting in one week, on March 3, 2011

[14:07:52] <Sysi> it can be confusing if user happens to press keys to switch desktop and nothing happens

[14:08:01] <charlie-tca> Sysi: missed that altogether

[14:08:16] <charlie-tca> We don't have the desktop switcher in natty?

[14:08:25] <Sysi> i haven't seen it in daily builds

[14:08:32] <Sysi> as default setup

[14:08:46] <charlie-tca> I thought it was in the panel, but maybe not

[14:08:53] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: did we drop that?

[14:09:09] <mr_pouit> yep, it's not in the current config

[14:09:48] <charlie-tca> Can we have it back, or is it a pain to make work now?

[14:10:14] <Sysi> it works great, just isn't in default config

[14:10:16] <charlie-tca> or do we need it because it is an advanced user configuration?

[14:10:33] <Sysi> we have multiple workspaces by default

[14:10:56] <Sysi> *i* think having it is easier

[14:10:59] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: can we put the switcher back, since we have multiple workspaces already?

[14:11:03] <mr_pouit> indeed, it works fine, so let's affect that to ochosi to work on that ;]

[14:11:11] <charlie-tca> Thanks

[14:11:38] <charlie-tca> [ACTION] put workspace switcher back in the current configuration for natty

[14:11:48] <charlie-tca> Thanks for bringing that up, Sysi

[14:12:07] <charlie-tca> anything else?

[14:12:42] <charlie-tca> Thank you all for attending this meeting.

[14:12:48] <charlie-tca> #endmeeting

Meeting ended.

Xubuntu/Meetings/Archive/Minutes/2011-02-24 (last edited 2011-02-24 22:09:19 by charlie-tca)